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> Why do Armchair Anarchists think Raoul Moat is now a cult hero?
Irish John
post Jul 15 2010, 09:00 AM
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Those with far too much time on their Facebook twittering hands appear to be promoting a mentally unstable deadman to cult hero status. Facebook are refusing to delete said deadman's account. However despite Facebook's shameless self promotion (of which they need little anyway) why would a country get behind another pathetic gunmen in a long line of pathetic english gunmen? Would the same people be praising the Hungerford massacre had it happened now? Discuss...
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Jayjay
post Jul 15 2010, 09:35 AM
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These are not my views, just why I think, without reading Facebook, people have sympathy. The authorities were warned of his intentions before he left prison and did nothing about it. He himself asked various times for help and nothing was done. His girlfriend, knowing he hated police, made believe she had dumped him for a Policeman. The police were 2 foot away, with his gun pointed at his own head, when they tasered him and possibly made him pull the trigger.

It was awful to see a human being hunted down like a rabid dog but there is no black and white in this case. Mistakes were made yes, but at the end of the day he was a killer and his death by his own hand or a police marksman was inevitable.
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Iommi
post Jul 15 2010, 10:04 AM
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Hear, hear, Jayjay, I also feel this is not black and white. There is something about this that smells of c0ck-up.

I do feel for the policeman and (and his family) that was badly injured though.

Regrettably, I think this is something that has happened through time. Bad men turned into cult heroes. I remember a distasteful song some people would sing in the 70s about 'so-and-so' being 'our friend' because 'he killed coppers'.
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TallDarkAndHands...
post Jul 15 2010, 10:56 AM
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QUOTE (Iommi @ Jul 15 2010, 11:04 AM) *
Hear, hear, Jayjay, I also feel this is not black and white. There is something about this that smells of c0ck-up.

I do feel for the policeman and (and his family) that was badly injured though.

Regrettably, I think this is something that has happened through time. Bad men turned into cult heroes. I remember a distasteful song some people would sing in the 70s about someone being 'our' friend' because he killed coppers.


If the Police had not held press conferences every 10 minutes and ordered in armoured cars, the SAS, Tornado fighters and hundreds of officers to hunt down 1 man then perhaps he would not have this cult 'status'. They made him into Billy the Kid. You reap what you sow.
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Iommi
post Jul 15 2010, 11:01 AM
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Notwithstanding 24/7 Sky/BBC coverage.
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Good Boy Racer
post Jul 15 2010, 11:31 AM
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If you want my honest opinion to all this, i do feel sorry for him.

Now i don't think anyone is accepting him as a hero for killing a copper and his girlfriend, i'm not. Their accepting him as a 'Legend' because he managed to get away from the Police for a week in just one area! They are also feeling slightly sorry for him, because they know he could of got help, he could be in prison right now doing time for what he did, allowing the victims family to have closure because they know he is suffering in prison.

What amazes me from the Police is this... They did not even tell the family that he was coming out of Prison!!! The police knew he was a threat when he came out, it only took him 2 or 3 days to get a shotgun and do what he did!

He asked for psychiatric help months before it happened because he wanted to know if he had a problem and they declined!

Just another thing, when you get shot by a taser gun, the idea of it is to paralise you completely so no muscle in your body can be used. Did the taser gun really clutch his fingers which made him pull the trigger? Very much doubt that! Just remember we're talking about the Police and the Media here... Police work together and can hide information, not forgetting the media. They don't tell you everything you know.


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ossy1
post Jul 15 2010, 12:56 PM
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good boy racer perhaps you should actually take notice of the news. He did not kill a police officer or his ex he killed her partner!
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tim
post Jul 15 2010, 12:58 PM
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By shooting himself he has saved tax-payers a fortune . If Moat had been imprisoned for murder he would be serving a life sentence costing thousands of tax-payers money. No cult hero, just a dead murderer who has ruined the lives of the surviving familys of his victims.
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Rosewinelover
post Jul 15 2010, 01:10 PM
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They made him into Billy the Kid. You reap what you sow.

Totally agree with this.

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Good Boy Racer
post Jul 15 2010, 01:37 PM
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QUOTE (ossy1 @ Jul 15 2010, 01:56 PM) *
good boy racer perhaps you should actually take notice of the news. He did not kill a police officer or his ex he killed her partner!


Hehe, well like i said, the media dont tell you everything and they always gets mixed up. I was told the police officer lived with injury to his face and both partners got killed.





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Iommi
post Jul 15 2010, 01:53 PM
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QUOTE (tim @ Jul 15 2010, 01:58 PM) *
By shooting himself he has saved tax-payers a fortune.

Assuming he did, unaided, shoot himself.
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ossy1
post Jul 15 2010, 01:59 PM
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QUOTE (Good Boy Racer @ Jul 15 2010, 02:37 PM) *
Hehe, well like i said, the media dont tell you everything and they always gets mixed up. I was told the police officer lived with injury to his face and both partners got killed.
j

Perhaps you should actually read or watch the news yourself. They have never said she was dead. The police officer was shot twice as a result he has been blinded.


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Good Boy Racer
post Jul 15 2010, 02:15 PM
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QUOTE (ossy1 @ Jul 15 2010, 02:59 PM) *
j

Perhaps you should actually read or watch the news yourself. They have never said she was dead. The police officer was shot twice as a result he has been blinded.


OMG your right!


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Chris_At_The_Ret...
post Jul 15 2010, 03:47 PM
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Wasn't Moat related to Keith Chegwin?
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Jayjay
post Jul 15 2010, 05:29 PM
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QUOTE (Good Boy Racer @ Jul 15 2010, 12:31 PM) *
Just another thing, when you get shot by a taser gun, the idea of it is to paralise you completely so no muscle in your body can be used. Did the taser gun really clutch his fingers which made him pull the trigger? Very much doubt that! Just remember we're talking about the Police and the Media here... Police work together and can hide information, not forgetting the media. They don't tell you everything you know.


Police and media seem to be in agreement that a) he was tasered and cool.gif he shot himself. If the taser didn't cause him to spasm and shoot himself, you are saying the police shot him while he was incapable?
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ossy1
post Jul 15 2010, 06:03 PM
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QUOTE (Jayjay @ Jul 15 2010, 06:29 PM) *
Police and media seem to be in agreement that a) he was tasered and cool.gif he shot himself. If the taser didn't cause him to spasm and shoot himself, you are saying the police shot him while he was incapable?



Theory = you assume he was incapable because he shot himself? A person who has been shot is not always incapable. If he was tasered after shooting himself maybe it was to incapacitate him in order to move in and treat him.
After all if any of you paid attention to the media reports you are expertly commenting on you will note he did NOT die at the scene, he died in hospital. He was taken to hospital by an ambulance. They would have had to have been sure he was not in a position to harm them.

We can all speculate but none of us really know the answers. What I do know is one man is dead and two others seriously injured as a result of his actions. He is not a Hero.
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Iommi
post Jul 15 2010, 06:25 PM
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QUOTE (ossy1 @ Jul 15 2010, 07:03 PM) *
After all if any of you paid attention to the media reports you are expertly commenting on you will note he did NOT die at the scene, he died in hospital. He was taken to hospital by an ambulance. They would have had to have been sure he was not in a position to harm them.

He was pronounced dead at the hospital, but that doesn't necessarily mean he wasn't dead at the scene. It is all speculation at the moment. Although I know it would not have made a pretty scene, it seems odd they carried Moat with a blanket over his head if he were alive.
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ossy1
post Jul 15 2010, 06:34 PM
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QUOTE (Iommi @ Jul 15 2010, 07:25 PM) *
He was pronounced dead at the hospital, but that doesn't necessarily mean he wasn't dead at the scene. It is all speculation at the moment. Although I know it would not have made a pretty scene, it seems odd they carried Moat with a blanket over his head if he were alive.


Given that he shot himself in the neck perhaps to hide injury from the circling vultures maybe. However upon approaching him they still do not know he is dead.
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Chelsea Greg
post Jul 15 2010, 07:38 PM
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QUOTE (Chris_At_The_Retreat @ Jul 15 2010, 04:47 PM) *
Wasn't Moat related to Keith Chegwin?


I heard that too but can't find anything online. Can someone confirm this with a link?
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regor
post Jul 15 2010, 07:55 PM
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Re ossy 1 - various posts

Sir, your posts are a mixture of half truths, misinterpretations, obfuscations and conflations. I do beg you to be-gone, be-silent and nget you hence from this forum

I know you are alleged to be a police officer but I suspect you are a politician, spin doctor or some other kind of proffesional misinformer
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