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Phil_D11102
I took a walk into Thatcham Town Centre to talk to the PCSO's about the crime in the area. I believe we had someone try to enter out back garden as the gate was opened, but our dog's barking scared them off.

Much to my "unsurprise" there was no PCSO's to be found, in contary to this article "http://www.newburytoday.co.uk/News/Article.aspx?articleID=17353"

If the police presence was not there to talk about the issue, no wonder there is an issue.
NWNREADER
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 22 2011, 12:42 PM) *
I took a walk into Thatcham Town Centre to talk to the PCSO's about the crime in the area. I believe we had someone try to enter out back garden as the gate was opened, but our dog's barking scared them off.

Much to my "unsurprise" there was no PCSO's to be found, in contary to this article "http://www.newburytoday.co.uk/News/Article.aspx?articleID=17353"

If the police presence was not there to talk about the issue, no wonder there is an issue.


Have you enquired why?
Phil_D11102
QUOTE (NWNREADER @ Jul 22 2011, 01:49 PM) *
Have you enquired why?



I would hope they would be out preventing crime, but to be honest I am not surprised they weren't there. In the past when I have reported crime to the police, and followed it up as on several occasions with the Thatcham Town Council, all I have received is a lot of talk and a letter saying they were looking into it. Suggestions to how to prevent crime such as a CCTV camera on Lower Way outside the Discovery Centre has been meet with it's either not our job, or it costs too much. When my car was last damaged, all I got was why don't I move it on to my driveway, which isn't big enought for two cars. Forget about us whose insurance rates keep going up.
NWNREADER
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 22 2011, 04:34 PM) *
I would hope they would be out preventing crime, but to be honest I am not surprised they weren't there. In the past when I have reported crime to the police, and followed it up as on several occasions with the Thatcham Town Council, all I have received is a lot of talk and a letter saying they were looking into it. Suggestions to how to prevent crime such as a CCTV camera on Lower Way outside the Discovery Centre has been meet with it's either not our job, or it costs too much. When my car was last damaged, all I got was why don't I move it on to my driveway, which isn't big enought for two cars. Forget about us whose insurance rates keep going up.


Answer is 'no', then....

sad you have such a negative perspective.......
Simon Kirby
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 22 2011, 12:42 PM) *
If the police presence was not there to talk about the issue, no wonder there is an issue.

Phil, I'm not unsympathetic as I understand how corrosive petty crime and AB are, but I don't think it helps to blame the police. Crime is a societal problem, it's not the fault of the police. It's a but like blaming chip pan fires on the fire brigade. I don't have a simple answer, but I'm sure that more police isn't it. Jobs, social justice, urban design, education, and inclusion are the fundamental issues.
Andy Capp
True, but don't say you will be there when you won't, which is what I think the OP was about.
spartacus
I blame the Council......
Phil_D11102
QUOTE (NWNREADER @ Jul 22 2011, 11:04 PM) *
Answer is 'no', then....

sad you have such a negative perspective.......


Since 2006 we must have called the Police out at least 25 times for crimes such as damage to our cars (5 times, of which one of them was written off), damage to the bus shelter (finally fixed with fortifed glass) to drunks and street fights.

When the opportunity arises to take part in discussions, I jump to take part. It's hard to remain positive when the main stakeholder in getting the community involvment so crucial to helping resolve the issue wasn't there to harvest the support it needs.

QUOTE
Phil, I'm not unsympathetic as I understand how corrosive petty crime and AB are, but I don't think it helps to blame the police


With the amount of calls we made, and the increase in crime in the area, you think that some sort of intitative from the Police would be mounted. I have volunteered for neighborhood watch, and other schemes only not to hear back from the Police. You think the Police would put pressure on the council to fund a CCTV camera that could cover a wide area, other than telling me to put one up on my property where it would only cover my property.

QUOTE
I blame the Council......


I hold the council responsible as well, as I have spoken to them on quite a few occasions, only to be fobbed off. They hold the money to put in a CCTV camera, but refuse to address the issue. Again, the last piece of advice I got was not to park my car on the street as it wasn't safe to do so. What should I do, remove my front garden at a cost of several thousand pounds to make room for two cars, which will just eliminate one element of the issue, or do the right thing and address the entire issue of the anti social behaviour and put in the right deterent.

So NWN Reader, why should I be so "positive", as the issue isn't being addressed, and the support from the quarters it should be coming from isn't coming. The only winners in this is the council still collecting council tax for services they don't deliver, and my insurance company.
Simon Kirby
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jul 22 2011, 11:42 PM) *
True, but don't say you will be there when you won't, which is what I think the OP was about.

Phil went on to blame the crime spree on the lack of police presence in the Broadway and it's the crime that would appear to be the underlying grievance I don't see how that's correlated with the no-show. I agree that if they announced they'd be there for a surgery from 10.00 to 11.30 yesterday then it's a bit frustrating to find them not there, but given what they do the most obvious assumption is that something important came up and they had to be somewhere else.
Phil_D11102
QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ Jul 23 2011, 08:53 AM) *
Phil went on to blame the crime spree on the lack of police presence in the Broadway and it's the crime that would appear to be the underlying grievance I don't see how that's correlated with the no-show. I agree that if they announced they'd be there for a surgery from 10.00 to 11.30 yesterday then it's a bit frustrating to find them not there, but given what they do the most obvious assumption is that something important came up and they had to be somewhere else.


Mr Kirby,

You are so far off target your not even on the map.

I am complaining about the lack of cooperation between the council, the police and the local community. I saw yesterday as an opportunity to again take part in trying to tackle the issue, but yet again to be frustrated by the lack of support.

My comment about the police not being there because they were out preventing crimes was cheeky, because to be honest I have yet to see any initiative by either the council or police to prevent these nuisance social order crimes. Sure, the police do perform drug raids, stop drunk drivers, etc, because these are the crimes that they are mostly measured on by central gov't. The nusiance crimes, the ones that affect the local community in terms of money, how are they measured in terms by central gov't, ASBO's?

I know that the Police are trying to do a good job with the resources, or lack of they have. However, the PCSO's are the one's more aligned with trying to resolve the nusiance crimes issue by maintaing a profile in the community, but weren't there in the Broadway as adverstised.

If you think I am blaming the crime spree on the lack of a Police surgery in the Broadway, you really don't think much of those in the community. The bottom line is I would of liked to of spoken to the PCSO's, but they weren't there so hopefully there were doing something of equal or more importance. However, again, this is not the first time I have been let down in support in trying to resolve an issue that is important in my little area of the world.
GMR
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 22 2011, 12:42 PM) *
I took a walk into Thatcham Town Centre to talk to the PCSO's about the crime in the area. I believe we had someone try to enter out back garden as the gate was opened, but our dog's barking scared them off.

Much to my "unsurprise" there was no PCSO's to be found, in contary to this article "http://www.newburytoday.co.uk/News/Article.aspx?articleID=17353"

If the police presence was not there to talk about the issue, no wonder there is an issue.





They probably got better things to do. wink.gif
NWNREADER
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 23 2011, 08:29 AM) *
Since 2006 we must have called the Police out at least 25 times for crimes such as damage to our cars (5 times, of which one of them was written off), damage to the bus shelter (finally fixed with fortifed glass) to drunks and street fights.

When the opportunity arises to take part in discussions, I jump to take part. It's hard to remain positive when the main stakeholder in getting the community involvment so crucial to helping resolve the issue wasn't there to harvest the support it needs.


With the amount of calls we made, and the increase in crime in the area, you think that some sort of intitative from the Police would be mounted. I have volunteered for neighborhood watch, and other schemes only not to hear back from the Police. You think the Police would put pressure on the council to fund a CCTV camera that could cover a wide area, other than telling me to put one up on my property where it would only cover my property.



I hold the council responsible as well, as I have spoken to them on quite a few occasions, only to be fobbed off. They hold the money to put in a CCTV camera, but refuse to address the issue. Again, the last piece of advice I got was not to park my car on the street as it wasn't safe to do so. What should I do, remove my front garden at a cost of several thousand pounds to make room for two cars, which will just eliminate one element of the issue, or do the right thing and address the entire issue of the anti social behaviour and put in the right deterent.

So NWN Reader, why should I be so "positive", as the issue isn't being addressed, and the support from the quarters it should be coming from isn't coming. The only winners in this is the council still collecting council tax for services they don't deliver, and my insurance company.



I'm not having a pop, I am stating it is sad when the police management structures orevent people getting a decent standard of service. I'd be even sadder if the PCSOs 'just didn't turn up'.
Strafin
I think you have to understand that the police force is made up of both left wing liberals who have no interest in anything other than defend anyone and their actions that they feel are are in a a minority; and the school bullies who wanted to continue picking on people once they had grown up. That is it. that is why there is no support from the force, and why people who have found themselves infringing on a minor law get the book thrown at them, and those who persistently offend face very little recourse. Take the law into your own hands is the best advice and when the filth turn up on your doorstep, give 'em he11 and they'll leave you alone. It's sad and not the way any of us want things to be I'm sure, but it's the only sensible way forwards.
NWNREADER
QUOTE (Strafin @ Jul 23 2011, 11:49 AM) *
I think you have to understand that the police force is made up of both left wing liberals who have no interest in anything other than defend anyone and their actions that they feel are are in a a minority; and the school bullies who wanted to continue picking on people once they had grown up. That is it. that is why there is no support from the force, and why people who have found themselves infringing on a minor law get the book thrown at them, and those who persistently offend face very little recourse. Take the law into your own hands is the best advice and when the filth turn up on your doorstep, give 'em he11 and they'll leave you alone. It's sad and not the way any of us want things to be I'm sure, but it's the only sensible way forwards.



You were a Councillor?
user23
QUOTE (NWNREADER @ Jul 23 2011, 12:28 PM) *
You were a Councillor?
Perhaps for UKIP or the BNP from his last statement.
Turin Machine

"They probably got better things to do"


Yeah like ride around with camera crews for the TV, showing off their extensive understanding of public relations. I would say "you couldn't make it up" but unfortunately they have !
On the edge
QUOTE (user23 @ Jul 23 2011, 12:39 PM) *
Perhaps for UKIP or the BNP from his last statement.


As the saying goes - none of that computes, really don't see how you've connected the post with these parties. Would you mind explaining?
Nothing Much
Not really sure which side of the fence to sit on here.
Over the last months more than a million pounds of car damage,has been caused,repaired and done again..
I have pages of local news... The police feel that a local estate is being demolished and local gangs are being moved.

No. It is a local anarchist type gang. Sorry Charlie Gilmour for the length of your time.
The 2 lads who kicked over a street bollard and sprayed on it like feral cats where well spoken white wasps.
I was asleep. Just heard the jokes.At midnight.

Strafin
QUOTE (NWNREADER @ Jul 23 2011, 12:28 PM) *
You were a Councillor?

Yes but I am not now and have my own opinions. I have them because of what I saw and was involved in during a 12 year political career.
Phil_D11102
Stafin is just giving what he feels is good advice, as it's usually a last resort that a person has to defend their property.

The facts are is that crime is rising, the Police are losing resources so will attend to those crimes which results dictate their funding.

It's now down to the local gov't/councils to find alternate means to assist the public in deterring crime with cooperation from the Police. These could be more CCTV cameras because they do act as a deterrent, more neighborhood wardens and PCSO's, and other schemes.

If it's council property being damaged, you can be sure it's in the NWN and it's gets investigated. If it's my car being kicked to ****, or a drunk rambling up Lower Way kicking bins and other things into the road puting road users at risk, it's not that important.
Biker1
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 24 2011, 08:46 AM) *
The facts are is that crime is rising, the Police are losing resources so will attend to those crimes which results dictate their funding.

I think you'll find that according to post 28 in this thread, crime is decreasing!
My reply of laugh.gif was treated with disdain.
Andy Capp
QUOTE (Biker1 @ Jul 24 2011, 09:39 AM) *
I think you'll find that according to post 28 in this thread, crime is decreasing!
My reply of laugh.gif was treated with disdain.

If the hat fits.
Biker1
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jul 24 2011, 09:40 AM) *
If the hat fits.

So whose "facts" are right?
Yours or Phil's?
Andy Capp
QUOTE (Biker1 @ Jul 24 2011, 09:42 AM) *
So whose "facts" are right?
Yours or Phil's?

Well, hitherto, yours and Phil's are an opinion, mine are facts.

Crime will fall and rise over time, but the trend is down.
Biker1
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jul 24 2011, 09:44 AM) *
Well, hitherto, yours and Phil's are an opinion, mine are facts.

No, Phil quite clerly states "The facts are is that crime is rising".
Andy Capp
QUOTE (Biker1 @ Jul 24 2011, 09:46 AM) *
No, Phil quite clerly states "The facts are is that crime is rising".

Without sources, it is merely a figure of speech; an opinion.
NWNREADER
As with many government target-led statistics, look behind the numbers.

Much crime goes unreported, to police or insurers. I do not know for sure whether crime is up, down or sideways, but the general state of affairs seems to me less 'good' than it was a few years ago....
Andy Capp
QUOTE (NWNREADER @ Jul 24 2011, 01:26 PM) *
As with many government target-led statistics, look behind the numbers.

Much crime goes unreported, to police or insurers. I do not know for sure whether crime is up, down or sideways, but the general state of affairs seems to me less 'good' than it was a few years ago....

Which is a fact of life. We all have 'short memories'. I also doubt (for example) paedophilia is a recent phenomena - that is to say, unreported crime is not a new thing.
NWNREADER
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jul 24 2011, 03:16 PM) *
Which is a fact of life. We all have 'short memories'. I also doubt (for example) paedophilia is a recent phenomena - that is to say, unreported crime is not we new thing.

I agree it is not new, but I perceive the threshold at which people report something is rising - either a belief 'nothing will be done', 'It is the way things are', or the impact on their insurance if the incident appears on stats (regardless of a personal claim situation).
Add the direction to the whole process the government policies provide and I think there is more evidence of downmarket (if not criminal in the narrow sense) behaviour.

What you say about paedophilia is a good example: parents used to know everyone in the area, and where their children were. The local 'D.O.M. was known by all, and avoided. Children knew he was not 'nice'. The dormitory community barely knows their neighbours and too many see it as someone els's responsibility to know what is going on. Certainly too few demonstrate the required knowledge of what the children are up to. Now the DOM has opportunity to operate and ends up putting fantasy into practice.......
Phil_D11102
QUOTE
POLICE have said that burglary is a top priority for Thatcham, after a spate of burglaries over the past few months.
Since June 1, more than nine homes and cars have been broken in to.
There were five incidents the previous month, eleven incidents in April and eight in March


I would say that if the Police is making burglary a "top priority", it would appear that they are concerned. Their concern would be due to an increase in the area.

What we are not hearing about, AGAIN, is the nusiance crime. These would be criminal damage such as vandalism, drunks roaming the streets causing mayhem, damage to cars (not break in's)

I would imagine the Police would put on their summer blitz to find drunk drivers and drug dealers, but again, what about the nusiance crimes which cause insurance rates to go up.

As I said, you would imagine the Police would want to discuss this, if they show up where promised.

Mr Capp, where are your sources?
Andy Capp
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 24 2011, 06:24 PM) *
I would say that if the Police is making burglary a "top priority", it would appear that they are concerned. Their concern would be due to an increase in the area. What we are not hearing about, AGAIN, is the nusiance crime. These would be criminal damage such as vandalism, drunks roaming the streets causing mayhem, damage to cars (not break in's) I would imagine the Police would put on their summer blitz to find drunk drivers and drug dealers, but again, what about the nusiance crimes which cause insurance rates to go up. As I said, you would imagine the Police would want to discuss this, if they show up where promised. Mr Capp, where are your sources?

Amongst other places, like the national news and political forums: the British Crime Survey.
NWNREADER
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jul 24 2011, 08:32 PM) *
Amongst other places, like the national news and political forums: the British Crime Survey.

BCS was a far better measure, as it took information from a range of sources - including Insurance claims. However, the likelihood of premiums increasing more than the value of the claim means many people do not tell their insurance company now either.

Only victims now how much 'victim' crime there is. Not sure how to ask all 56m of us........
Andy Capp
QUOTE (NWNREADER @ Jul 24 2011, 09:06 PM) *
BCS was a far better measure, as it took information from a range of sources - including Insurance claims. However, the likelihood of premiums increasing more than the value of the claim means many people do not tell their insurance company now either.

Notwithstanding bogus claims, which might help off-set some reticence. I do respect though, that crime status of any nature are of little comfort to victims.
Phil_D11102
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jul 24 2011, 08:32 PM) *
Amongst other places, like the national news and political forums: the British Crime Survey.



Try this to get a better figure: http://www.police.uk/crime/?q=Thatcham, Berkshire RG19 3RS, UK#crimetypes

Crime increased in the RG19 3RS area from Dec 2010 (71) to May 2011 (146). That sounds like double the figures to me.
Andy Capp
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 24 2011, 11:40 PM) *
Try this to get a better figure: http://www.police.uk/crime/?q=Thatcham, Berkshire RG19 3RS, UK#crimetypes

Crime increased in the RG19 3RS area from Dec 2010 (71) to May 2011 (146). That sounds like double the figures to me.

Yes, crime cycles.
Phil_D11102
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jul 24 2011, 11:43 PM) *
Yes, crime cycles.


No, I think you will find that this is reported crimes.
Bloggo
QUOTE (NWNREADER @ Jul 24 2011, 01:26 PM) *
As with many government target-led statistics, look behind the numbers.

Much crime goes unreported, to police or insurers. I do not know for sure whether crime is up, down or sideways, but the general state of affairs seems to me less 'good' than it was a few years ago....

That's my perception too. Facts, figures and statistics can all be massaged to produce the result that is desired. My own experiences and observations tell me that the situation has deteriorated.
Bloggo
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jul 24 2011, 11:43 PM) *
Yes, crime cycles.

Your debating style is very similar to Iommi's. Are you the same person??
Andy Capp
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 25 2011, 12:21 AM) *
No, I think you will find that this is reported crimes.

I know, but that doesn't negate my point. Crime goes up and down, especially when you take a narrow snapshot as you have done. Your point is based over 6 months and I can quite believe that crime over such a short window could grow. Not only that, we only have the figures for December 2010 to May 2011, we have nothing previous to compare with. The crime rise might be a 'normal' phenomenon for the first 6 months of a year.

My original point, which was regurgitated by Biker1, was based on crime over a decade or more. Most analysts agree that crime has gone down over the last 15 years, but whether it will remain there is another matter. Logic dictates that it must go up eventually.

I never sought to contradict you, but Biker1, with apparent mischievous intent, has confused the argument. wink.gif
Andy Capp
QUOTE (Bloggo @ Jul 25 2011, 08:52 AM) *
Your debating style is very similar to Iommi's. Are you the same person??

No, but I know him and don't like him. We share similar opinions on somethings though.
Andy Capp
QUOTE (Bloggo @ Jul 25 2011, 08:50 AM) *
That's my perception too. Facts, figures and statistics can all be massaged to produce the result that is desired. My own experiences and observations tell me that the situation has deteriorated.

Going by personal experience can be a good measure from an instinctive point of view, but it is flawed. Statistics can be presented to show any number of things, but that is why it is useful to understand the information presented. Statistics can me manipulated, but that isn't always for sinister reasons.

I would suggest that it is best to involve a number of sources before one starts to make one's mind up about things. People are notoriously fickle and are not always the best judge on any given experience or scenario.

The idea, so scoffed at on here - that crime has dropped - is based on many sources, be it from both governments (left and right), journalists, police, Crimewatch (and other such TV and radio programs), British Crime Survey, etc. But I do realise that this is of no comfort to people that have been a victim of crime.

My personal experience is that crime has got neither worse or better, but I have been fortunate that I live in a relatively peaceful area, although that could easily change at any time. I also think that one crime is one crime too many, but I think we should be prepared to put things into perspective through fear that we might otherwise unnecessarily create an atmosphere that need not exist.
Blake
I am with you Phil.

Even our local Police station is no longer open to the public; so what good is it in practice?

I have flagged up to our local councilor about cars blatantly parking on double yellow lines along the A4 outside the local Chinese take away. Ironically, this is just down from the so called Police station. She was no help whatsoever.

This really bugs me as the cars block the cycle lane when they park there and put me and others at risk.

WHERE ARE OUR POLICE?

"The only think needed for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing"
Andy Capp
QUOTE (Blake @ Jul 25 2011, 12:46 PM) *
I have flagged up to our local councilor about cars blatantly parking on double yellow lines along the A4 outside the local Chinese take away. Ironically, this is just down from the so called Police station. She was no help whatsoever.

Who is the councillor; name and shame I say? Maybe take some pictures of the miscreants and post them here? Perhaps notify the 'Green Meanies'?

The only thing I can think of is that with police numbers, they are only going to go down, not up, so this could just get worse. Although I suspect others might argue they have higher priority issues to deal with.
Phil_D11102
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jul 25 2011, 12:14 PM) *
Going by personal experience can be a good measure from an instinctive point of view, but it is flawed. Statistics can be presented to show any number of things, but that is why it is useful to understand the information presented. Statistics can me manipulated, but that isn't always for sinister reasons.

I would suggest that it is best to involve a number of sources before one starts to make one's mind up about things. People are notoriously fickle and are not always the best judge on any given experience or scenario.

The idea, so scoffed at on here - that crime has dropped - is based on many sources, be it from both governments (left and right), journalists, police, Crimewatch (and other such TV and radio programs), British Crime Survey, etc. But I do realise that this is of no comfort to people that have been a victim of crime.

My personal experience is that crime has got neither worse or better, but I have been fortunate that I live in a relatively peaceful area, although that could easily change at any time. I also think that one crime is one crime too many, but I think we should be prepared to put things into perspective through fear that we might otherwise unnecessarily create an atmosphere that need not exist.



I am not fickle. As I have said I have had a car written off through vandalism after they realised they couldn't steal it. Who is better off, my insurance company because they didn't give me what I paid for the car, and my rates went up. Also as I said I have called the police so many times about other issues I think they are tired of hearing from me. As for the council, how many times do I need to speak to them about getting a CCTV camera put up. They are more concered with their own internal party bickering to do the right thing and help out where the issues are. Sure you may live in a "peaceful" area, but I live on a road used by drunken moron who decide to do stupid things and it's me and the other residents who have to put up with it. If the council and police cared even a little bit they would be working with us to resolve the issue. But as seen last week, as usual, the help/coordination needed to start putting the problem right wasn't there. Next time I get a car damaged, maybe I take the council/police to court for fraud, as they take my council tax but don't deliver the service.

As for the stats, you can say what you want, but the facts are since December 2010 there has been an increase in reported crimes. Maybe in LaLa land where you reside, but for us "fickle" folks, its a reality.
Bloggo
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 25 2011, 03:08 PM) *
I am not fickle. As I have said I have had a car written off through vandalism after they realised they couldn't steal it. Who is better off, my insurance company because they didn't give me what I paid for the car, and my rates went up. Also as I said I have called the police so many times about other issues I think they are tired of hearing from me. As for the council, how many times do I need to speak to them about getting a CCTV camera put up. They are more concered with their own internal party bickering to do the right thing and help out where the issues are. Sure you may live in a "peaceful" area, but I live on a road used by drunken moron who decide to do stupid things and it's me and the other residents who have to put up with it. If the council and police cared even a little bit they would be working with us to resolve the issue. But as seen last week, as usual, the help/coordination needed to start putting the problem right wasn't there. Next time I get a car damaged, maybe I take the council/police to court for fraud, as they take my council tax but don't deliver the service.

As for the stats, you can say what you want, but the facts are since December 2010 there has been an increase in reported crimes. Maybe in LaLa land where you reside, but for us "fickle" folks, its a reality.

I have a lot of sympathy for you Phil and understand completely your unhappiness with the service the authorities have afforded you.
May I suggest an e-mail to Richard Benyon. May not have an immediate response however it will elevate your issue to the next level and be formally recorded at that level.
Andy Capp
QUOTE (Phil_D11102 @ Jul 25 2011, 03:08 PM) *
As for the stats, you can say what you want, but the facts are since December 2010 there has been an increase in reported crimes. Maybe in LaLa land where you reside, but for us "fickle" folks, its a reality.

Was this really necessary? I have not contradicted you, I have conceded that crime has gone up (albeit within a fairly small period of time). I only tried to explain Biker1's mischievous inclusion of another debate/argument. I went on to express regret for people who suffer from criminals.

Your complaint is to do with how crime is dealt with, it is almost irrelevant whether crime is up or down or not, if you are a victim, but to be frank, I now couldn't give a stuff about your problem.
Bloggo
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jul 25 2011, 03:33 PM) *
Was this really necessary? I have not contradicted you, I have conceded that crime has gone up (albeit within a fairly small period of time).

Actually you said that in your opinion crime had neither gone up or down.
You did endorse the virew that the"statistics" state that it has gone down.

QUOTE
Your complaint is to do with how crime is dealt with, it is almost irrelevant whether crime is up or down or not, if you are a victim, but to be frank, I now couldn't give a stuff about your problem.

What a pity that you had to say that.
Andy Capp
For heavens sake, can't anyone read!!!!

QUOTE (Bloggo @ Jul 25 2011, 04:05 PM) *
Actually you said that in your opinion crime had neither gone up or down.

Actually I said in my experience it is neither up or down! In terms of ASB, I find that goes in waves, as kids grow up they move on to other things.

QUOTE (Bloggo @ Jul 25 2011, 04:05 PM) *
You did endorse the virew that the"statistics" state that it has gone down.

In a previous thread I said that statistically, crime is down, BUT that is based on annual stats over many years. I went on to state that I could find it conceivable that crime has risen (especially over the small time scale noted). The post that Biker1 pointed to, doesn't really have any relevance here; it was a different argument.

QUOTE (Bloggo @ Jul 25 2011, 04:05 PM) *
What a pity that you had to say that.

It is a pity I am 'driven' to say that by people who don't read what is in front of them, then go on to 'accuse' me of living in LaLa Land! Even though I had fundamentally agreed with them on this thread!!!
Dodgys smarter brother.
"Excuse me Officer, I know you're busy what with crime rising and all, but can I delay you for a few minutes talking about a crime that didn't happen"?

"Now then sir, a crime that didn't happen you say? Hmm.., very suspicious. Hang on while I call Forensics, the Underwater Search team, Tactical firearms and the Dog squad "

"No officer, look, someone might have tried my back gate and my dog may have scared them away"

"That's serious sir, that is, come along now and show us where the burglar isn't anymore and maybe we can hear the dog not barking at him for a bit. That will give us a lot to go on. He'll be hanging by his heels in no time. If not we can fit up the suspect of your choice. Who do you fancy for it?, any little crims down your way?"

"no, you don't understand..."

"Oh but we do sir, just for you we will permantely station a police officer in your back garden. 'course you will have to feed him, and he'll need to use the loo occasionally, but we'll get a replacement to stand in for him while he's away. That should put an end to the matter and no mistake. Oh, and can you paint a giant letter 'H' on your lawn, only the chopper crew will need to come down for a wee as well from time to time. Hope all that helps sir, but we must go now as we were supposed to have attended an attack on the Moors and we're a bit late having been standing here dealing with you. Let's hope they haven't bled to death before we get here. Mind how you go"
Andy Capp
From what have read, the most effective way to get action is to group together. saying that, considering there are no elections due soon, I would imagine it would be even harder to get noticed at the moment.
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