How many empty shops are we aiming for in Newbury? Options

[sdm36]

Hello,

Has anyone actually counted how many shop / retail units and office units in the Town Centre are currently empty or unleased?

I can't help but notice after spending more money than I will ever earn in my life on a shopping centre, that :
a) it's half empty
b: the rest of town is half empty
c) there are almost more charity shops than normal shops.

Wasn't it Mary Portas (Queen of shops) who theorized that high streets with a larger percentage of charity shops were engaged in a downward spiral towards oblivion due to not getting full rates and rents for those premises.

Did NTC or West berks council consult on any of this information when they decided to approve the new half empty shopping centre.

I've read lots of drivel about how this development is going to re-position Newbury and other such management speak, without a single shred of hard FACTUAL evidence that this will be the case.
Is there any evidence?
Am I worrying about nothing or have we been totally sold out???
And has victoria park been fixed by the contractors yet?

Also with all these free parking initiative's leading up to christmas, doesn't that just mean the NTC and WBC are losing out on EVEN MORE income in these budget pushing times?

[Neil]

It's the ever-diminishing Kennet Centre which concerns me, followed closely by the number of charity shops appearing. I'm amazed that YMCA can raise enough revenue to pay the rent I would expect to be due on premises of that size on the high street, but I would still prefer a charity shop over no shop. I'm also wondering how Camps will fare, particularly one John Lewis "At Home" is up and running.

That being said, my proposal to update the Kennet Centre failed to meet with critical acclaim

[sdm36]

It's the ever-diminishing Kennet Centre which concerns me, followed closely by the number of charity shops appearing. I'm amazed that YMCA can raise enough revenue to pay the rent I would expect to be due on premises of that size on the high street, but I would still prefer a charity shop over no shop. I'm also wondering how Camps will fare, particularly one John Lewis "At Home" is up and running.

That being said, my proposal to update the Kennet Centre failed to meet with critical acclaim

Charity shops pay reduced rent and rates as far as I'm aware.

So the YMCA shop is able to operate, whereas say a shop like Next or Lime would find the rates and rent too expensive to trade for instance....

[massifheed]

a) it's half empty

Not true.

b: the rest of town is half empty

Not true.

c) there are almost more charity shops than normal shops.

Not true.

It's all very well to go on about facts, but it somewhat diminishes your argument unless you have your own to back up your claims.

[Biker1]

It's not surprising really when you add up the costs and risks of setting up retail in the high street.

Here's an example.
Just add up the costs or rent, rates energy etc. even before you have entered into your capital costs.

Quite a risk to take isn't it before you are breaking even, let alone into profit!

[factsonly]

Charity shops pay reduced rent and rates as far as I'm aware.

Reduced rates by 80%, rent full market value or whatever they can negotiate just like any other retailer.

[sdm36]

Not true.


Not true.


Not true.

It's all very well to go on about facts, but it somewhat diminishes your argument unless you have your own to back up your claims.

Nice One, tool!

Did you notice the first sentence I wrote:

Has anyone actually counted how many shop / retail units and office units in the Town Centre are currently empty or unleased?

Would I ask if I had counted?
Would a normal person with nothing to add to the conversation reply? Riddle me that...

[massifheed]

Nice One, tool!

Did you notice the first sentence I wrote...

Yes, it was somewhat strange given that you then said...

I can't help but notice after spending more money than I will ever earn in my life on a shopping centre, that :
a) it's half empty
b: the rest of town is half empty
c) there are almost more charity shops than normal shops.

Would I ask if I had counted?

I don't know. If you haven't counted the empty shops and the number of charity shops compared with regular shops then why would you say that you couldn't help noticing that Parkway was half empty, the rest of the town was half empty and there are almost more charity shops than normal shops?

There's no point in issuing a snotty reply, just because I was pointing out in the inaccuracies in your original post.

[user23]

I can't help but notice after spending more money than I will ever earn in my life on a shopping centre, that :
a) it's half empty
b: the rest of town is half empty
c) there are almost more charity shops than normal shops.

All of the things you say you have noticed aren't actually true.

There's two new shops opening, or recently opened in Northbrook Street. Have you noticed what they are?

[Vodabury]

Hello,

Has anyone actually counted how many shop / retail units and office units in the Town Centre are currently empty or unleased?

.......in these budget pushing times?

If you are pointing to the fact that there is a general economic downturn, then perhaps you have given the reason for your first comment in your second.

[John C]

For Park to many as for the rest of the town not enough as far as WBC is concerned or that is th impresion I get

[On the edge]

Must admit my own perception substantially differs from the original post. Strikes me that the town is much busier Saturdays at least.

I did wonder why some of the newer 'brand' shops had opened in Northbrook Street, rather than Park Way - but took a wider look and that seems to be the architectural concept - whole thing blends together.
Quite clever I thought. As is the open aspect, and buildings that have some architectural pretension.

New developments takes a while to get up to full occupation and now must be particularly awkward.

Friend of mine works in one of the Kennet Centre shops. She was a bit worried that trade would dip when Park Way opened. It hasn't happened and trade is actually up on last year, in her shop at least.

Charity shops; well at least that's better than boarded windows. Do have a vested interest - a Saturday pleasure getting a pile of cheap books I can leave on trains.

Only complaint I've got is that WBC and the developers have actually done a good job!

[bonnie]

[quote name='John C' date='Nov 14 2011, 09:24 PM' post='50171']
For Park to many as for the rest of the town not enough as far as WBC is concerned or that is th impresion I get
[/quot

HUH?

[NWNREADER]

Confused me, too...
I worked it out as - 'For Park (Way) - too many, As for the rest of the town, not enough as far as WBC is concerned; or that is the impression I get'. It seems to be a response to the title of the thread (How many empty shops are we aiming for in Newbury?), implying WBC want the shops empty (I think).


My answer would be 'None'.

[sdm36]

You're talking about Newbury yeah??

You'd think it's a different town from your replies.

The Lighting Shop - Bartholomew Street
The 8 Bells Cafe - Bartholomew Street
Boki's the florist - Bartholomew Street
The Octagon place nr the council building
Debenhams in the Kennet Centre
Out To Lunch in the Kennet Centre
Artifax in the Kennet Centre
Fat Face on Northbrook Street

+ 23 units in the new development

thats off the top of my head, I know for sure there are further empty units and offices up and down the high street.

Also I'm amused by the standard reply you've all trucked out: "Problem? What Problem? You're wrong!" Really?


Doean't Parkway have a capacity for 47 Units?
Of which 23 are empty?
Would you like to share your research massifheed?? I'm sure you have a plethora of worthy evidence to back up your marvellously argued opinion and I cannot wait to read it.


And the questions were:
Did NTC or West berks council consult on any of this information when they decided to approve the new half empty shopping centre?
If there was a study done into this then I want to see it released into the public domain.

And has victoria park been fixed by the contractors yet?

Which everybody ignored....

[sdm36]

There's no point in issuing a snotty reply, just because I was pointing out in the inaccuracies in your original post.

the post above contains the basis for my comment.

Where's yours, buddy?

[massifheed]

...I'm amused by the standard reply you've all trucked out: "Problem? What Problem? You're wrong!" Really?

I'm at something of a loss to understand the reasoning behind the aggressive nature of your replies. The only thing that I and one or two others have done in this thread is to question the accuracy of your original claims about the town centre.

Doean't Parkway have a capacity for 47 Units?
Of which 23 are empty?

If you look at the Parkway tenant map it shows most of the units as being either occupied, contracts exchanged, or in negotiations. There are a number of units available (15 by my count) and most of those look like very small units or concessions and I'm not all that suprised that they've not been taken yet. Neither am I shocked that they haven't waited until the entire place is let before opening. That would just be stupid. An SLI spokesman was quoted in a NWN article as saying that 80% of retail space has been let. That's pretty good going considering the current financial climate. Whichever way you look at it, it's not "half empty".

Would you like to share your research massifheed?? I'm sure you have a plethora of worthy evidence to back up your marvellously argued opinion and I cannot wait to read it.

Well, to be fair, it was you that posted originally with bold claims about Parkway being half empty, the rest of town being half empty and there almost being more charity shops than regular ones. I've only pointed out that that isn't the case. So it'd be nice to see what you have to back up what you are saying (especially regards Parkway and Northbrook street).

The only "evidence" I have is that which is freely available to all. Such as the Parkway tenant map. Also, I am in town most weekends and can honestly say that there are very few (perhaps two or three?) empty units on Northbrook street. Anecdotal evidence would appear to suggest that Northbrook street has been a good deal busier since the opening of Parkway. So, for the moment at least, the development looks like it's doing it's intended job.
The Kennet Centre may be a slightly different story, and I don't often spend that much time in that end of town. But empty units have been a staple of the KC for many years. In fact, I'm not sure that it has ever been fully let, and if we're honest, it's not a particularly nice place to shop, and it hasn't aged well. Perhaps if the owners had kept it looking smart and modern then more retailers would take units there. Also, as far as I am aware, Debenhams haven't moved out of the KC, but rather opened an outlet store. I'd be suprised if the KC really is "half empty".

And the questions were:
Did NTC or West berks council consult on any of this information when they decided to approve the new half empty shopping centre?
If there was a study done into this then I want to see it released into the public domain.
And has victoria park been fixed by the contractors yet?

Have you contacted WBC about any of this? Shouting about it on a public forum probably isn't going to get you any answers. You'd be better off directing your questions at those concerned.

[bonnie]

Confused me, too...
I worked it out as - 'For Park (Way) - too many, As for the rest of the town, not enough as far as WBC is concerned; or that is the impression I get'. It seems to be a response to the title of the thread (How many empty shops are we aiming for in Newbury?), implying WBC want the shops empty (I think).


My answer would be 'None'.

Thanks, yes all is clear now.Must have been having a senior moment

[user23]

You're talking about Newbury yeah??

You'd think it's a different town from your replies.

The Lighting Shop - Bartholomew Street
The 8 Bells Cafe - Bartholomew Street
Boki's the florist - Bartholomew Street
The Octagon place nr the council building
Debenhams in the Kennet Centre
Out To Lunch in the Kennet Centre
Artifax in the Kennet Centre
Fat Face on Northbrook Street

+ 23 units in the new development

This wrong again.

Debenhams are still in the Kennet Centre, there aren't 23 empty units in the new development and three in that list are cafes, not retailers.

You didn't answer the question about the two new shops in Northbrook street either.

[blackdog]

You're talking about Newbury yeah??

You'd think it's a different town from your replies.

The Lighting Shop - Bartholomew Street
The 8 Bells Cafe - Bartholomew Street
Boki's the florist - Bartholomew Street
The Octagon place nr the council building
Debenhams in the Kennet Centre
Out To Lunch in the Kennet Centre
Artifax in the Kennet Centre
Fat Face on Northbrook Street

+ 23 units in the new development

thats off the top of my head, I know for sure there are further empty units and offices up and down the high street.

There are, of course, empty shops around town - there always will be some turnover of businesses. From your list Debenhams are still in the Kennet Centre, Fat Face is empty because they have moved to larger premises in Parkway, The Eight Bells has been empty almost as much as it has been full since it ceased to be a pub (but I didn't notice it ever being a cafe).

Either way this list would be better under the heading 'Only eight shops available' than 'Half the shops are empty'. Not that either statement would be correct.

Doean't Parkway have a capacity for 47 Units?
Of which 23 are empty?

No - Parkway has a number of empty units, some of which have been let (I haven't counted) - and it has more units that are still being built (ie it does not yet have its full capacity - not surprising they are not yet occupied).

The town does have a large surplus of office space (since Vodafone moved out) - hence a trend to convert town centre offices into flats. The next big town centre development will probably be behind the west side of Northbrook St where several office blocks are to be demolished to make way for a couple of hundred flats (unless WBC can get their 'urban village' plan for the Market Street / Railway Station area off the ground first).

However, we are in the grip of the worst recession that has hit the country for almost 100 years - it is not at all surprising that some businesses are closing. What is noticeable, if you ever get out and look around other towns, is that Newbury is a boom town compared to many.

And has victoria park been fixed by the contractors yet?[/b]

Which everybody ignored....

I suspect that Victoria Park is unlikely to be fixed by the contractors (unless you count switching off the pumps). Things have gone so quiet on this issue that the inevitable assumption is that the survey has come up with the wrong answer - ie that there is no way of telling wether it was the pumping or the dry weather that caused the problems. If it had clearly allocated the blame on Parkway NTC councillors would have been rushing to get their names in the paper long before now.