Another executive member telling porkies Options

[Richard Garvie]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/console/p00dl...each_17_02_2011 - listen around 20 minutes in

Joe Mooney: "I've listened to Richard and I don't know what planet he lives on, but he certainly ain't living on the planet of West Berkshire."

Andrew Peach: "I suppose it's his job as an opposition politician to raise the issue, are services to this vulnerable part of society being cut too much, that's really what he's putting on the table, isn't it?"

Joe Mooney: "I'm not aware of these cuts he is talking about to this group of vulnerable people, we're investing more and more money, year on year, on these people."

Andrew Peach: "So the eight million pounds of cuts won't effect them?"

Joe Mooney: "No, and we've invested more and more money in adult social care this year. <TUMBLEWEED> There has been eight million cuts, eight million pounds of cuts at the authority."

Andrew Peach: "Why is there a growing number of over 85's?"

Joe Mooney: "I wish I knew the answer to that , becaue if we had the answer then we could address things in a different way. The whole issue here Andrew is that we live in a very affluent area and we have a lot of people that because of their affluence are paying for their services and then after a period of time their finance runs out and the local authority picks them up. Last year we picked up eight of these capital depleters, and as a rough idea, every four of these people we pick up is an additional cost of £100,000 to the authority."

Andrew Peach: "I've got to leave t there, thank you very much".

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Yet again, one of our local councillors lying through their teeth. How can he say he is not aware of the cuts to the vulnerable?

£2.2m cuts to Adult Social Care services, including the closure of five day centres and cutting funding to support groups.
£4.4m cuts through axing staf, including around 150 care and youth workers, with a further 20 care workers expected to go in the next few months.
Cuts to bus service and fare schemes
8.4% cuts to education budget, despite Richard Benyon saying that our education funding would be protected.
18.4% cuts to youth services budget.

The elderly, disabled, families and children. The most vulnerable people in society, and all of them being hit hardest by the council.

The £3.2m "investment" in adult social is actually paying off the £1.9m overspent in the current financial year, and allowing £1.3m to cover similar costs in the coming financial year. Councillor Mooney refuses to meet with families of service users or delay these proposals until alternative arrangements are made. But to deny that they are making cuts to Adult Social Care services is laughable.

[dannyboy]

Great - So can you explain, giving details of costings etc, what Labour would do instread?

[Bofem]

Joe Mooney: "I wish I knew the answer to that , becaue if we had the answer then we could address things in a different way. The whole issue here Andrew is that we live in a very affluent area and we have a lot of people that because of their affluence are paying for their services and then after a period of time their finance runs out and the local authority picks them up. Last year we picked up eight of these capital depleters, and as a rough idea, every four of these people we pick up is an additional cost of £100,000 to the authority."

I'm sure the extra eight old people feel much better knowing they're regarded as such a burden by WBC. Why such uncaring Joe? More media training needed perhaps.

[dannyboy]

Interesting comment from the other forum - The care workers will now be supplied by agencies after the council axed them. - from RG.

[Richard Garvie]

Great - So can you explain, giving details of costings etc, what Labour would do instread?

As you know, we did an excercise in November to come up with our own alternative budget for the current financial year. I've requested copies of the 2011 / 12 budget books etc so that we can again prepare an alternative budget for 2011 / 12, but I've been told that the information will not be available until the end of March.

We are trying to prepare a budget using last years budget books and altering the data to reflect what has been published so far for 2011 / 12, but obviously not all of the detail for 11 / 12 has been published which makes the task even harder. Joe Mooney is the chap who challenged David Rendel last September to come up with an alternative budget for adult social care. Mr Rendel declined, but I rang Joe up to offer my services. I was then told he would not facilitate me doing it because I could end up taking votes away from the Conservatives if I was to stand for election.

Joe Mooney / Keith Chopping: Feel free to let me access the information now so that I can come up with a budget sooner. Surely if it's in the public interest to see an alternative, you'd be able to facilitate this?

[dannyboy]

I'm sure the extra eight old people feel much better knowing they're regarded as such a burden by WBC. Why such uncaring Joe? More media training needed perhaps.

We need more humour in local politics. I think he should be asked about immigration.

[Richard Garvie]

Interesting comment from the other forum - The care workers will now be supplied by agencies after the council axed them. - from RG.

The council are axing over 100 care workers. Care workers will now be provided to patients via agencies.

[dannyboy]

The council are axing over 100 care workers. Care workers will now be provided to patients via agencies.

So no net loss then. Sounds a bit like the Tories jumping on the PFI bandwagon.

[Richard Garvie]

Typical of Richard Garvie to confuse the debate for Political purposes.

THE FACTS ARE, THE COUNCIL'S ADULT SOCIAL CARE BUDGET WILL BE £3.2 MILLION MORE IN 2011/12 THAN IT WAS IN 2010/11

The service is being redesigned to be more efficient, hence some cuts, but these are also accompanied by extra investments, which Mr Garvie conveniently ignores.

So the council are axing £2.2m of services such as day centres and funding to support groups. £1.9m of the investment is aimed at the current years overspend, so only £1.3m of this £3.2m "investment" is to be spent next year.

The council cannot hide from the fact that they are shutting five day centres, cutting support for support groups, failing to discuss the community operating these facilities and all Joe Mooney can say is that the £8m of cuts will not affect the vulnerable!!!

To correct his statement on the Andrew Peach show, he doesn't know what planet I live on because it's not Planet Jones!!!

£2.2m cuts to Adult Social Care key services (day centres / support groups etc.)
£4.4m cuts to staffing (150 of 180 job losses are care workers and youth workers)
8.4% cut to the education budget in West Berkshire
18.4% cut to the youth services budget in West Berkshire.

The fact is, these combined cuts dwarf everything else the council has done, so the vulnerable are paying the price of this budget.

[Richard Garvie]

We need more humour in local politics. I think he should be asked about immigration.

I think if the elderly and disabled are such a burden on the adult social care budget, he obviously doesn't understand the needs and demands of his portfolio. Maybe we should have someone with a bit more understanding and respect for the people concerned.

Capital depleters??? These are people we are talking about.

[dannyboy]

I think if the elderly and disabled are such a burden on the adult social care budget, he obviously doesn't understand the needs and demands of his portfolio. Maybe we should have someone with a bit more understanding and respect for the people concerned.

Capital depleters??? These are people we are talking about.

He has obviously go the same phrase book you use on occasion.

[Richard Garvie]

He has obviously go the same phrase book you use on occasion.

When have I ever reffered to people as capital depleters???

[dannyboy]

When have I ever reffered to people as capital depleters???

Didn't say you did. I said you both use the same phrase book when on the soap box.

[Richard Garvie]

So, DB. Is it right for Joe Mooney to say that he doesn't know of any cuts and that the vulnerable won't be affected by these cuts?

[dannyboy]

So, DB. Is it right for Joe Mooney to say that he doesn't know of any cuts and that the vulnerable won't be affected by these cuts?

You yourself have said that whilst the council is reducing its number of carers, the posts will be replaced by the private sector.

The bigger picture is what matters, not the fine detail.
Does it matter if the council or private sector are the employer? No.

[Richard Garvie]

You yourself have said that whilst the council is reducing its number of carers, the posts will be replaced by the private sector.

The bigger picture is what matters, not the fine detail.
Does it matter if the council or private sector are the employer? No.

He said they are not making cuts. He said the elderly and disable would not be affected by these cuts.

Day centres.
Support groups.

Two big cuts in his portfolio worth £2.2m, but he says they are not making cuts. Will people not be affected by the closure of five day centres or reduction in services provided by support groups???

[dannyboy]

He said they are not making cuts. He said the elderly and disable would not be affected by these cuts.

Day centres.
Support groups.

Two big cuts in his portfolio worth £2.2m, but he says they are not making cuts. Will people not be affected by the closure of five day centres or reduction in services provided by support groups???

Just a stab in the dark here, but could the private sector be stepping in again?

[TallDarkAndHands...]

Just a stab in the dark here, but could the private sector be stepping in again?

If the Private Sector offer better 'value for money' for the same services then the Council is doing right by tax payers. If not it would be a pointless and costly exercise. RG is a bit to quick for my liking to blame and criticise. He should hold fire, get the full facts and get his point across. With the number of posts and animosity he is showing its getting to the stage where you see an RG post and don't even bother reading it.... Its a rant rather than a reasoned debate.

[dannyboy]

If the Private Sector offer better 'value for money' for the same services then the Council is doing right by tax payers. If not it would be a pointless and costly exercise. RG is a bit to quick for my liking to blame and criticise. He should hold fire, get the full facts and get his point across. With the number of posts and animosity he is showing its getting to the stage where you see an RG post and don't even bother reading it.... Its a rant rather than a reasoned debate.

It is all to do with balancing the books - The private sector means local & national government can get things on the never never. Costs more in the long term but no-one cares about that.

[Richard Garvie]

It is all to do with balancing the books - The private sector means local & national government can get things on the never never. Costs more in the long term but no-one cares about that.

I care and so should you. We pay this money through taxes, so why shouldn't we want them to be spent effectively?

To reply to TallDarkandHandsome, I have spent months researching this issue. I met up with two families today, both in absolute despair about what is going on. I've spoken to at least thirty different families this week, and all of them are worried and upset about what is happening.

Once again Danny, is it ok for a member of the council and the portfolio holder of Adult Social Care to say on the radio this morning that there are no cuts being made to adult social care and the vulnerable people won't be affected???