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Newbury Today Forum _ Random Rants _ Second referendum

Posted by: newres Aug 6 2018, 06:58 AM

Itís coming.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/final-say-brexit-latest-conservative-mp-explain-speeches-second-referendum-a8477686.html%3famp


Posted by: SirWilliam Aug 6 2018, 07:43 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Aug 6 2018, 07:58 AM) *
Itís coming.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/final-say-brexit-latest-conservative-mp-explain-speeches-second-referendum-a8477686.html%3famp


FAKE NEWS!!! wink.gif wink.gif wink.gif Never let the facts get in the way of a good story. There again the whole sorry saga could just have been down to a miscount.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Aug 6 2018, 04:17 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Aug 6 2018, 07:58 AM) *
Itís coming.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/final-say-brexit-latest-conservative-mp-explain-speeches-second-referendum-a8477686.html%3famp


Dream on... Though it would be funny in a way when leave won again. What would you do as a matter of interest? Demand a best of 5?😂

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Aug 6 2018, 04:18 PM

Duplicate. **** 4g.

Posted by: newres Aug 6 2018, 06:09 PM

Weíll see my faux northern friend.

Posted by: SirWilliam Aug 6 2018, 06:58 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Aug 6 2018, 05:17 PM) *
Dream on... Though it would be funny in a way when leave won again. What would you do as a matter of interest? Demand a best of 5?😂


I would like to see remain win and then the leave brigade can justifiably cry foul and demand a third. In fact we could run it every eighteen months as a national pastime, bit like horse of the year show. cool.gif

Posted by: user23 Aug 6 2018, 08:24 PM

I think Jacob Rees-Mogg is correct in this video, and we should have a referendum on the final deal.

https://metro.co.uk/video/jacob-rees-mogg-suggests-holding-second-referendum-brexit-1739176/?ito=vjs-link

Posted by: Biker1 Aug 7 2018, 05:06 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Aug 6 2018, 07:58 AM) *
Itís coming.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/final-say-brexit-latest-conservative-mp-explain-speeches-second-referendum-a8477686.html%3famp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6-IQAdFU3w laugh.gif laugh.gif

Posted by: Strafin Aug 7 2018, 08:06 AM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Aug 6 2018, 07:58 PM) *
I would like to see remain win and then the leave brigade can justifiably cry foul and demand a third. In fact we could run it every eighteen months as a national pastime, bit like horse of the year show. cool.gif

Remain have won. Brexit no longer means Brexit whatever happens now.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Aug 7 2018, 05:07 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Aug 7 2018, 09:06 AM) *
Remain have won. Brexit no longer means Brexit whatever happens now.

What a cr0ck of sh1t. How have remain won? Its a case of may or may not ne a hard brexit and you certainly dont "win" anything without a vote. We had one and leave won. If we have another leave will win again. Remainers only follow remainer news....

Posted by: newres Aug 7 2018, 06:16 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Aug 7 2018, 06:07 PM) *
What a cr0ck of sh1t. How have remain won? Its a case of may or may not ne a hard brexit and you certainly dont "win" anything without a vote. We had one and leave won. If we have another leave will win again. Remainers only follow remainer news....

Well Rees Mogg and David Davies are on record as backing a second vote so hopefully weíll get a chance to vote on the deal.

Whatís become clear is thereís no negotiation to be done and thereís no real deal to be had so in light of that we ought to get an ďare you really sure about thisĒ vote. Iím sure weíll still vote leave so I canít see a problem. The important thing is that we know what weíre voting for now.

Posted by: On the edge Aug 7 2018, 07:11 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Aug 7 2018, 07:16 PM) *
Well Rees Mogg and David Davies are on record as backing a second vote so hopefully weíll get a chance to vote on the deal.

Whatís become clear is thereís no negotiation to be done and thereís no real deal to be had so in light of that we ought to get an ďare you really sure about thisĒ vote. Iím sure weíll still vote leave so I canít see a problem. The important thing is that we know what weíre voting for now.


You are spot on about there being no negotiation. There hasn't been since day one. In negotiation terms the EU has maintained a take it or leave it stance. Commercially, when that happens only answer is to walk away and do something else. A real negotiating team would have come home several months back, and far from being 'nice' to EU Heads of State, that ends now surely?


Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Aug 7 2018, 07:36 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 7 2018, 08:11 PM) *
You are spot on about there being no negotiation. There hasn't been since day one. In negotiation terms the EU has maintained a take it or leave it stance. Commercially, when that happens only answer is to walk away and do something else. A real negotiating team would have come home several months back, and far from being 'nice' to EU Heads of State, that ends now surely?


Time for a bit of hard ball. Tell the germans we dont want german cars and the french can stick the champers, wine and cheese up there @rse. We have a lovely continental climate for vineyards now. Oh and lets close the channel tunnel.😂 Time to go all "Trump". Actually would have been better to do it 2 years ago. We may have got somewhere by now if we had.

Posted by: Biker1 Aug 8 2018, 05:11 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Aug 7 2018, 07:16 PM) *
The important thing is that we know what we’re voting for now.

Do we?
I'm unsure of the consequences of staying in!!
No one has explained that to me because no-one knows.
So either way do we know what we are voting for in the long term without a crystal ball?

Posted by: On the edge Aug 8 2018, 06:01 AM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Aug 8 2018, 06:11 AM) *
Do we?
I'm unsure of the consequences of staying in!!
No one has explained that to me because no-one knows.
So either way do we know what we are voting for in the long term without a crystal ball?


This is actually something that ought to be pushed and pushed hard. Certainly the scenarios I've heard aren't good and frankly rather disturbing. There is one worse alternative; going back. Now we've really seen and tasted the attitude a return would not be even worth contemplating.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Aug 12 2018, 11:13 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Aug 7 2018, 09:06 AM) *
Remain have won. Brexit no longer means Brexit whatever happens now.

Err yes, it does. Brexit means Brexit. Where do these people go to school?

Posted by: SirWilliam Aug 13 2018, 07:56 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Aug 13 2018, 12:13 AM) *
Err yes, it does. Brexit means Brexit. Where do these people go to school?


Strasbourg ? tongue.gif tongue.gif tongue.gif

Posted by: Strafin Aug 13 2018, 09:38 AM

The only person I have heard talk any sense about Brexit is Danny Dyer because the only facts are, nobody knows! There are people who voted for Brexit who would like a hard Irish border. There are people who voted Brexit who don't. There are people who voted Brexit and wanted to stay in the customs union and plenty who don't. They are all leave voters, they are not all getting what they voted for.

Posted by: newres Nov 18 2018, 08:06 PM

With every passing day, it gets a little closer. The irony of it all is that the ERG are making it more likely and Brexit less so.

Posted by: SirWilliam Nov 18 2018, 10:06 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Nov 18 2018, 08:06 PM) *
With every passing day, it gets a little closer. The irony of it all is that the ERG are making it more likely and Brexit less so.


So does xmas, but that doesn't mean everyone welcomes it's arrival. cool.gif

Posted by: Strafin Nov 19 2018, 08:58 AM

mellow.gif

I've changed my mind on the whole 2nd referendum thing. We shouldn't have one now, it's too late it's done.

Brexit is stupid, and already has caused so much discourse and hardship, and will continue to do so. There is nothing socially to be gained now, we are divided and the baby boomers have again messed everything up for everyone else. But we have let them, and so there is only one way forward. Get behind the worst prime minister we've had for years and get behind what is widely considered to be a terrible deal for everyone.

The only thing we have is damage limitation and a nod to trying to save a bit of the economy, only stability and certainty will encourage business to settle down and start to invest again. So that's what we need to do.

Maybe a general election after a leadership contest in the summer. Let the Mp's do it on their own time.

Posted by: newres Nov 19 2018, 09:26 AM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Nov 19 2018, 08:58 AM) *
mellow.gif

I've changed my mind on the whole 2nd referendum thing. We shouldn't have one now, it's too late it's done.

Brexit is stupid, and already has caused so much discourse and hardship, and will continue to do so. There is nothing socially to be gained now, we are divided and the baby boomers have again messed everything up for everyone else. But we have let them, and so there is only way forward. Get behind the worst prime minister we've had for years and get behind what is widely considered to be a terrible deal for everyone.

The only thing we have is damage limitation and a nod to trying to save a bit of the economy, only stability and certainty will encourage business to settle down and start to invest again. So that's what we need to do.

Maybe a general election after a leadership contest in the summer. Let the Mp's do it on their own time.

Well Iíd go along with that, but it ainít gonna happen according to the experts. She wonít get it through. Thatís why there will be a second referendum.

Posted by: dannyboy Nov 20 2018, 04:13 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Nov 19 2018, 08:58 AM) *
mellow.gif

I've changed my mind on the whole 2nd referendum thing. We shouldn't have one now, it's too late it's done.

Brexit is stupid, and already has caused so much discourse and hardship, and will continue to do so. There is nothing socially to be gained now, we are divided and the baby boomers have again messed everything up for everyone else. But we have let them, and so there is only one way forward. Get behind the worst prime minister we've had for years and get behind what is widely considered to be a terrible deal for everyone.

The only thing we have is damage limitation and a nod to trying to save a bit of the economy, only stability and certainty will encourage business to settle down and start to invest again. So that's what we need to do.

Maybe a general election after a leadership contest in the summer. Let the Mp's do it on their own time.



I do hope we get the full Hard Brexit.

Posted by: SirWilliam Nov 20 2018, 06:51 PM

QUOTE (dannyboy @ Nov 20 2018, 04:13 PM) *
I do hope we get the full Hard Brexit.


To be honest it is the only way if we are to have anything like a prosperous future. A federal Europe is a recipe for disaster and the halfway house as proposed by the (present) government will drag us down with it. The only reason the spineless twits in westminster didn't put in a letter of no confidence was the thought of opening the no 10 door for JC to stroll through and that was a worse option than allowing Mother T to carry on with her crap plan. The fact that Labour is even less electable than the Tories only shows what a useless bunch of retards we have in office. The only ones laughing at our dire position are Jean Claude Juncker and his associated cronies and it is humiliating to those who hold this Country dear. angry.gif angry.gif angry.gif

Posted by: je suis Charlie Nov 20 2018, 07:05 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Nov 20 2018, 06:51 PM) *
To be honest it is the only way if we are to have anything like a prosperous future. A federal Europe is a recipe for disaster and the halfway house as proposed by the (present) government will drag us down with it. The only reason the spineless twits in westminster didn't put in a letter of no confidence was the thought of opening the no 10 door for JC to stroll through and that was a worse option than allowing Mother T to carry on with her crap plan. The fact that Labour is even less electable than the Tories only shows what a useless bunch of retards we have in office. The only ones laughing at our dire position are Jean Claude Juncker and his associated cronies and it is humiliating to those who hold this Country dear. angry.gif angry.gif angry.gif

Don't try to switch dopes in the middle of a fix!

Posted by: newres Nov 20 2018, 07:14 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Nov 20 2018, 06:51 PM) *
To be honest it is the only way if we are to have anything like a prosperous future. A federal Europe is a recipe for disaster and the halfway house as proposed by the (present) government will drag us down with it. The only reason the spineless twits in westminster didn't put in a letter of no confidence was the thought of opening the no 10 door for JC to stroll through and that was a worse option than allowing Mother T to carry on with her crap plan. The fact that Labour is even less electable than the Tories only shows what a useless bunch of retards we have in office. The only ones laughing at our dire position are Jean Claude Juncker and his associated cronies and it is humiliating to those who hold this Country dear. angry.gif angry.gif angry.gif

I'm laughing too! The government are armed with the data and they know a hard Brexit will be disastrous. Do you honestly think they wouldn't do it if they thought it would be at worst neutral? They would be trumpteted as heroes if they could deliver it.

Posted by: SirWilliam Nov 20 2018, 07:43 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Nov 20 2018, 07:14 PM) *
I'm laughing too! The government are armed with the data and they know a hard Brexit will be disastrous. Do you honestly think they wouldn't do it if they thought it would be at worst neutral? They would be trumpteted as heroes if they could deliver it.


Bit like Cameron when he offered a referendum in the misguided belief that it would derail the supposed threat of UKIP? Yes they really do have their collective finger on the Countries pulse don't they. Face it, they are all incompetent; so why does Mother T want a soft brexit? Because she thinks that if it goes t**s up labour will sweep to power and spend the next 10 years telling everyone that it was the Tories fault we are in a financial mire. The great unwashed voted to leave and leave we must. In '74 over a third of the electorate voted no but I do not recollect them crying foul like a bunch of petulant school kids or asking for another vote; no, we got on with being a EU member and now we have decided that it is a club we do not wish to be a member of so we are ending our contract.

Posted by: newres Nov 20 2018, 07:59 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Nov 20 2018, 07:43 PM) *
Bit like Cameron when he offered a referendum in the misguided belief that it would derail the supposed threat of UKIP? Yes they really do have their collective finger on the Countries pulse don't they. Face it, they are all incompetent; so why does Mother T want a soft brexit? Because she thinks that if it goes t**s up labour will sweep to power and spend the next 10 years telling everyone that it was the Tories fault we are in a financial mire. The great unwashed voted to leave and leave we must. In '74 over a third of the electorate voted no but I do not recollect them crying foul like a bunch of petulant school kids or asking for another vote; no, we got on with being a EU member and now we have decided that it is a club we do not wish to be a member of so we are ending our contract.

The question is, what did they vote for? We were told the EU would give us an amazing deal because our market was so highly prized. People believed that. How many voted for a hard Brexit with WTO? How many had heard of it? It was too simple a question. Now I believe we have enough knowledge to make an informed decision.

That said, my preference would be TMís deal. But it wonít happen Iím guessing.

Posted by: SirWilliam Nov 20 2018, 08:23 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Nov 20 2018, 07:59 PM) *
The question is, what did they vote for? We were told the EU would give us an amazing deal because our market was so highly prized. People believed that. How many voted for a hard Brexit with WTO? How many had heard of it? It was too simple a question. Now I believe we have enough knowledge to make an informed decision.

That said, my preference would be TMís deal. But it wonít happen Iím guessing.


OMG the electorate need to know what they are voting for. laugh.gif I agree there was about as much information bandied about in the referendum as a food label on a Mcdonalds burger but the question wasn't "Do you want to remain and negotiate a better deal; or leave with an amended deal". No it was quite simple "Do you wish to remain in the EU or leave"? 17 million then decided they wanted to leave for probably as many reasons.

Posted by: newres Nov 21 2018, 06:39 AM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Nov 20 2018, 08:23 PM) *
OMG the electorate need to know what they are voting for. laugh.gif I agree there was about as much information bandied about in the referendum as a food label on a Mcdonalds burger but the question wasn't "Do you want to remain and negotiate a better deal; or leave with an amended deal". No it was quite simple "Do you wish to remain in the EU or leave"? 17 million then decided they wanted to leave for probably as many reasons.

And very nearly the same number voted to stay. Personally I would vote for Theresa Mayís deal. But the most likely outcome of MPs not backing it is another referendum or a GE. But I think there has been enough division.

Posted by: Strafin Nov 21 2018, 09:18 AM

Less than half the country voted for it, so we shouldn't even be at this juncture anyway. I agree about JC though, I really thought he was going to be radical and keep the pressure on. Whether you like him or not he offered a very different alternative. But now he just sits on the fence critcising.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Nov 21 2018, 10:03 PM

We're stuffed, options now are either a; no Brexit (with new social unrest, rise of ukip etc) or b; a no deal Brexit.

Posted by: SirWilliam Nov 22 2018, 09:14 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Nov 21 2018, 10:03 PM) *
We're stuffed, options now are either a; no Brexit (with new social unrest, rise of ukip etc) or b; a no deal Brexit.


What is wrong with a no deal scenario? Yes it's going to cause a headache for a few very quickly but life will continue won't it? I do not recall anyone saying at the time that we will be propelled back into the stone age if we leave; the simple truth is we don't know and we should just get on with it. Our biggest problem will not having political leadership at the helm of a pretty big ship.
To be honest with the increasing yob mentality in this Country Europe is probably secretly breathing a sigh of relief to see the back of us.


Posted by: spartacus Nov 22 2018, 09:22 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Nov 22 2018, 09:14 AM) *
.....Europe is probably secretly breathing a sigh of relief to see the back of us.
The Merkels, Macrons and Junckers of the EU can't wait to see the back of us but are secretly glad that we seem to have made such a spectacular balls up of the whole leaving process that we've frightened off any other nation that was thinking about following us through the door. Our weak and indecisive politicians have kicked the can and kicked it again and now we're in a mess we can't get out of without putting ourselves in the weak and pathetic position of asking for favours to allow us to stay in for a bit longer 'till we can sort it out'. I despair...

Posted by: je suis Charlie Nov 25 2018, 09:30 PM

Now the real fun begins.

Posted by: SirWilliam Dec 10 2018, 11:09 AM

So a couple of hours before the westminster pantomime kicks off we now know what the final outcome will be. Chequers deal will be voted out; Mother T will go back to Brussels and over a liquid lunch with Jean-Claude they will concoct "plan B". This in essence means a third plebiscite and as the majority of brexiteers have either given up or shot themselves in desperation the vote will fall in the no's corner. Tory backbenchers will mutter over their port, Liberals will howl for change in the electoral system and Labour will still be following JC having lost a golden opportunity to gain power. We will of course be grateful to all sane members of the European race and Federalism will ensue in time.
History will show it in a different light and academics will debate the issues for generations to come but by this time we will all be speaking German and the ice cap will have melted.
Good thing or bad thing? To be honest I haven't got a clue, (nothing new there), but it certainly has kept the art of conversation in vogue for the past couple of years. rolleyes.gif

ps. Merry xmas boys and girls.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Dec 11 2018, 01:09 PM

Express.co.uk: Remainer expat bid to plot to BLOCK BREXIT fails - 2016 referendum result WILL STAND.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1056896/brexit-news-eu-uk-withdrawal-agreement-brussels-referendum

Hooray! Democracy 1, Whingers 0.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Dec 14 2018, 07:06 AM

I have come to the conclusion that we should listen to the economic "experts" like Carney, Hammond and co and not leave the EU and ignore the democratic vote and revoke Article 50.

This does set a precedent though. These same experts also say that any Corbyn victory would seriously damage the economy. So if he did ever win a General election I would suggest it would be foolish to allow it to stand and we would have to just ignore the result.

Posted by: newres Dec 14 2018, 07:26 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Dec 14 2018, 07:06 AM) *
I have come to the conclusion that we should listen to the economic "experts" like Carney, Hammond and co and not leave the EU and ignore the democratic vote and revoke Article 50.

This does set a precedent though. These same experts also say that any Corbyn victory would seriously damage the economy. So if he did ever win a General election I would suggest it would be foolish to allow it to stand and we would have to just ignore the result.

Although ofcourse we can vote Corbyn out in 5 years. How about we have a trial leaving of the EU? But perhaps not the 50 years Mogg reckons it will take to know if it was a success? Or we keep Labour for 50 years?

Posted by: SirWilliam Dec 14 2018, 09:20 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Dec 14 2018, 07:06 AM) *
I have come to the conclusion that we should listen to the economic "experts" like Carney, Hammond and co and not leave the EU and ignore the democratic vote and revoke Article 50.

This does set a precedent though. These same experts also say that any Corbyn victory would seriously damage the economy. So if he did ever win a General election I would suggest it would be foolish to allow it to stand and we would have to just ignore the result.


Is this the reasoning behind the SNP's stance on a "free" Scotland vote? The Greeks chucked their fledgling democracy into the long grass because they didn't like the results it threw up and very little has changed in two and half thousand years. I still believe we will return to Brussels with our tales between our legs and say it was a bit of a mistake and could we possibly rejoin your gang? Jean Claude will open an expensive claret and welcome us back on the understanding our annual contribution is doubled in order to compensate those EU farmers/fishermen who have had a couple of sleepless nights over seeing one of their markets disappear but other than that "Bien sŻr vous mťchant personne vous"...........Or words to that effect. rolleyes.gif

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Dec 14 2018, 05:10 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Dec 14 2018, 07:26 AM) *
Although ofcourse we can vote Corbyn out in 5 years. How about we have a trial leaving of the EU? But perhaps not the 50 years Mogg reckons it will take to know if it was a success? Or we keep Labour for 50 years?

Elections should now be abandoned and we should have appointed economic experts to decide who should be in charge. The people can't be trusted to vote the "right" way. This is the future.

Posted by: newres Dec 14 2018, 06:41 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Dec 14 2018, 05:10 PM) *
Elections should now be abandoned and we should have appointed economic experts to decide who should be in charge. The people can't be trusted to vote the "right" way. This is the future.

Yes, itís undemocratic to let us vote on the deal.

Posted by: SirWilliam Dec 14 2018, 06:46 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Dec 14 2018, 05:10 PM) *
Elections should now be abandoned and we should have appointed economic experts to decide who should be in charge. The people can't be trusted to vote the "right" way. This is the future.


Appoint economists to position of power? You must be mad.........Bring back May/Corbyn even Cleggy, all is forgiven. laugh.gif

Posted by: Turin Machine Dec 14 2018, 07:21 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Dec 14 2018, 06:41 PM) *
Yes, itís undemocratic to let us vote on the deal.

You had a vote, it was called 'the referendum'. A second bite of the cherry just panders to the whining, democracy abusing losers.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Dec 14 2018, 07:28 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Dec 14 2018, 06:41 PM) *
Yes, itís undemocratic to let us vote on the deal.


Democracy is dying. You killed it. Better get used to it.

Posted by: SirWilliam Dec 14 2018, 07:51 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Dec 14 2018, 07:28 PM) *
Democracy is dying. You killed it. Better get used to it.


Going to be replaced by "Who can shout the loudest" . Seems one of your better ideas. smile.gif

Posted by: SirWilliam Dec 15 2018, 11:17 AM

So Amber Rudd has tossed what is, to the uninitiated, an approach that should have been adopted 18 months ago; that is an across the political board a common consensus on the UK's position. Now we all know JC would rather take up holy orders than get into bed, (metaphorically speaking), with Mother Teresa, so this is a non starter but as it is now 11th hour time any impasse in the House can now be placed at the descenter's door. Checkmate. Remoaners will demand we ask those nice people in Brussels if we can extend our "execution" until we have asked the great unwashed once more which will be "grudgingly" granted and next time we will vote correctly. (Silly electorate).

Put your house/ pension/ Uncle George's teapot collection on the status quo. cool.gif

Posted by: newres Dec 15 2018, 11:59 AM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Dec 15 2018, 11:17 AM) *
So Amber Rudd has tossed what is, to the uninitiated, an approach that should have been adopted 18 months ago; that is an across the political board a common consensus on the UK's position. Now we all know JC would rather take up holy orders than get into bed, (metaphorically speaking), with Mother Teresa, so this is a non starter but as it is now 11th hour time any impasse in the House can now be placed at the descenter's door. Checkmate. Remoaners will demand we ask those nice people in Brussels if we can extend our "execution" until we have asked the great unwashed once more which will be "grudgingly" granted and next time we will vote correctly. (Silly electorate).

Put your house/ pension/ Uncle George's teapot collection on the status quo. cool.gif

Norway model. Wonít that do you?

Posted by: SirWilliam Dec 15 2018, 01:28 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Dec 15 2018, 11:59 AM) *
Norway model. Wonít that do you?


I have given up on a position, so it's now more a case of where we end up and I can't see the Norway model being anything more than a means to an end and that is still being a card carrying member of the EU.

I may of course be completely wrong and everything in the garden will be roses. laugh.gif

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Dec 15 2018, 01:30 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Dec 15 2018, 11:59 AM) *
Norway model. Wonít that do you?

Have you given up on the #fbpe loons then?

Posted by: Turin Machine Dec 15 2018, 07:38 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Dec 15 2018, 01:30 PM) *
Have you given up on the #fbpe loons then?

Mate, gonna be a second referendum now. No way round it.

Posted by: newres Dec 15 2018, 09:51 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Dec 15 2018, 01:30 PM) *
Have you given up on the #fbpe loons then?

Iíve no idea what youíre talking about.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Dec 15 2018, 10:42 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Dec 15 2018, 07:38 PM) *
Mate, gonna be a second referendum now. No way round it.

What is the question though?😂

And I'll just leave this here...😂

https://metro.co.uk/2018/12/15/bizarre-moment-jean-claude-juncker-ruffles-colleagues-hair-eu-summit-8250517/








Posted by: je suis Charlie Dec 16 2018, 02:17 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Dec 15 2018, 10:42 PM) *
What is the question though?😂

And I'll just leave this here...😂

https://metro.co.uk/2018/12/15/bizarre-moment-jean-claude-juncker-ruffles-colleagues-hair-eu-summit-8250517/

Not all bad news however,
'Only 25% of voters thinks Jeremy Corbyn is decisive, according to a survey, down from 31% in October. The Labour leaderís fall to his lowest score at any point since the 2017 general election came despite most voters seeing the Tory party as divided following a week of Brexit infighting.

Corbyn also recorded his lowest score for being trustworthy and someone that sticks to his principles, according to an Opinium poll of 2,016 adults online on 13 and 14 December, falling below the prime minister."

Source, the guarderobe!!

Posted by: SirWilliam Dec 18 2018, 07:14 PM

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46600850

Reassuring to know that three and a half thousand troops will be on standby when we sever our umbilical cord from Europe without a deal. Like the profits of doom have predicted the sky will darken, shops will have no stock and children will be made to walk to school. All this is the fault of obtuse elderly residents being allowed to vote. Before the next election/plebiscite I propose that we restrict voting privilege to those over 5 and under 20; Liberals are of course exempt as their views are near as **** it to the new demographic.
Anyway with troops deployed to prevent the looting of the last cwt of wheat that has been set aside to feed the third world, we can now tuck into the xmas bird, (no pun), in the knowledge that it will probably be our last.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Dec 18 2018, 08:10 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Dec 18 2018, 07:14 PM) *
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46600850

Reassuring to know that three and a half thousand troops will be on standby when we sever our umbilical cord from Europe without a deal. Like the profits of doom have predicted the sky will darken, shops will have no stock and children will be made to walk to school. All this is the fault of obtuse elderly residents being allowed to vote. Before the next election/plebiscite I propose that we restrict voting privilege to those over 5 and under 20; Liberals are of course exempt as their views are near as **** it to the new demographic.
Anyway with troops deployed to prevent the looting of the last cwt of wheat that has been set aside to feed the third world, we can now tuck into the xmas bird, (no pun), in the knowledge that it will probably be our last.


Can't be too careful. Just let people who have #fbpe in there twitter handle vote. 🙄

Posted by: je suis Charlie Dec 18 2018, 11:08 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Dec 18 2018, 07:14 PM) *
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46600850

Reassuring to know that three and a half thousand troops will be on standby when we sever our umbilical cord from Europe without a deal. Like the profits of doom have predicted the sky will darken, shops will have no stock and children will be made to walk to school. All this is the fault of obtuse elderly residents being allowed to vote. Before the next election/plebiscite I propose that we restrict voting privilege to those over 5 and under 20; Liberals are of course exempt as their views are near as **** it to the new demographic.
Anyway with troops deployed to prevent the looting of the last cwt of wheat that has been set aside to feed the third world, we can now tuck into the xmas bird, (no pun), in the knowledge that it will probably be our last.

Yeah, but, there's predicted to be a shortage of Mars bars. So it's serious!

Posted by: SirWilliam Dec 19 2018, 09:29 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Dec 18 2018, 11:08 PM) *
Yeah, but, there's predicted to be a shortage of Mars bars. So it's serious!


Maybe, just maybe, you have put your index digit on the real reason behind the last 3 years of panic. By eliminating the confectionary availability we will reduce the obesity problem in our dear little kiddiewinks at a stroke.
Three cheers for our political elite says I. biggrin.gif

Posted by: newres Dec 20 2018, 02:53 PM

Gammon in Action.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/dec/20/anna-soubry-accosted-pro-brexit-supporters-hitler

Posted by: SirWilliam Dec 20 2018, 03:07 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Dec 20 2018, 02:53 PM) *
Gammon in Action.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/dec/20/anna-soubry-accosted-pro-brexit-supporters-hitler


Rentamob doesn't mind the cause as long as they can shout. Wheel a "spokesperson" in front of a tv camera and you can guarantee some idiot will be waving a placard behind them opposing the view. Just a big game to some but they may treat it a little more seriously if they lived in a Country that frowned upon public protest. Try that in China or Russia and see how much sympathy you get.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Dec 20 2018, 05:49 PM

You see, in the fevered little minds of the remoaner camp voting for Brexit automatically qualifies you as 'far right',. Really sad.

Posted by: Turin Machine Dec 20 2018, 06:01 PM

That there Toynbee is as bad, whining remainer:
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1061250/Brexit-news-UK-EU-latest-deal-vote-Theresa-May-far-right-Sky-News-row

Posted by: Strafin Dec 21 2018, 01:26 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Dec 18 2018, 07:14 PM) *
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46600850

..., we can now tuck into the xmas bird, (no pun), in the knowledge that it will probably be our last.


Christmas Dinner will be very different next year...

No Brussells!

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Dec 21 2018, 02:07 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Dec 21 2018, 01:26 PM) *
Christmas Dinner will be very different next year...

No Brussells!


They don't even have a leader...forced to resign by the on so militant Belgians!!!

Posted by: SirWilliam Dec 21 2018, 08:13 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Dec 21 2018, 02:07 PM) *
They don't even have a leader...forced to resign by the on so militant Belgians!!!


Ungrateful s*ds, we should ALL bow down in front of our leaders.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Dec 22 2018, 01:17 AM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Dec 21 2018, 08:13 PM) *
Ungrateful s*ds, we should ALL bow down in front of our leaders.

Especially (apparently) if you're a woman.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Dec 22 2018, 05:10 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Dec 15 2018, 09:51 PM) *
Iíve no idea what youíre talking about.

That means you are either..

A. A bit thick
B. Completely out of touch
C. Being obtuse

All 3 make you look daft. But that's your perogative.

Posted by: newres Dec 22 2018, 06:44 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Dec 22 2018, 05:10 PM) *
That means you are either..

A. A bit thick
B. Completely out of touch
C. Being obtuse

All 3 make you look daft. But that's your perogative.

Iíve since Googled it. There is another explanation. Thatís that Iím not as ďintoĒ the whole alt right v normal people as you. Out of touch I guess and glad to be so. You neo Nazi types get really into it.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Dec 22 2018, 06:54 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Dec 22 2018, 06:44 PM) *
Iíve since Googled it. There is another explanation. Thatís that Iím not as ďintoĒ the whole alt right v normal people as you. Out of touch I guess and glad to be so. You neo Nazi types get really into it.

And a happy xmas to all, Left, Right, so what. enjoy xmas with your families. I'm off till after the new year and I expect to pick up the thread then. Don't drink and drive.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Dec 22 2018, 08:01 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Dec 22 2018, 06:54 PM) *
And a happy xmas to all, Left, Right, so what. enjoy xmas with your families. I'm off till after the new year and I expect to pick up the thread then. Don't drink and drive.


And you sir my fellow Nazi.😂

Posted by: je suis Charlie Dec 23 2018, 04:30 PM

It's worse than we thought, Christmas will be cancelled due to Brexit! Oh No's!
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/dec/23/prepare-for-a-no-christmas-brexit-in-2019

The Guardian, spreading truth and happiness like a rat spreads plague! Project fear lives on.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Dec 23 2018, 06:33 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Dec 23 2018, 04:30 PM) *
It's worse than we thought, Christmas will be cancelled due to Brexit! Oh No's!
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/dec/23/prepare-for-a-no-christmas-brexit-in-2019

The Guardian, spreading truth and happiness like a rat spreads plague! Project fear lives on.


The guardian is about as balanced as the mail.

Posted by: newres Dec 24 2018, 09:42 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_MvZORkezA

Pure comic genius.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Dec 24 2018, 09:46 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Dec 24 2018, 09:42 PM) *
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_MvZORkezA

Pure comic genius.

Thanks you, have a nice Christmas.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Dec 31 2018, 11:17 AM

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6541687/Prophecy-Prepper-spends-thousands-food-axe-fears-riots-break-Brexit.html

Quote, " Mr McLean is single and has no children". Comic genius!

Posted by: newres Jan 9 2019, 07:54 PM

Nearly there.

Posted by: Strafin Jan 11 2019, 11:33 AM

Daily Mail though

Posted by: SirWilliam Jan 16 2019, 09:37 AM

So now we officially know what we knew anyway but it makes politicians feel "important". The left are still howling for the "people" to decide despite the glaringly obvious fact that it was a plebiscite that got us into this mess in the first place. General election?...And you thought it was bad now, but of course the mentally challenged will think that JC is the answer to a maiden's prayer and, like Zebedee, will bring order to the garden. Meanwhile the planet is still hurtling around the sun in time honoured fashion and a fellow called Trump treats his party guests to burger and chips.
Funny old world. rolleyes.gif

Posted by: je suis Charlie Jan 17 2019, 03:36 AM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Jan 16 2019, 09:37 AM) *
So now we officially know what we knew anyway but it makes politicians feel "important". The left are still howling for the "people" to decide despite the glaringly obvious fact that it was a plebiscite that got us into this mess in the first place. General election?...And you thought it was bad now, but of course the mentally challenged will think that JC is the answer to a maiden's prayer and, like Zebedee, will bring order to the garden. Meanwhile the planet is still hurtling around the sun in time honoured fashion and a fellow called Trump treats his party guests to burger and chips.
Funny old world. rolleyes.gif

I believe it was the spiritual guru Aisleyne Horgan-Wallace who said "You better know yourself little girl, before you talk to me that way"
She also said "We were on the breadline. We were below the breadline, we only had pasta". Wise words.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Jan 17 2019, 04:30 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 9 2019, 07:54 PM) *
Nearly there.

Where?😂😂

Posted by: je suis Charlie Jan 17 2019, 05:05 PM

Soooo funny this.

Comic genius from all sides, looks like political panto.

Posted by: SirWilliam Jan 17 2019, 07:34 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Jan 17 2019, 05:05 PM) *
Soooo funny this.

Comic genius from all sides, looks like political panto.


Would be non to pleased if I had paid good money to see them in the xmas offering. rolleyes.gif

One thing that does puzzle me however is the Green Party stance. Now we all know they would like us all to ride bicycles and sustain ourselves on nut cutlets but they are **** bent on rejoining the EU which only encourages a high carbon footprint with HGV's criss crossing europe unimpeded.
Least they have a plan though. cool.gif

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Jan 17 2019, 08:49 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Jan 17 2019, 05:05 PM) *
Soooo funny this.

Comic genius from all sides, looks like political panto.


Gove gave a good speech. Destroyed Corbyn. Mind you...that is a bit of an open goal.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Jan 17 2019, 09:34 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Jan 17 2019, 08:49 PM) *
Gove gave a good speech. Destroyed Corbyn. Mind you...that is a bit of an open goal.

Let's face it, Paddington Bear could destroy Corbyn.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Jan 17 2019, 09:46 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Jan 17 2019, 09:34 PM) *
Let's face it, Paddington Bear could destroy Corbyn.

Corbyn to May..

I want to talk about brexit
I want to talk about brexit
I want to talk about brexit.

May... let's talk about Brexit

Corbyn... No.

😂😂😂

Posted by: je suis Charlie Jan 17 2019, 10:07 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Jan 17 2019, 09:46 PM) *
Corbyn to May..

I want to talk about brexit
I want to talk about brexit
I want to talk about brexit.

May... let's talk about Brexit

Corbyn... No.

������

He'll talk to Hamas, Hezbollah and the IRA, but he won't talk to the Maybot. It's like when you're out in the country and you see a hedgehog on the top of a fencepost, you know he didn't get up there by himself, he doesn't belong up there, he doesn't know what to do while up there, he's elevated beyond his ability to function, and you just wonder what kind of dumb **** put him there to begin with.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Jan 17 2019, 10:59 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Jan 17 2019, 10:07 PM) *
He'll talk to Hamas, Hezbollah and the IRA, but he won't talk to the Maybot. It's like when you're out in the country and you see a hedgehog on the top of a fencepost, you know he didn't get up there by himself, he doesn't belong up there, he doesn't know what to do while up there, he's elevated beyond his ability to function, and you just wonder what kind of dumb **** put him there to begin with.

Newres???😂

Posted by: SirWilliam Jan 18 2019, 08:43 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Jan 17 2019, 10:07 PM) *
He'll talk to Hamas, Hezbollah and the IRA, but he won't talk to the Maybot. It's like when you're out in the country and you see a hedgehog on the top of a fencepost, you know he didn't get up there by himself, he doesn't belong up there, he doesn't know what to do while up there, he's elevated beyond his ability to function, and you just wonder what kind of dumb **** put him there to begin with.

You do not have to fool all of the people all of the time....Just enough to make you feel important. Of course the "yoof" love him because their brains haven't migrated from their underpants yet but it is a worry that, with the tories on their knees, the best the opposition can muster is a man who puts ideology before country.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Jan 18 2019, 11:21 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Jan 17 2019, 08:49 PM) *
Gove gave a good speech. Destroyed Corbyn. Mind you...that is a bit of an open goal.

See here! Brilliant!

https://youtu.be/WluyCXzpLsw

Posted by: SirWilliam Jan 18 2019, 11:59 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Jan 18 2019, 11:21 AM) *
See here! Brilliant!

https://youtu.be/WluyCXzpLsw


Excellent speech of a man who may well be in no 10 before the year is out. Corbyn's body language portrayed a man who has been in the sun too long.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Jan 18 2019, 12:25 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Jan 18 2019, 11:59 AM) *
Excellent speech of a man who may well be in no 10 before the year is out. Corbyn's body language portrayed a man who has been in the sun too long.

Note his front bench, looked like stunned mullets.

Posted by: x2lls Jan 18 2019, 03:18 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Jan 18 2019, 08:43 AM) *
You do not have to fool all of the people all of the time....Just enough to make you feel important. Of course the "yoof" love him because their brains haven't migrated from their underpants yet but it is a worry that, with the tories on their knees, the best the opposition can muster is a man who puts ideology before country.



Ironic that.

If you switch ideology and country in that sentence, you describe TR. wink.gif

Posted by: SirWilliam Jan 18 2019, 04:07 PM

QUOTE (x2lls @ Jan 18 2019, 03:18 PM) *
Ironic that.

If you switch ideology and country in that sentence, you describe TR. wink.gif


That's where the similarity ends; oh for someone who has leadership credentials.

Posted by: newres Jan 21 2019, 02:14 PM

QUOTE (x2lls @ Jan 18 2019, 03:18 PM) *
Ironic that.

If you switch ideology and country in that sentence, you describe TR. wink.gif

Hardly.

Posted by: Turin Machine Jan 21 2019, 06:17 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 21 2019, 02:14 PM) *
Hardly.

I didn't understand that either dry.gif

Posted by: newres Jan 21 2019, 09:26 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Jan 21 2019, 06:17 PM) *
I didn't understand that either dry.gif

Country before ideology or ideology before country?

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Jan 29 2019, 10:12 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 9 2019, 07:54 PM) *
Nearly there.

Are you sure??😂

Posted by: newres Jan 30 2019, 07:08 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Jan 29 2019, 10:12 PM) *
Are you sure??😂

Youíve misread the situation. Iíd be unhappily content with Mayís WA although there will still be years of negotiations left if the EU open up the WA again. But if they donít, there will be additional amendable votes in parliament. Time wise weíre nearer no deal but the things to bear in mind are the following.

May is highly unlikely to allow no deal.
She doesnít need to call an election making a referendum more likely
The public in all polls are for remaining.
Parliament is overwhelmingly against no deal.
May has promised more votes.

Keep your Prosecco on ice. wink.gif

Posted by: je suis Charlie Jan 30 2019, 03:23 PM

The public in all polls seem very much to be as diverse as they were at the start. Efforts to delay Brexit failed miserably last night, no delay means no time left for a second referendum. Either, the EU cabal will need to bend on the whole backstop issue or we simply crash out with no deal. Those are the only two options.

And who the **** drinks Prosecco?

Posted by: newres Jan 30 2019, 06:52 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Jan 30 2019, 03:23 PM) *
The public in all polls seem very much to be as diverse as they were at the start. Efforts to delay Brexit failed miserably last night, no delay means no time left for a second referendum. Either, the EU cabal will need to bend on the whole backstop issue or we simply crash out with no deal. Those are the only two options.

And who the **** drinks Prosecco?

Did you switch off the TV before the end of the votes?

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Jan 30 2019, 06:52 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Jan 30 2019, 03:23 PM) *
The public in all polls seem very much to be as diverse as they were at the start. Efforts to delay Brexit failed miserably last night, no delay means no time left for a second referendum. Either, the EU cabal will need to bend on the whole backstop issue or we simply crash out with no deal. Those are the only two options.

And who the **** drinks Prosecco?


Quite and the #fbpe types have hardened opinion to leave. With the likes of femi (funded by Soros and the EU), Lammy (ever seen him on mastermind?) Worth a youtube look as I didn't realise it was possible for an elected politician to be quite so thick!!!🤣 And don't even get me started in Polly Toynbee...

Posted by: je suis Charlie Jan 30 2019, 11:35 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 30 2019, 06:52 PM) *
Did you switch off the TV before the end of the votes?

Oh, you mean the NON BINDING amendment?

Posted by: Turin Machine Jan 31 2019, 07:30 AM

Well, just back from the boat show in Germany and it's **** near as cold here as it was there! Two schools of thought over there, the locals in the bars are pretty much wishing they could do the same as us, industry is bricking itself over damage to it's already falling car sales figures and most everyone else is running around wondering where the money is going to come from to prop up Mutti's spending dream. Anyway, quick slice of toast and off to bed!

Posted by: SirWilliam Jan 31 2019, 10:05 AM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Jan 31 2019, 07:30 AM) *
Well, just back from the boat show in Germany and it's **** near as cold here as it was there! Two schools of thought over there, the locals in the bars are pretty much wishing they could do the same as us, industry is bricking itself over damage to it's already falling car sales figures and most everyone else is running around wondering where the money is going to come from to prop up Mutti's spending dream. Anyway, quick slice of toast and off to bed!


Shame the media don't send their vox pop reporters into the real world instead of giving airtime to the rentamouth rabble that occupies our televisions on a daily basis. Real people with real jobs and real concerns will forge a new future europe but it may be some time.
Take Ireland for instance. The obvious route is a united autonomous Ireland outside of both the UK and EU that trades freely with the UK in a similar vein to the Chanel Islands and Man, but can anyone see the politicians agreeing to that even though it would be beneficial to one and all?
Meanwhile march 29th approacheth.

Posted by: newres Jan 31 2019, 05:01 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Jan 31 2019, 07:30 AM) *
Well, just back from the boat show in Germany and it's **** near as cold here as it was there! Two schools of thought over there, the locals in the bars are pretty much wishing they could do the same as us, industry is bricking itself over damage to it's already falling car sales figures and most everyone else is running around wondering where the money is going to come from to prop up Mutti's spending dream. Anyway, quick slice of toast and off to bed!

Probably thatís true in the bars youíd be in.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Jan 31 2019, 05:59 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 31 2019, 05:01 PM) *
Probably thatís true in the bars youíd be in.

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 25 2019, 06:47 AM) *
Isnít it obvious? Sheís an uppity negro.

Posted by: newres Jan 31 2019, 08:29 PM

Did you have a sarcasm bypass?

Posted by: newres Jan 31 2019, 08:32 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Jan 31 2019, 10:05 AM) *
Shame the media don't send their vox pop reporters into the real world instead of giving airtime to the rentamouth rabble that occupies our televisions on a daily basis. Real people with real jobs and real concerns will forge a new future europe but it may be some time.
Take Ireland for instance. The obvious route is a united autonomous Ireland outside of both the UK and EU that trades freely with the UK in a similar vein to the Chanel Islands and Man, but can anyone see the politicians agreeing to that even though it would be beneficial to one and all?
Meanwhile march 29th approacheth.

Ireland isnít stupid enough to want to leave the EU. I think the issue is that having had a real war of independence from a genuinely foul occupier, they donít feel the need to invent one.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Jan 31 2019, 09:47 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 31 2019, 08:29 PM) *
Did you have a sarcasm bypass?

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 25 2019, 06:47 AM) *
Isnít it obvious? Sheís an uppity negro.


Racist!

Posted by: Turin Machine Jan 31 2019, 10:17 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 31 2019, 05:01 PM) *
Probably thatís true in the bars youíd be in.

Same bars as these people.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/01/31/german-anger-builds-dangerous-handling-brexit-euideologues/amp/

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Jan 31 2019, 10:52 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 31 2019, 08:32 PM) *
Ireland isnít stupid enough to want to leave the EU. I think the issue is that having had a real war of independence from a genuinely foul occupier, they donít feel the need to invent one.


Political instability is rife in the EU.

France is on fire and Macron is less popular than the Vichy leader, Germany struggling with migration and will go into recession in April, Greece broke, Italy fighting back but now in recession with broke banks, Poland and Hungary threatened with Art 7 for "nationalism". And don't even get me started on Deutsche Banks bonkers balance sheet.

So if I was Ireland.. I'd go for an Irexit. To remainers the EU seems to be some sort of cult and they will follow it until they end up in some sort of WACO type ending. Good luck with that.

P.S. - Its nice to call the Country of your birth (presumably) a "foul occupier". If I felt that way about the Country I call home I would move to a Country that I shared values with. Perhaps you should give it some thought?? For your own mental health.


Posted by: newres Feb 1 2019, 11:06 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Jan 31 2019, 10:52 PM) *
Political instability is rife in the EU.

France is on fire and Macron is less popular than the Vichy leader, Germany struggling with migration and will go into recession in April, Greece broke, Italy fighting back but now in recession with broke banks, Poland and Hungary threatened with Art 7 for "nationalism". And don't even get me started on Deutsche Banks bonkers balance sheet.

So if I was Ireland.. I'd go for an Irexit. To remainers the EU seems to be some sort of cult and they will follow it until they end up in some sort of WACO type ending. Good luck with that.

P.S. - Its nice to call the Country of your birth (presumably) a "foul occupier". If I felt that way about the Country I call home I would move to a Country that I shared values with. Perhaps you should give it some thought?? For your own mental health.

Britain behaved fouly in Ireland. Not my fault you didn't know. Look up Cork, Black and Tans and Cromwell.

Posted by: Strafin Feb 1 2019, 11:13 AM

Just because you don't like somehitng about a country doesn't mean you should leave! You can try and have a positive change. The running away mentality is like a stroppy teenager outlook, or brexiteers!

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 1 2019, 11:46 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 1 2019, 11:06 AM) *
Britain behaved fouly in Ireland. Not my fault you didn't know. Look up Cork, Black and Tans and Cromwell.

And the IRA behaved fouly as well during the troubles. Your another of these "I'm so ashamed of my countries past" brigade. I bet Churchill causes you great consternation. A racist imperialist who fought against the most evil regime ever.🤣

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 1 2019, 11:48 AM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Feb 1 2019, 11:13 AM) *
Just because you don't like somehitng about a country doesn't mean you should leave! You can try and have a positive change. The running away mentality is like a stroppy teenager outlook, or brexiteers!

Or Hollywood luvvies when Trump won. Or remainers saying they will leave and then not following through.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 1 2019, 12:09 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 1 2019, 11:46 AM) *
And the IRA behaved fouly as well during the troubles. Your another of these "I'm so ashamed of my countries past" brigade. I bet Churchill causes you great consternation. A racist imperialist who fought against the most evil regime ever.🤣

Hilarious that he thinks his mother country is foul because of Cromwell but thinks we should bind tighter to Europe, think Hitler and Mussolini. But then he is disturbed.

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 25 2019, 06:47 AM) *
Isnít it obvious? Sheís an uppity negro.

Posted by: Andy1 Feb 1 2019, 12:10 PM

You can't change the past, dwelling on it doesn't help. However you can change the future, something remainers could have done if they'd all have exercised their vote instead of staying at home assuming it would never happen. Now they want a second chance. I would rather stay but I accept the result, lets move on.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 1 2019, 12:24 PM

QUOTE (Andy1 @ Feb 1 2019, 12:10 PM) *
You can't change the past, dwelling on it doesn't help. However you can change the future, something remainers could have done if they'd all have exercised their vote instead of staying at home assuming it would never happen. Now they want a second chance. I would rather stay but I accept the result, lets move on.

Quite agree, regardless of ones personal take if we're to go anywhere we need to make whatever happens work. Recriminations won't get us anywhere, if we and the politicians had all pulled in the same direction two years ago we wouldn't be in the mess we are now. Regardless of the colour of your rosette the only person to have come out of this with any credibility is T M if only for her doggedness and resolution. JC has just looked like a rather tatty paper tiger and has bought discredit on the labour movement.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 1 2019, 12:54 PM

THIS, is a good article,

The Guardian: So, poorer Brexiters voted to be worse off? Thereís nothing wrong in that.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/01/poorer-brexiters-worse-off-working-class-leavers

Posted by: James_Trinder Feb 1 2019, 01:20 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 1 2019, 11:48 AM) *
Or Hollywood luvvies when Trump won. Or remainers saying they will leave and then not following through.


I am a remainer and if I end up losing my job due to this Brexit shambles then I promise you that I will be off to Germany.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 1 2019, 01:39 PM

QUOTE (James_Trinder @ Feb 1 2019, 01:20 PM) *
I am a remainer and if I end up losing my job due to this Brexit shambles then I promise you that I will be off to Germany.

Good. A man with principals. Where in Germany? Do you speak fluent German? Would be helpful.

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 1 2019, 02:23 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 1 2019, 01:39 PM) *
Good. A man with principals. Where in Germany? Do you speak fluent German? Would be helpful.


Give it 20 years and all europe will be speaking german so patience has it's own reward. Even the remoaners will have their day but not at the expense of the democratic process.

Posted by: newres Feb 1 2019, 03:53 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 1 2019, 11:46 AM) *
And the IRA behaved fouly as well during the troubles. Your another of these "I'm so ashamed of my countries past" brigade. I bet Churchill causes you great consternation. A racist imperialist who fought against the most evil regime ever.🤣

No, I agree with him. He said five minutes talking to the average bloke on the street would convince you democracy is a bad idea.

Posted by: newres Feb 1 2019, 04:01 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 1 2019, 12:54 PM) *
THIS, is a good article,

The Guardian: So, poorer Brexiters voted to be worse off? Thereís nothing wrong in that.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/01/poorer-brexiters-worse-off-working-class-leavers

Ofcourse the problem with the article is that the premise is wrong. Leave told us weíd be better off and weíd get a fantastic deal from the EU so people did NOT vote to be worse off.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 1 2019, 04:34 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 1 2019, 04:01 PM) *
Ofcourse the problem with the article is that the premise is wrong. Leave told us weíd be better off and weíd get a fantastic deal from the EU so people did NOT vote to be worse off.

Say you, but then you also think this is a good idea,

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 25 2019, 06:47 AM) *
Isnít it obvious? Sheís an uppity negro.

Posted by: newres Feb 1 2019, 05:29 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 1 2019, 04:34 PM) *
Say you, but then you also think this is a good idea,

Youíve lost me there.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 1 2019, 06:27 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 1 2019, 05:29 PM) *
Youíve lost me there.

No, it wouldn't be a loss. Nasty racist.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 1 2019, 06:42 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 1 2019, 06:27 PM) *
No, it wouldn't be a loss. Nasty racist.

He's not a racist. He is the perfect human specimen. His actual name is James Thurber...🤣

Posted by: Biker1 Feb 1 2019, 07:05 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 1 2019, 12:46 PM) *
And the IRA behaved fouly as well during the troubles. Your another of these "I'm so ashamed of my countries past" brigade. I bet Churchill causes you great consternation. A racist imperialist who fought against the most evil regime ever.🤣

Newres, I just wondered out of interest what your thoughts are of those who desecrated the memorials to WWII Bomber Command and WPC Yvonne Fletcher?

Sorry to divert the topic but seemed a good time to ask the question. Left wing liberal's ideas on such things interest me.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 1 2019, 07:57 PM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Feb 1 2019, 07:05 PM) *
Newres, I just wondered out of interest what your thoughts are of those who desecrated the memorials to WWII Bomber Command and WPC Yvonne Fletcher?

Sorry to divert the topic but seemed a good time to ask the question. Left wing liberal's ideas on such things interest me.


Grabs popcorn... waits for answer....

Posted by: James_Trinder Feb 2 2019, 01:41 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 1 2019, 01:39 PM) *
Good. A man with principals. Where in Germany? Do you speak fluent German? Would be helpful.


I have an "A" in A-Level German so I am pretty good by English standards and if I lived there for a while then I would imagine that I would become fluent in the end. If possible I would like to settle in Hessen since it is fairly similar to West Berkshire in terms of landscape and type of people and it is also one of the few places in Germany where cider is readily available.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 2 2019, 03:11 PM

QUOTE (James_Trinder @ Feb 2 2019, 01:41 PM) *
I have an "A" in A-Level German so I am pretty good by English standards and if I lived there for a while then I would imagine that I would become fluent in the end. If possible I would like to settle in Hessen since it is fairly similar to West Berkshire in terms of landscape and type of people and it is also one of the few places in Germany where cider is readily available.

Good for you, if you've mastered the verb structure the rest is comparatively easy. If their cider is as good as their beer (and better than french cider) you should be on a winner. Good luck!

Posted by: newres Feb 2 2019, 04:07 PM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Feb 1 2019, 07:05 PM) *
Newres, I just wondered out of interest what your thoughts are of those who desecrated the memorials to WWII Bomber Command and WPC Yvonne Fletcher?

Sorry to divert the topic but seemed a good time to ask the question. Left wing liberal's ideas on such things interest me.

I think itís disgraceful. And?

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 2 2019, 07:45 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 2 2019, 04:07 PM) *
I think itís disgraceful. And?

You must think Bomber Command acted disgracefully in WW2 though and all police are racist scum? Surely...
😂

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 2 2019, 07:46 PM

Duplicate

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 3 2019, 09:16 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 2 2019, 04:07 PM) *
I think itís disgraceful. And?

And you're a dribbling, window licking, spacktard racist.

Posted by: Biker1 Feb 3 2019, 10:21 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 2 2019, 05:07 PM) *
I think itís disgraceful. And?

No, that's fine. Interesting thanks.
No "And".

Posted by: newres Feb 3 2019, 05:49 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 3 2019, 09:16 AM) *
And you're a dribbling, window licking, spacktard racist.

Well itís up to you. I took you off block, but if youíre going to be a tw@t again Iíll put you back on. Iíve no interest in engaging with a te@t online or real life. Up to you. Iím not bothered either way.

Posted by: newres Feb 3 2019, 05:55 PM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Feb 3 2019, 10:21 AM) *
No, that's fine. Interesting thanks.
No "And".

Iím actually not that left wing. I guess Iím pretty unhappy with our foreign policy and find myself not out of line with Corbyn on many things. Notably the Middle East, but economic policy wise Iím ethically capitalist I guess. On the whole Iím in favour of private ownership of the utilities for example.

I donít like the idea of a Corbyn led government but Iíd prefer that to Brexit.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 3 2019, 06:56 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 3 2019, 05:55 PM) *
Iím actually not that left wing. I guess Iím pretty unhappy with our foreign policy and find myself not out of line with Corbyn on many things. Notably the Middle East, but economic policy wise Iím ethically capitalist I guess. On the whole Iím in favour of private ownership of the utilities for example.

I donít like the idea of a Corbyn led government but Iíd prefer that to Brexit.


Brexit cometh my friend... welcome it. You never know. You could quite possibly be wrong and it may be a good thing. Then again you may be right and I wont have any medicine, food or NHS on the 30th March. The proof of the pudding as they say...is in the eating..

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 3 2019, 07:34 PM

https://www.express.co.uk/finance/city/1081896/euro-pound-eurozone-European-Union-currency-dollar-sterling-exchange-rate-economy

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 3 2019, 07:36 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 3 2019, 05:49 PM) *
Well itís up to you. I took you off block, but if youíre going to be a tw@t again Iíll put you back on. Iíve no interest in engaging with a te@t online or real life. Up to you. Iím not bothered either way.

I have no space in my life for a racist like you.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 3 2019, 07:37 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 3 2019, 05:55 PM) *
Iím actually not that left wing. I guess Iím pretty unhappy with our foreign policy and find myself not out of line with Corbyn on many things. Notably the Middle East, but economic policy wise Iím ethically capitalist I guess. On the whole Iím in favour of private ownership of the utilities for example.

I donít like the idea of a Corbyn led government but Iíd prefer that to Brexit.


That's good.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/feb/02/rebel-labour-mps-set-to-quit-party-and-form-centre-group

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 3 2019, 07:48 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 3 2019, 07:34 PM) *
https://www.express.co.uk/finance/city/1081896/euro-pound-eurozone-European-Union-currency-dollar-sterling-exchange-rate-economy



Personally I want to be out when the German banks collapse...which they will do as they have built up endless bad debts to cover the ***** of failing southern European states. Anyone with any ounce of Finanial acumen knows what is coming and it is going to make 2008 and Brexit look like slideshows... I pity the next German Chancellor..oh and remember how the EU treated the UK when they are in the sh1t.

Trading with the rest of the world whilst the EU implodes may be out salvation.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 3 2019, 07:56 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 3 2019, 07:36 PM) *
I have no space in my life for a racist like you.

smile.gif

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 3 2019, 07:57 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 3 2019, 07:48 PM) *
Personally I want to be out when the German banks collapse...which they will do as they have built up endless bad debts to cover the ***** of failing southern European states. Anyone with any ounce of Finanial acumen knows what is coming and it is going to make 2008 and Brexit look like slideshows... I pity the next German Chancellor..oh and remember how the EU treated the UK when they are in the sh1t.

Trading with the rest of the world whilst the EU implodes may be out salvation.

Which is precisely why they don't want us to go, basically the whole shooting match is bankrupt, financially and fiscally.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 3 2019, 08:00 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 3 2019, 05:49 PM) *
Well itís up to you. I took you off block, but if youíre going to be a tw@t again Iíll put you back on. Iíve no interest in engaging with a te@t online or real life. Up to you. Iím not bothered either way.

I bet that's ruined JSC's whole day.

Posted by: Andy1 Feb 3 2019, 08:02 PM

No wonder this forum fails to attract new users.

Posted by: newres Feb 3 2019, 08:18 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 3 2019, 07:36 PM) *
I have no space in my life for a racist like you.

Fair enough. Post away with you childish insults, I wonít see them.

Posted by: newres Feb 3 2019, 08:20 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 3 2019, 08:00 PM) *
I bet that's ruined JSC's whole day.

Iím not bothered either way.

Posted by: newres Feb 3 2019, 08:25 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 3 2019, 07:48 PM) *
Personally I want to be out when the German banks collapse...which they will do as they have built up endless bad debts to cover the ***** of failing southern European states. Anyone with any ounce of Finanial acumen knows what is coming and it is going to make 2008 and Brexit look like slideshows... I pity the next German Chancellor..oh and remember how the EU treated the UK when they are in the sh1t.

Trading with the rest of the world whilst the EU implodes may be out salvation.

When will the German banks have collapsed by? No good saying they will endlessly. When can we say your prediction hasnít come true?

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 3 2019, 08:25 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 3 2019, 07:57 PM) *
Which is precisely why they don't want us to go, basically the whole shooting match is bankrupt, financially and fiscally.

Very few people me seem to realise though... the latest wheeze from the powers that be is to merge two German toxic banks commerz and Deutsche. Sort of reminds you of RBS leading up to 2008...🤣

Posted by: newres Feb 4 2019, 09:49 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 3 2019, 08:25 PM) *
When will the German banks have collapsed by? No good saying they will endlessly. When can we say your prediction hasnít come true?

Any answer on this so I know when to breathe a sigh of relief? Thought not.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 4 2019, 10:05 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 4 2019, 09:49 AM) *
Any answer on this so I know when to breathe a sigh of relief? Thought not.

By the end of 2019. Guaranteed.
And if I am wrong I will apologise.




Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 4 2019, 10:09 PM

On another note plagues of rats I tell you... super rats so I understand. 4 feet long and growing every year we are out of the EU..

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/fears-no-deal-brexit-could-13944476

Godzilla may also be lumbering up the Thames on 29/3.

Hope you have your Brexit survival bug out kits ready....

https://www.brexitsurvivalpacks.com


Posted by: newres Feb 5 2019, 07:28 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 4 2019, 10:05 PM) *
By the end of 2019. Guaranteed.
And if I am wrong I will apologise.

Ok. Iíve a note in my diary but somehow I donít think youíll be changing your name any time soon to Freddie Futureseer. These stories get very boring. Italy will collapse, Euro on its last legs, yellow vests to tear up the EU. Itís right wing wishful thinking.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 5 2019, 10:31 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 5 2019, 07:28 AM) *
Ok. Iíve a note in my diary but somehow I donít think youíll be changing your name any time soon to Freddie Futureseer. These stories get very boring. Italy will collapse, Euro on its last legs, yellow vests to tear up the EU. Itís right wing wishful thinking.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/24/future-eu-peril-british-vote-brussels-leave

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 5 2019, 10:33 AM

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1082666/brexit-news-EU-jeremy-corbyn-labour-video/amp

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 6 2019, 09:29 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 5 2019, 10:33 AM) *
https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1082666/brexit-news-EU-jeremy-corbyn-labour-video/amp


"Duplicit sod" comes to mind, but I'm sure his spin doctors are working on it. Maybe he and Rees Mogg are not so far apart after all.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 6 2019, 05:47 PM

I think Mr Tusk has just ensured a no deal WTO brexit.
Never mind. Eh.

Posted by: newres Feb 6 2019, 06:13 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 6 2019, 05:47 PM) *
I think Mr Tusk has just ensured a no deal WTO brexit.
Never mind. Eh.

Although when questioned today on LBC Farage couldnít tell the public what the plan was. Unfortunate language but itís true. No plan then and no plan now. WTO has only been proposed in the last 6-12 months. No plan and clueless.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 6 2019, 06:32 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 6 2019, 06:13 PM) *
Although when questioned today on LBC Farage couldnít tell the public what the plan was. Unfortunate language but itís true. No plan then and no plan now. WTO has only been proposed in the last 6-12 months. No plan and clueless.

So are the EU. Are they going to send an army to the NI border? Really? If not, how do they propose policing it? How are the EU plans going to fix the 39 Biillion hole on the EU budget? How are they going to afford Junckers bar bill???? Oh I forgot he has Sciatica.😂 Tusk sounds like a desperate man who realises the game is nearly up. Oh and let's hope Femi and crew don't suffer the same fate as the yellow vest protesters when they try and invade parliament on the 27th Feb. Oh wait.. actually f**k it. Gas em and shoot em with rubber bullets.😂

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSfZegu3Alz2558NJB-K3i0IbTDMPgqQrMbxRaxnkIvI1ghqCQ/viewform

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 6 2019, 06:44 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 6 2019, 05:47 PM) *
I think Mr Tusk has just ensured a no deal WTO brexit.
Never mind. Eh.


"I have a cunning plan" as the long suffering Baldrick remarked to his boss , so safe to assume that by the time the credits roll everything will be sorted and May and Tusk will dance the night away to a Black Sabbath soundtrack

Posted by: newres Feb 6 2019, 07:43 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 6 2019, 06:32 PM) *
So are the EU. Are they going to send an army to the NI border? Really? If not, how do they propose policing it? How are the EU plans going to fix the 39 Biillion hole on the EU budget? How are they going to afford Junckers bar bill???? Oh I forgot he has Sciatica.😂 Tusk sounds like a desperate man who realises the game is nearly up. Oh and let's hope Femi and crew don't suffer the same fate as the yellow vest protesters when they try and invade parliament on the 27th Feb. Oh wait.. actually f**k it. Gas em and shoot em with rubber bullets.😂

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSfZegu3Alz2558NJB-K3i0IbTDMPgqQrMbxRaxnkIvI1ghqCQ/viewform

The EU donít need a plan.

The backstop is for the whole of the UK. Itís TMís proposal, not the EUís. No wonder the world is laughing at our ineptitude.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 6 2019, 08:01 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 6 2019, 07:43 PM) *
The EU donít need a plan.

The backstop is for the whole of the UK. Itís TMís proposal, not the EUís. No wonder the world is laughing at our ineptitude.

We don't want a plan, we want a harder than hard brexit. Let BMW, Audi, Mercedes, Renault et al go sell their overpriced tat somewhere else.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 6 2019, 08:02 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 3 2019, 08:18 PM) *
Fair enough. Post away with you childish insults, I wonít see them.

I see that literary degree is paying dividends then.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 6 2019, 08:03 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 6 2019, 07:43 PM) *
The EU donít need a plan.

The backstop is for the whole of the UK. Itís TMís proposal, not the EUís. No wonder the world is laughing at our ineptitude.

Doesn't dear boy, not don't. Literature degree? Think not.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 6 2019, 08:19 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 6 2019, 08:03 PM) *
Doesn't dear boy, not don't. Literature degree? Think not.

🤣 Just call him Gump.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 6 2019, 08:24 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 6 2019, 08:01 PM) *
We don't want a plan, we want a harder than hard brexit. Let BMW, Audi, Mercedes, Renault et al go sell their overpriced tat somewhere else.

How are they going to cope with the 70 billion hole between exports and imports as well as the 39 billion? We may be screwed but the EU intrasigence will bring about the demise of the whole **** thing.

https://fullfact.org/europe/uk-eu-trade/



Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 6 2019, 08:30 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 6 2019, 08:02 PM) *
I see that literary degree is paying dividends then.

laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 6 2019, 08:31 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 6 2019, 07:43 PM) *
The EU donít need a plan.

The backstop is for the whole of the UK. Itís TMís proposal, not the EUís. No wonder the world is laughing at our ineptitude.

Nothing to do with me sonny.

Posted by: newres Feb 7 2019, 06:47 AM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 6 2019, 08:31 PM) *
Nothing to do with me sonny.

I assume you are for the peace in Northern Ireland?

I do wonder though, if May hadnít called the election would she have signed the WA with NI alone in the backstop?

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 7 2019, 05:07 PM

It's all started going soupy already 😂

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-47161500

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 7 2019, 09:40 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 7 2019, 05:07 PM) *
It's all started going soupy already

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-47161500


Silly man. The EU is a paradise of mass unemployment and failed states. Why the "****" should we leave that? Us old gits are probably saving the younguns lives. They will avoid conscription to the "EU youth" to battle Putin. But hey.. I guess they can still volunteer. If they are lucky they may get a nice black Hugo boss outfit.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 8 2019, 12:25 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 7 2019, 09:40 PM) *
Silly man. The EU is a paradise of mass unemployment and failed states. Why the "****" should we leave that? Us old gits are probably saving the younguns lives. They will avoid conscription to the "EU youth" to battle Putin. But hey.. I guess they can still volunteer. If they are lucky they may get a nice black Hugo boss outfit.

No you're wrong! They're all bestest buds. Obvious lies spread by hard right thicko leavers, innit.

Posted by: newres Feb 8 2019, 08:46 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 7 2019, 09:40 PM) *
Silly man. The EU is a paradise of mass unemployment and failed states. Why the "****" should we leave that? Us old gits are probably saving the younguns lives. They will avoid conscription to the "EU youth" to battle Putin. But hey.. I guess they can still volunteer. If they are lucky they may get a nice black Hugo boss outfit.

You do know that we could always veto any EU military force? Project Fear. Just like Turkey joining. In fact did you know that it was the UK more than any other country pressing the case for Turkey to join.

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 8 2019, 09:04 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 8 2019, 08:46 AM) *
You do know that we could always veto any EU military force? Project Fear. Just like Turkey joining. In fact did you know that it was the UK more than any other country pressing the case for Turkey to join.


To be honest it was Cameron who mooted that one and look at his track record. rolleyes.gif Probably on a retainer from Turkish Tourism.

Posted by: James_Trinder Feb 8 2019, 01:24 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 6 2019, 05:47 PM) *
I think Mr Tusk has just ensured a no deal WTO brexit.
Never mind. Eh.


He may well have done but it doesn't make his assessment of the current situation any less spot on.

Posted by: newres Feb 8 2019, 03:10 PM

QUOTE (James_Trinder @ Feb 8 2019, 01:24 PM) *
He may well have done but it doesn't make his assessment of the current situation any less spot on.

To be truthful itís only the gammon whining about it. Most people see that what he said was correct. He ought to have used more diplomatic language though.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 8 2019, 03:22 PM

Let's go 'NO DEAL' , stuff it to the whining remoaners as well as bloodying German and French imports on the nose.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 8 2019, 03:33 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 8 2019, 03:22 PM) *
Let's go 'NO DEAL' , stuff it to the whining remoaners as well as bloodying German and French imports on the nose.

I certainly wouldn't be bothered about these going bust..

Hugo Boss
Daimler
Mercedes
Bayer

Not sure why they are still even companies given the history. I know if they were British companies with that history in no circumstances would they exist.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 8 2019, 04:26 PM

Volkswagen, slave labour at Wolfsburg. Nice partners to have.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 8 2019, 05:51 PM

And then there's this petit nugget,

THE pound has surged against the euro after market confidence grew over a Brexit deal, but the eurozone suffered a damaging blow after Germany fell into ďrecessionĒ.

Uh huh.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 8 2019, 09:48 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 8 2019, 04:26 PM) *
Volkswagen, slave labour at Wolfsburg. Nice partners to have.

None of the "righteous liberals" mention this though? Why not? Do you really think if Vodafone or Capita had been "involved" in the deaths of the millions of people 70 years ago that these companies would exist? No chance. But they seem to get a free pass...😮 Double standards.🙄

Posted by: newres Feb 9 2019, 07:15 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 8 2019, 09:48 PM) *
None of the "righteous liberals" mention this though? Why not? Do you really think if Vodafone or Capita had been "involved" in the deaths of the millions of people 70 years ago that these companies would exist? No chance. But they seem to get a free pass...😮 Double standards.🙄

Really?

https://www.newstatesman.com/economics/2014/04/much-britains-wealth-built-slavery-so-why-shouldnt-it-pay-reparations#amp

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 9 2019, 07:36 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 9 2019, 07:15 AM) *
Really?

https://www.newstatesman.com/economics/2014/04/much-britains-wealth-built-slavery-so-why-shouldnt-it-pay-reparations#amp


Still not answered the question about the German companies but you did find a link to a few British companies from hundreds of years ago just again to show your disdain for anything British. Well done.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Barclay_of_Youngsbury


Posted by: newres Feb 9 2019, 08:06 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 9 2019, 07:36 AM) *
Still not answered the question about the German companies but you did find a link to a few British companies from hundreds of years ago just again to show your disdain for anything British. Well done.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Barclay_of_Youngsbury

Double standards eh? Ok for companies here to benefit from slaves but not in Germany?

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 9 2019, 09:23 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 9 2019, 08:06 AM) *
Double standards eh? Ok for companies here to benefit from slaves but not in Germany?


Slavery has been a part of human existence for 5,000 years, if not longer, and continues to be so albeit on a reduced scale so, so why is it always the african trade that is the centre of attention? I do not hear anyone demanding that Italy reimburse us for the Roman legions enslaving Ancient Britain or the the various other empires that have risen and subsequently disappeared?
No, it's all about bashing the UK by liberal lefties who need a hairshirt to appease their conscience. Remember the USA gained independence 100 years before slavery was supposedly abolished and while I agree Britain was complicit in early shipping, it was the Arabs who harvested the labour force and plantation owners who continued the practice long after the atlantic trade had ceased.

It was bad but there has been a lot worse both before and since and we should learn from it as opposed to trying to redress history.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 9 2019, 09:41 AM

The greatest slavers were the Muslim Arabs and the Africans. The west joined that party rather late, and it was the west who poured great resources into the abolition of the trade, a trade that still continues to this day in the same quarters.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 9 2019, 10:37 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 9 2019, 08:06 AM) *
Double standards eh? Ok for companies here to benefit from slaves but not in Germany?

If that's the best you can do I pity you. Britain led the charge against slavery, soy boys still Ponce around cooing over early vw cars and calling them desirable classics while the families of the slaves who built them are still around.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 9 2019, 11:23 AM

"An estimated 12 million people worked as slaves at virtually every German company during the Third Reich. Many did mundane jobs at bakeries and shoe factories; others built cars for Mercedes-Benz and guns for Krupp. They were drawn - or dragged - from every corner of the Nazi empire. Whether Poles, Jews or Russians, they were deemed "sub-human" and treated accordingly. Herded into unheated barracks and forced to work 12-hour shifts on meagre rations, large numbers died of disease, hunger or maltreatment. Most of the survivors have received no compensation."

And this is the financial power behind the EU that would see fit to dictate terms to us. How short the memory, how deep the shame.

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 9 2019, 03:29 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 9 2019, 11:23 AM) *
"An estimated 12 million people worked as slaves at virtually every German company during the Third Reich. Many did mundane jobs at bakeries and shoe factories; others built cars for Mercedes-Benz and guns for Krupp. They were drawn - or dragged - from every corner of the Nazi empire. Whether Poles, Jews or Russians, they were deemed "sub-human" and treated accordingly. Herded into unheated barracks and forced to work 12-hour shifts on meagre rations, large numbers died of disease, hunger or maltreatment. Most of the survivors have received no compensation."

And this is the financial power behind the EU that would see fit to dictate terms to us. How short the memory, how deep the shame.


Well articulated Sir. Little wonder the left removed history from the school curriculum.

Posted by: newres Feb 9 2019, 05:07 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 9 2019, 11:23 AM) *
"An estimated 12 million people worked as slaves at virtually every German company during the Third Reich. Many did mundane jobs at bakeries and shoe factories; others built cars for Mercedes-Benz and guns for Krupp. They were drawn - or dragged - from every corner of the Nazi empire. Whether Poles, Jews or Russians, they were deemed "sub-human" and treated accordingly. Herded into unheated barracks and forced to work 12-hour shifts on meagre rations, large numbers died of disease, hunger or maltreatment. Most of the survivors have received no compensation."

And this is the financial power behind the EU that would see fit to dictate terms to us. How short the memory, how deep the shame.

Your last sentence is worthy of a child. For the rest of your post, you make the case brilliantly for resisting nationalism and prejudice based on colour and creed. Strange therefore that you defend Tommeh.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 9 2019, 08:35 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 9 2019, 05:07 PM) *
Your last sentence is worthy of a child. For the rest of your post, you make the case brilliantly for resisting nationalism and prejudice based on colour and creed. Strange therefore that you defend Tommeh.

Firstly my last sentence is bang on the money and secondly I have never defended 'Tommeh' merely his right to justice under the legal system, something you (apparently) are quite content to forgo based on the fact you don't like his views.
And third, you rant on about people insulting you but when, and it's almost always every time you post on here you provoke and encourage said abuse. You come across as a spoiled, overindulged, self important brat. Always seeking attention, always insulting in tone and giving a good impression of a small boy who lost his dummy out of the pram.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 9 2019, 08:46 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 9 2019, 08:35 PM) *
Firstly my last sentence is bang on the money and secondly I have never defended 'Tommeh' merely his right to justice under the legal system, something you (apparently) are quite content to forgo based on the fact you don't like his views.
And third, you rant on about people insulting you but when, and it's almost always every time you post on here you provoke and encourage said abuse. You come across as a spoiled, overindulged, self important brat. Always seeking attention, always insulting in tone and giving a good impression of a small boy who lost his dummy out of the pram.

Newres is the worst kind of liberal remoaner. I really don't understand why anyone that despises the Country they live in and indeed that Countries history would want to stay in that said Country. He is I am afraid just a very sad bitter man.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 9 2019, 09:57 PM

Another Saturday in the paradise that is the EU.

https://mobile.twitter.com/nickmon1112/status/1094228351131234305

Can you imagine the outrage of Britain's if the state did this to protesters???

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 9 2019, 10:12 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 9 2019, 08:46 PM) *
Newres is the worst kind of liberal remoaner. I really don't understand why anyone that despises the Country they live in and indeed that Countries history would want to stay in that said Country. He is I am afraid just a very sad bitter man.

I'm afraid you're right. I can understand how JSC gets so irate with him but newres persistently comes over as a very sad, frustrated and non too bright individual, which is a shame, still some one loves him I expect. Just not me.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 10 2019, 01:50 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 9 2019, 08:46 PM) *
Newres is the worst kind of liberal remoaner. I really don't understand why anyone that despises the Country they live in and indeed that Countries history would want to stay in that said Country. He is I am afraid just a very sad bitter man.

And he's shown himself to be a racist as well.

QUOTE (newres @ Jan 25 2019, 06:47 AM) *
Isnít it obvious? Sheís an uppity negro.

Posted by: newres Feb 10 2019, 06:45 AM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 9 2019, 08:35 PM) *
Firstly my last sentence is bang on the money and secondly I have never defended 'Tommeh' merely his right to justice under the legal system, something you (apparently) are quite content to forgo based on the fact you don't like his views.
And third, you rant on about people insulting you but when, and it's almost always every time you post on here you provoke and encourage said abuse. You come across as a spoiled, overindulged, self important brat. Always seeking attention, always insulting in tone and giving a good impression of a small boy who lost his dummy out of the pram.

I provoke abuse by pointing out the nonsense you post. I get that. So even though Germany was destroyed at the end of WW2, the power behind the EU stems from then

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 10 2019, 09:31 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 9 2019, 08:46 PM) *
Newres is the worst kind of liberal remoaner. I really don't understand why anyone that despises the Country they live in and indeed that Countries history would want to stay in that said Country. He is I am afraid just a very sad bitter man.


I remember a certain "celebrity" chef making the bold statement that if the UK voted to leave the EU he and his family were "off". Well he is still around and receiving a nice gratuity from HMG telling us how to feed our children so I guess he considers he will survive without minimum wage staff in his restaurants.

Posted by: newres Feb 10 2019, 11:10 AM

Another thing to think about if weíre going to delve into recent history.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bengal_famine_of_1943


Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 10 2019, 12:09 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 10 2019, 06:45 AM) *
I provoke abuse by pointing out the nonsense you post. I get that. So even though Germany was destroyed at the end of WW2, the power behind the EU stems from then

It's not nonsense sonny, after the war Germany was rebuilt, primarily by us, we poured money into the country in a humanitarian effort because we didn't want it to be a perpetual basket case. It became the financial powerhouse of Europe with its Banks among the most powerful in the continent, dictating financial protocol for the entire industry. If you had listened in school to the history teacher instead of daydreaming you might of remembered. The forced slave aspect of the German war effort is a fact, something that snowflakes ignore these days because it doesn't suit them when whining about 'how evil Britain is'. If you want to have an intelligent conversation stop posting uninformed nonsense backed up with pointless and increasingly laughable 'evidence' and stop trying to be aggresive because all you're doing is making the rest of us laugh. Carry on and just get blocked, up to you really, no one else on here gives a **** either way.

Posted by: newres Feb 10 2019, 12:16 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 10 2019, 12:09 PM) *
It's not nonsense sonny, after the war Germany was rebuilt, primarily by us, we poured money into the country in a humanitarian effort because we didn't want it to be a perpetual basket case. It became the financial powerhouse of Europe with its Banks among the most powerful in the continent, dictating financial protocol for the entire industry. If you had listened in school to the history teacher instead of daydreaming you might of remembered. The forced slave aspect of the German war effort is a fact, something that snowflakes ignore these days because it doesn't suit them when whining about 'how evil Britain is'. If you want to have an intelligent conversation stop posting uninformed nonsense backed up with pointless and increasingly laughable 'evidence' and stop trying to be aggresive because all you're doing is making the rest of us laugh. Carry on and just get blocked, up to you really, no one else on here gives a **** either way.

Have.

I find it ironic that the right wing extremists on here pretend I'm defending the Nazis. Your point was that the EU was founded on profits from slavery. I pointed out that that was patent nonsense so now you're saying that the Allies underwrote the German economy post WW2 (correct this time) and accusing me of being wrong. Incoherent like much of what is said on here.

I'm really not bothered about being blocked by you at all. It must be very upsetting to be called out for lies. JSC is blocked because of his childish abuse.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 10 2019, 12:43 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 10 2019, 01:50 AM) *
And he's shown himself to be a racist as well.

And incredibly dense as well.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 10 2019, 02:37 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 10 2019, 12:43 PM) *
And incredibly dense as well.

Brainwashed I am afraid. Britain bad. Anywhere else good.

Posted by: Andy1 Feb 10 2019, 04:28 PM

[quote name='Turin Machine' date='Feb 10 2019, 12:09 PM' post='123393']
It's not nonsense sonny, after the war Germany was rebuilt, primarily by us.

Rubbish! ERP was a American initiative mainly funded by them.

Posted by: newres Feb 10 2019, 04:43 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 10 2019, 02:37 PM) *
Brainwashed I am afraid. Britain bad. Anywhere else good.

By whom?

Posted by: newres Feb 10 2019, 04:52 PM

ERG member:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47189073

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 10 2019, 05:30 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 10 2019, 04:52 PM) *
ERG member:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47189073

Rich, coming from someone who refuses to condemn it on this forum.

Posted by: Biker1 Feb 11 2019, 09:07 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 9 2019, 09:46 PM) *
Newres is the worst kind of liberal remoaner.

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 10 2019, 01:16 PM) *
I find it ironic that the right wing extremists on here

I take issue with both of these statements as they do not apply to either.
There are much worse "liberal remoaners" out there than newres, likewise I doubt if any on here are "Right wing extremists"
This is one of the main reasons why I rarely post on here nowadays.
Hysterical name calling rather than than sensible, adult debate.
However I am led to believe that the rhetoric on here is mild compared to that of "'social' media" to which I do not subscribe.

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 11 2019, 09:30 AM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Feb 11 2019, 09:07 AM) *
I take issue with both of these statements as they do not apply to either.
There are much worse "liberal remoaners" out there than newres, likewise I doubt if any on here are "Right wing extremists"
This is one of the main reasons why I rarely post on here nowadays.
Hysterical name calling rather than than sensible, adult debate.
However I am led to believe that the rhetoric on here is mild compared to that of "'social' media" to which I do not subscribe.


The voice of reason will, hopefully, resonate above the monosyllabic tripe that is an increasing norm in the debating world but I am not prepared to save oxygen awaiting. I agree that the mud slinging on here is probably mild compared to some but, like global warming, the loss of oratory skills will creep insidiously into our lives to the detriment of our ability to communicate and ultimately survive.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 11 2019, 11:53 AM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Feb 11 2019, 09:07 AM) *
I take issue with both of these statements as they do not apply to either.
There are much worse "liberal remoaners" out there than newres, likewise I doubt if any on here are "Right wing extremists"
This is one of the main reasons why I rarely post on here nowadays.
Hysterical name calling rather than than sensible, adult debate.
However I am led to believe that the rhetoric on here is mild compared to that of "'social' media" to which I do not subscribe.

I agree, myself and others have tried to have sensible discussion only to have it disrupted by trolls who think that banging a keyboard with their foreheads at every and all opportunity qualifies as debate, sparking off yet another bitchfest. It would be nice to be able to discuss issues of the day without the usual keyboard SJW'S trying to spoil it, AC tries to post stuff which often gets shouted down as do you. Let's all just try to get along for a change huh?.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 11 2019, 12:43 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Feb 11 2019, 09:30 AM) *
The voice of reason will, hopefully, resonate above the monosyllabic tripe that is an increasing norm in the debating world but I am not prepared to save oxygen awaiting. I agree that the mud slinging on here is probably mild compared to some but, like global warming, the loss of oratory skills will creep insidiously into our lives to the detriment of our ability to communicate and ultimately survive.


Indeed. And there are far more important things in the world than the EU and Brexit. I for one can't wait for the 29th March to come and go so we can focus on something else.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 11 2019, 12:52 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 11 2019, 12:43 PM) *
Indeed. And there are far more important things in the world than the EU and Brexit. I for one can't wait for the 29th March to come and go so we can focus on something else.

I, quite frankly, am sick of the whole darn thing now.

Posted by: newres Feb 11 2019, 01:06 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 11 2019, 12:43 PM) *
Indeed. And there are far more important things in the world than the EU and Brexit. I for one can't wait for the 29th March to come and go so we can focus on something else.

Not if you work in the automotive industry.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 11 2019, 01:08 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 11 2019, 01:06 PM) *
Not if you work in the automotive industry.

And why's that? I mean why the auto industry in particular?

Posted by: newres Feb 11 2019, 02:42 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 11 2019, 01:08 PM) *
And why's that? I mean why the auto industry in particular?

Automotive was just an example, but even the most optimistic Hard Brexit enthusiast predicts the decimation of the automotive industry post Brexit.

https://twitter.com/RoryStewartUK/status/1056568783400243201


Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 11 2019, 02:51 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 11 2019, 02:42 PM) *
Automotive was just an example, but even the most optimistic Hard Brexit enthusiast predicts the decimation of the automotive industry post Brexit.

https://twitter.com/RoryStewartUK/status/1056568783400243201

And just look at the reasoned, well thought out response.

"Look how happy he is, the fat, old white man....to make skilled,well paid people unemployed. Evil,evil man!"

Ahh , Twitter, gotta love it. laugh.gif

Posted by: x2lls Feb 11 2019, 02:56 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 11 2019, 02:42 PM) *
Automotive was just an example, but even the most optimistic Hard Brexit enthusiast predicts the decimation of the automotive industry post Brexit.

https://twitter.com/RoryStewartUK/status/1056568783400243201



The motor industry issues are nothing to do with Brexit. It is a global downturn for varying reasons.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 11 2019, 03:35 PM

It's not simple but yes Brexit is dampening demand but also the uncertainty over diesel is also playing it's part with sales of diesel vehicles down 42%. Nissan is a shining example of this, the reasons behind them pulling planned production is partly down to this but also down to the fact that sales of the xtrail are down 24% Europe wide. The same story is true of other manufacturers as well. Project fear is alive and well.

Posted by: Strafin Feb 11 2019, 03:45 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 11 2019, 12:43 PM) *
Indeed. And there are far more important things in the world than the EU and Brexit. I for one can't wait for the 29th March to come and go so we can focus on something else.

Oh I don't imagine the 29th of March will be the end date for all this, not even if we actually leave. This is going to run and run...

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 11 2019, 04:04 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Feb 11 2019, 03:45 PM) *
Oh I don't imagine the 29th of March will be the end date for all this, not even if we actually leave. This is going to run and run...

Relax! Chill! Brexit is dead. At least in any meaningful sense anyway, whatever happens now no-one is going to be happy.

Posted by: newres Feb 11 2019, 05:26 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 11 2019, 03:35 PM) *
It's not simple but yes Brexit is dampening demand but also the uncertainty over diesel is also playing it's part with sales of diesel vehicles down 42%. Nissan is a shining example of this, the reasons behind them pulling planned production is partly down to this but also down to the fact that sales of the xtrail are down 24% Europe wide. The same story is true of other manufacturers as well. Project fear is alive and well.

The clip predates the diesel issues. Itís whatís predicted as a result of leaving the single market and the loss of frictionless trade. Farming is expected to be very badly hit too.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 11 2019, 05:43 PM

Prediction is not exactly a science, nobody knows what's going to happen yet but the doomsayers are out in force. Let's not forget TM was predicted to gain by a landslide, brexiteers were predicted to lose, Our Don was predicted to be runner up and WW1 was predicted to be over by Christmas.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 11 2019, 05:46 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 11 2019, 05:43 PM) *
Prediction is not exactly a science, nobody knows what's going to happen yet but the doomsayers are out in force. Let's not forget TM was predicted to gain by a landslide, brexiteers were predicted to lose, Our Don was predicted to be runner up and WW1 was predicted to be over by Christmas.


And Germany is going to go into recession. I guess newres and co will blame Brexit. And not Merkel. Or any EU policy.🤣

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 11 2019, 05:54 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 11 2019, 05:26 PM) *
The clip predates the diesel issues. Itís whatís predicted as a result of leaving the single market and the loss of frictionless trade. Farming is expected to be very badly hit too.

Point taken, although a prediction made over seven years ago probably doesn't carry that much weight.

Posted by: newres Feb 11 2019, 05:54 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 11 2019, 05:46 PM) *
And Germany is going to go into recession. I guess newres and co will blame Brexit. And not Merkel. Or any EU policy.🤣

The difference is that the one doing the prediction is the only economist that believes Brexit will be good for us and is the one trotted out by ERG. Imagine their embarrassment when the clip emerged. But actually forecasting is pretty accurate. They got the timing wrong with some things after the Brexit vote because the market reacted cautiously but if a no deal Brexit happens weíll feel the results for decades. Itís total insanity. Find a single economist besides Minford that sees anything other than a significant downturn.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 11 2019, 05:55 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 11 2019, 05:43 PM) *
Prediction is not exactly a science, nobody knows what's going to happen yet but the doomsayers are out in force. Let's not forget TM was predicted to gain by a landslide, brexiteers were predicted to lose, Our Don was predicted to be runner up and WW1 was predicted to be over by Christmas.

The BBC can't even predict the weather for tomorrow with any certainty!

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 11 2019, 05:59 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 11 2019, 05:54 PM) *
The difference is that the one doing the prediction is the only economist that believes Brexit will be good for us and is the one trotted out by ERG. Imagine their embarrassment when the clip emerged. But actually forecasting is pretty accurate. They got the timing wrong with some things after the Brexit vote because the market reacted cautiously but if a no deal Brexit happens weíll feel the results for decades. Itís total insanity. Find a single economist besides Minford that sees anything other than a significant downturn.

But Germany is going into recession, look at the economies of Spain, of Greece, even France is turning into a right mess! The EU is like all social engineering experiments doomed ultimately to fail.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 11 2019, 06:20 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 11 2019, 05:54 PM) *
The difference is that the one doing the prediction is the only economist that believes Brexit will be good for us and is the one trotted out by ERG. Imagine their embarrassment when the clip emerged. But actually forecasting is pretty accurate. They got the timing wrong with some things after the Brexit vote because the market reacted cautiously but if a no deal Brexit happens we’ll feel the results for decades. It’s total insanity. Find a single economist besides Minford that sees anything other than a significant downturn.

Ipsos MORI conducted an online survey of members of the Royal Economic Society and the Society of Business Economists on behalf of the Observer.
73% of respondents thought that real household incomes in the UK would be lower over the next 10 to 20 years, if the UK left the EU and the single market. This compares with 10% who thought that incomes would rise and 13% who thought that incomes would be broadly unaffected.
68% of respondents thought that the UK leaving the EU and the single market would increase the risk of the economy experiencing a serious negative shock. 22% thought it would make no difference and 8% thought it would reduce the risk.

That's out of 639 response, from economists. So just on this evidence alone he's not " the only economist " now is he.

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 11 2019, 06:37 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 11 2019, 05:26 PM) *
The clip predates the diesel issues. Itís whatís predicted as a result of leaving the single market and the loss of frictionless trade. Farming is expected to be very badly hit too.


If brexit achieves one objective and that is the end of live animal exports then it will be worth every penny. With 60 million to feed I would imagine UK farmers will be one of the major benefactors of brexit.

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 11 2019, 06:43 PM

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47196387

Even private eye couldn't make this up. Funniest thing I have seen all week, (oops it's only Monday). tongue.gif tongue.gif tongue.gif

Posted by: Berkshirelad Feb 11 2019, 06:44 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 10 2019, 12:09 PM) *
It's not nonsense sonny, after the war Germany was rebuilt, primarily by us, we poured money into the country in a humanitarian effort because we didn't want it to be a perpetual basket case.


Strangely, my recollection is more of the Marshall Plan and loads of US monies.

I will concede that Volkswagen grew out of the ashes of the war due to the foresight of a British Major at the time.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 11 2019, 06:56 PM

QUOTE (Berkshirelad @ Feb 11 2019, 06:44 PM) *
Strangely, my recollection is more of the Marshall Plan and loads of US monies.

I will concede that Volkswagen grew out of the ashes of the war due to the foresight of a British Major at the time.

We joined the party in 1950, meanwhile the good ole USA had ripped through German assets and patents and secured approximately $10 billion worth, (not to mention the rocketry of Von Braun). Dis you know the BSA bantam was just a re badged NSU?

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 11 2019, 07:46 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 11 2019, 05:59 PM) *
But Germany is going into recession, look at the economies of Spain, of Greece, even France is turning into a right mess! The EU is like all social engineering experiments doomed ultimately to fail.

The Germans and French are screwed. Fact. They have tried to absorb far to many countries (ring any bells) and far to many migrants in far to short a time period. The chickens are about to sit down and roost.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 11 2019, 10:31 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 11 2019, 05:54 PM) *
The difference is that the one doing the prediction is the only economist that believes Brexit will be good for us and is the one trotted out by ERG. Imagine their embarrassment when the clip emerged. But actually forecasting is pretty accurate. They got the timing wrong with some things after the Brexit vote because the market reacted cautiously but if a no deal Brexit happens weíll feel the results for decades. Itís total insanity. Find a single economist besides Minford that sees anything other than a significant downturn.

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/gilets-jaunes-fight-lyon-left-right-macron-ferrand-a8774276.html?amp

If even the Inde reports this you know the brown sticky stuff is hitting the fan..

Posted by: newres Feb 12 2019, 07:06 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 11 2019, 07:46 PM) *
The Germans and French are screwed. Fact. They have tried to absorb far to many countries (ring any bells) and far to many migrants in far to short a time period. The chickens are about to sit down and roost.

When will they be screwed by? The German banks will collapse this year - will it be before or after that?

Posted by: newres Feb 12 2019, 07:10 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 11 2019, 10:31 PM) *
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/gilets-jaunes-fight-lyon-left-right-macron-ferrand-a8774276.html?amp

If even the Inde reports this you know the brown sticky stuff is hitting the fan..

We survived the poll tax riots and France will survive these protests. The right wing narrative is that Europe is screwed so we're doing the right thing in leaving. It's only about disparaging the rest of the EU and saying we're better off out. I never hear anything positive about us leaving. Even Brexit's biggest economic fan says the automotive industry and farming will collapse and Rees Mogg says we'll know it it worked in 50 years! It's beyond stupid!


Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 12 2019, 07:48 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 12 2019, 07:10 AM) *
We survived the poll tax riots and France will survive these protests. The right wing narrative is that Europe is screwed so we're doing the right thing in leaving. It's only about disparaging the rest of the EU and saying we're better off out. I never hear anything positive about us leaving. Even Brexit's biggest economic fan says the automotive industry and farming will collapse and Rees Mogg says we'll know it it worked in 50 years! It's beyond stupid!

You seem a tad confused, one of the surprising things to come out of this message is just how many leave voters were from traditional labour supporters. Not very right wing then. Farming will collapse? Really? You dont think that with 'imported food prices will rise' scare stories prevalent that British farmers might not fill the gap? Oh, and we don't actually have a British car Industry as such, we make cars for foreign car companies.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 12 2019, 08:08 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 12 2019, 07:48 AM) *
You seem a tad confused, one of the surprising things to come out of this message is just how many leave voters were from traditional labour supporters. Not very right wing then. Farming will collapse? Really? You dont think that with 'imported food prices will rise' scare stories prevalent that British farmers might not fill the gap? Oh, and we don't actually have a British car Industry as such, we make cars for foreign car companies.

And it's doubly funny when you consider the biggest brexiteer is Jeremy Corbyn. Right wing? Don't think so. biggrin.gif

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 12 2019, 12:26 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 12 2019, 07:10 AM) *
We survived the poll tax riots and France will survive these protests. The right wing narrative is that Europe is screwed so we're doing the right thing in leaving. It's only about disparaging the rest of the EU and saying we're better off out. I never hear anything positive about us leaving. Even Brexit's biggest economic fan says the automotive industry and farming will collapse and Rees Mogg says we'll know it it worked in 50 years! It's beyond stupid!

Are you on day release? I do hope your carer knows you post on here...


Posted by: Strafin Feb 12 2019, 01:08 PM

Back to the old no argument/throw an insult plan then.

Out of interest, as I haven't got an answer from any other brexiteers, can someone give me a real and tangeable benefit of leaving the EU?

Posted by: newres Feb 12 2019, 01:16 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Feb 12 2019, 01:08 PM) *
Back to the old no argument/throw an insult plan then.

Out of interest, as I haven't got an answer from any other brexiteers, can someone give me a real and tangeable benefit of leaving the EU?

We take back control of our borders, our money and our laws!

But you're right. Between the lot of them on here they can't point to a single tangible benefit. The only one might be we'll get less immigrants and even that will only be true if the expected recession comes so they won't come here for jobs as there won't be any.

And whoever said it above is correct. The generally less well educated working class who are traditionally Labour supporters did tend towards voting leave.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 12 2019, 01:18 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Feb 12 2019, 01:08 PM) *
Back to the old no argument/throw an insult plan then.

Out of interest, as I haven't got an answer from any other brexiteers, can someone give me a real and tangeable benefit of leaving the EU?

More Haddock! (Apparently).

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 12 2019, 01:20 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 12 2019, 01:16 PM) *
We take back control of our borders, our money and our laws!

But you're right. Between the lot of them on here they can't point to a single tangible benefit. The only one might be we'll get less immigrants and even that will only be true if the expected recession comes so they won't come here for jobs as there won't be any.

And whoever said it above is correct. The generally less well educated working class who are traditionally Labour supporters did tend towards voting leave.


Yeah right, the less well educated? Did you go round and check? Or is the same old bias?

Posted by: newres Feb 12 2019, 02:33 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 12 2019, 01:20 PM) *
Yeah right, the less well educated? Did you go round and check? Or is the same old bias?

The data was well documented. I didn't make it up.

https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/how-britain-voted-2016-eu-referendum

Are you ever going to have something true and valid to say in this thread?

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 12 2019, 02:46 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 12 2019, 02:33 PM) *
The data was well documented. I didn't make it up.

https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/how-britain-voted-2016-eu-referendum

Are you ever going to have something true and valid to say in this thread?

You just can't stop being snide can you.

"older, working class, less educated and white voters opted to leave."

So you lump 'less educated' in with working class, older and white voters and miraculously every one becomes 'less educated' well done, how to mangle data.

Posted by: newres Feb 12 2019, 02:59 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 12 2019, 02:46 PM) *
You just can't stop being snide can you.

"older, working class, less educated and white voters opted to leave."

So you lump 'less educated' in with working class, older and white voters and miraculously every one becomes 'less educated' well done, how to mangle data.

Iím not the source of that quote. Itís the data. rolleyes.gif

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 12 2019, 03:18 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 12 2019, 02:46 PM) *
You just can't stop being snide can you.

"older, working class, less educated and white voters opted to leave."

So you lump 'less educated' in with working class, older and white voters and miraculously every one becomes 'less educated' well done, how to mangle data.

Pointless even trying to engage with this one, doesn't bother to read anything, doesn't understand anything, all he's interested in is trying to prove he's a left wing intellectual, which he's not. I can imagine him pounding the keyboard with his forehead, throwing it down on the desk then strutting around the room mumbling "I haz skilz, deyz all wrong, dey dunt no nuffink, der intetweb must be broke". I'm sitting here in my office giggling softly at his idiocy, just waiting for the next gem to tumble onto the screen. It's probably going to be "all right wing nazi voters are thickos". No plot twists here my boys.

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 12 2019, 04:10 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Feb 12 2019, 01:08 PM) *
Back to the old no argument/throw an insult plan then.

Out of interest, as I haven't got an answer from any other brexiteers, can someone give me a real and tangeable benefit of leaving the EU?


No more than an equally compelling argument to remain a member. Our destiny is in our hands and it is up to us to get off our backsides and build a prosperous country for the benefit of it's inhabitants as opposed to chucking the petty cash into the european collection box.
I voted to join in the early 70s to the derision of the old boys who had fought 2 wars and knew a great deal more than most about german aspirations. If they were around today they would give a wry smile and say "told you so".

Posted by: newres Feb 12 2019, 04:41 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Feb 12 2019, 04:10 PM) *
No more than an equally compelling argument to remain a member. Our destiny is in our hands and it is up to us to get off our backsides and build a prosperous country for the benefit of it's inhabitants as opposed to chucking the petty cash into the european collection box.
I voted to join in the early 70s to the derision of the old boys who had fought 2 wars and knew a great deal more than most about german aspirations. If they were around today they would give a wry smile and say "told you so".

Being at the heart of the largest most successful trading bloc on the planet doesn't swing it?

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 12 2019, 04:46 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 12 2019, 04:41 PM) *
Being at the heart of the largest most successful trading bloc on the planet doesn't swing it?

Being at the 💓 laugh.gif

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 12 2019, 04:49 PM

Trying to get away from the corruption maybe?

The European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker's best buddy, lawyer friend and previously chief enforcer (Head of Cabinet to the President of the Commission) Martin Selmayr has suddenly been promoted to the highest civil service position in the Commission - secretary-general - despite not being able to get the position by appointment due to not having served the required time in sufficiently senior roles.

How? Well, his experience meant that he was able to secure appointment to the role of deputy secretary-general, which became vacant in January. His appointment was confirmed at a meeting on February 21st.

The next order of business at that meeting was the resignation of the standing secretary-general, Alexander Italianer. In order to prevent a gap at the top of the civil service tree, Juncker then promoted the deputy secretary-general to the position of secretary general... which was his buddy Martin Selmayr who had just been appointed DSG five minutes previously.

*******. Bent. As. ****.

First broken by Liberation: http://www.liberation.fr/planete/2018/0 ... on_1632200
And, in English, it's being investigated. Good luck with that: https://www.theparliamentmagazine.eu/ar ... -promotion

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 12 2019, 06:33 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 12 2019, 04:41 PM) *
Being at the heart of the largest most successful trading bloc on the planet doesn't swing it?


Nope.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 12 2019, 06:49 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 12 2019, 03:18 PM) *
Pointless even trying to engage with this one, doesn't bother to read anything, doesn't understand anything, all he's interested in is trying to prove he's a left wing intellectual, which he's not. I can imagine him pounding the keyboard with his forehead, throwing it down on the desk then strutting around the room mumbling "I haz skilz, deyz all wrong, dey dunt no nuffink, der intetweb must be broke". I'm sitting here in my office giggling softly at his idiocy, just waiting for the next gem to tumble onto the screen. It's probably going to be "all right wing nazi voters are thickos". No plot twists here my boys.

I fear you may be right, I have tried but he's just not interested, just more anger, more bile.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 12 2019, 07:13 PM

It seems like Guy is getting in a little temper tantrum about Italy now.
Poor soul....

https://mobile.twitter.com/guyverhofstadt/status/1095384735323484160

Overwhelming support again in the replies.😂


Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 12 2019, 08:52 PM

Hungary is telling their people "Have four children and pay no income tax for life". So who's going to end up filling that financial gap.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 12 2019, 09:16 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 12 2019, 08:52 PM) *
Hungary is telling their people "Have four children and pay no income tax for life". So who's going to end up filling that financial gap.

That's what happens when you try to harmoginise many countries into one superstate.... still the EU stormtroopers will soon sort it...

https://mobile.twitter.com/Ozkok_/status/1094300752443592706




Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 12 2019, 11:04 PM

"The EU looks like the Soviet Union in 1991 Ė on the verge of collapse"

https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/12/eu-soviet-union-european-elections-george-soros

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 13 2019, 10:36 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 12 2019, 04:49 PM) *
Trying to get away from the corruption maybe?

The European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker's best buddy, lawyer friend and previously chief enforcer (Head of Cabinet to the President of the Commission) Martin Selmayr has suddenly been promoted to the highest civil service position in the Commission - secretary-general - despite not being able to get the position by appointment due to not having served the required time in sufficiently senior roles.

How? Well, his experience meant that he was able to secure appointment to the role of deputy secretary-general, which became vacant in January. His appointment was confirmed at a meeting on February 21st.

The next order of business at that meeting was the resignation of the standing secretary-general, Alexander Italianer. In order to prevent a gap at the top of the civil service tree, Juncker then promoted the deputy secretary-general to the position of secretary general... which was his buddy Martin Selmayr who had just been appointed DSG five minutes previously.

*******. Bent. As. ****.

First broken by Liberation: http://www.liberation.fr/planete/2018/0 ... on_1632200
And, in English, it's being investigated. Good luck with that: https://www.theparliamentmagazine.eu/ar ... -promotion


Further news today.
Express.co.uk: EU flouted its rules by promoting Juncker aide Selmayr to top Brussels job says watchdog.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1086201/EU-news-Martin-Selmayr-European-Commission-Ombudsman-Brussels-Jean-Claude-Juncker


Posted by: Strafin Feb 13 2019, 10:59 AM

That doesn't demonstrate a tangible benefit though. Just shows that politicians can and do all look after their own.

Posted by: newres Feb 13 2019, 11:44 AM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Feb 13 2019, 10:59 AM) *
That doesn't demonstrate a tangible benefit though. Just shows that politicians can and do all look after their own.

There isn't one. You can see from the above exchanges how illogical it all is. The people are the wealthy elite with their Range Rovers, yachts and board positions, but they haven't got a coherent argument for Brexit between them.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 13 2019, 12:16 PM

It's an oft-quoted thing. "Those who actively seek responsibility are almost certainly going to use it for twattery and should be denied it". Probably Abraham Lincoln or Morgan Freeman. Or Twitter.

Posted by: Strafin Feb 13 2019, 12:21 PM

Did you vote leave JSC ? You don't have to say of course, I am just curious. Especially with your French moniker.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 13 2019, 01:27 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Feb 13 2019, 12:21 PM) *
Did you vote leave JSC ? You don't have to say of course, I am just curious. Especially with your French moniker.

Actually, now someone actually bothered to ask, no, I didn't, I voted stay. However, if we had a second vote I might vote leave, I've got a contract with a French customer up for renewal this year that might fall through if we go 'no deal' but I'll face that if it happens. What I'm really in more interested in is that over 17 million voters voted leave and yet that is deemed irrelevant to some people. It's a matter of democracy in my eyes, something citizens of this country have laid down their lives for. It's important.

Posted by: newres Feb 13 2019, 02:56 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 13 2019, 01:27 PM) *
Actually, now someone actually bothered to ask, no, I didn't, I voted stay. However, if we had a second vote I might vote leave, I've got a contract with a French customer up for renewal this year that might fall through if we go 'no deal' but I'll face that if it happens. What I'm really in more interested in is that over 17 million voters voted leave and yet that is deemed irrelevant to some people. It's a matter of democracy in my eyes, something citizens of this country have laid down their lives for. It's important.

In that case you should accept that it was a snapshot vote on that day. There were lies told and there were protest votes (I know one person who voted leave but wanted to remain but give Cameron a bloody nose). The truly democratic thing would be a final vote on the deal or remain. Polls indicate 56% would vote remain now.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 13 2019, 03:57 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 13 2019, 02:56 PM) *
In that case you should accept that it was a snapshot vote on that day. There were lies told and there were protest votes (I know one person who voted leave but wanted to remain but give Cameron a bloody nose). The truly democratic thing would be a final vote on the deal or remain. Polls indicate 56% would vote remain now.


Nope, we had a vote, that's it, you can't keep the rerunning it just because you don't like the results. That way chaos lies, the result was arrived at democratically and like it or not it should be respected.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 13 2019, 03:58 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 13 2019, 02:56 PM) *
In that case you should accept that it was a snapshot vote on that day. There were lies told and there were protest votes (I know one person who voted leave but wanted to remain but give Cameron a bloody nose). The truly democratic thing would be a final vote on the deal or remain. Polls indicate 56% would vote remain now.


Ok but can we have another vote if remain only win by a bit?
I mean.. we need to be consistent.

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 13 2019, 04:47 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 13 2019, 02:56 PM) *
In that case you should accept that it was a snapshot vote on that day. There were lies told and there were protest votes (I know one person who voted leave but wanted to remain but give Cameron a bloody nose). The truly democratic thing would be a final vote on the deal or remain. Polls indicate 56% would vote remain now.


If you are of the belief that the great unwashed voted leave because of the rantings of Farage/Johnson/daily wail then you are as deluded as the ***** that think we will change our minds if they keep banging on about it. We voted leave because it was patently obvious that our politicians were more concerned with jollys with their EU counterparts than looking after the interests of the many. Oh the media threw the immigration stick into the pot because it suited vested interest to label leavers as right wing racists, (ring any bells?), but the vote would have been exactly the same had it been conducted 20 years earlier so even though you may consider it a folly, 17 million can't all be obtuse troglodytes with an iq of 4.5, so accept it graciously.

"If you do not like the answer then why ask the question?" seems appropriate. rolleyes.gif

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 13 2019, 04:54 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 13 2019, 03:58 PM) *
Ok but can we have another vote if remain only win by a bit?
I mean.. we need to be consistent.

Here's where it gets interesting of course, one of the 'reasons' we should vote again is because, and I quote " there is a whole slice of the voting public who weren't old enough to vote at the time, they should have a say!". Ok, so shall we have a referendum every year then? Because the logic (if you can call it that) holds true, there will be another slice next year, and the year after, ad infinitum. Nonsense logic, but some trot it out.

Posted by: newres Feb 13 2019, 06:03 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 13 2019, 04:54 PM) *
Here's where it gets interesting of course, one of the 'reasons' we should vote again is because, and I quote " there is a whole slice of the voting public who weren't old enough to vote at the time, they should have a say!". Ok, so shall we have a referendum every year then? Because the logic (if you can call it that) holds true, there will be another slice next year, and the year after, ad infinitum. Nonsense logic, but some trot it out.

You missed the bit about all the old gits that died. laugh.gif

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 13 2019, 06:25 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 13 2019, 06:03 PM) *
You missed the bit about all the old gits that died. laugh.gif


Thanks for reminding me. smile.gif

Posted by: newres Feb 13 2019, 06:52 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Feb 13 2019, 06:25 PM) *
Thanks for reminding me. smile.gif

What are you moaning about? Youíre still here. tongue.gif

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 13 2019, 07:01 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 13 2019, 06:03 PM) *
You missed the bit about all the old gits that died. laugh.gif

The funny thing is the average age of a UK citizen has risen since brexit. It is rising all the time and is now 40. So the whole argument is completely flawed.

Posted by: newres Feb 13 2019, 07:18 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 13 2019, 07:01 PM) *
The funny thing is the average age of a UK citizen has risen since brexit. It is rising all the time and is now 40. So the whole argument is completely flawed.

People are more educated though. More graduates.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 13 2019, 07:40 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 13 2019, 07:18 PM) *
People are more educated though. More graduates.

Graduates? Educated? You mean brain washed.🤣 They soon learn and become gammony as they age.🤣🤣🤣

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 13 2019, 07:51 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 13 2019, 07:40 PM) *
Graduates? Educated? You mean brain washed.🤣 They soon learn and become gammony as they age.🤣🤣🤣

Graduates in what? media studies? gender Studies? (yes that's a real thing) There always The Mc University of course. Jeez save us from this endless stream of mediocrity.

Posted by: newres Feb 13 2019, 08:57 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 13 2019, 07:51 PM) *
Graduates in what? media studies? gender Studies? (yes that's a real thing) There always The Mc University of course. Jeez save us from this endless stream of mediocrity.

Does it matter? Any discipline to degree level is surely better than no education? It means they are beyond O' & A' level. Media studies, if it means training in critically assessing what the media is telling us is surely entirely useful in the current left/right MSM/Non MSM debate. No?

Have you got a degree? What's your degree in?

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 13 2019, 09:05 PM

Sales n marketing. Followed by two year course (evenings) business studies.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 13 2019, 09:07 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 13 2019, 08:57 PM) *
Does it matter? Any discipline to degree level is surely better than no education? It means they are beyond O' & A' level. Media studies, if it means training in critically assessing what the media is telling us is surely entirely useful in the current left/right MSM/Non MSM debate. No?

Have you got a degree? What's your degree in?

In my view University should be for the top 10 percent of students who' show academic prowess. The rest should get a job or an apprenticeship (And yes serious investment should be made in vocational apprenticeships). University is seen as some sort of "right of passage" now and the old poly's are all 'Universities". For a lot it's just a 3 or 4 year jolly where they do 5 hours a week, end up with a 2 2 and 50k of debt that they will never have a job well paid enough to pay back. Crock of sh1t.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 13 2019, 09:11 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 13 2019, 08:57 PM) *
Does it matter? Any discipline to degree level is surely better than no education? It means they are beyond O' & A' level. Media studies, if it means training in critically assessing what the media is telling us is surely entirely useful in the current left/right MSM/Non MSM debate. No?

Have you got a degree? What's your degree in?

Time travel and fermentation science. Yes.. You can..

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 13 2019, 09:19 PM

Gender studies, shortest course in history, " right class, any idea how many genders there are?". "err, two sir?"
"Congratulations, collect your degree on the way out"

Posted by: newres Feb 13 2019, 09:24 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 13 2019, 09:07 PM) *
In my view University should be for the top 10 percent of students who' show academic prowess. The rest should get a job or an apprenticeship (And yes serious investment should be made in vocational apprenticeships). University is seen as some sort of "right of passage" now and the old poly's are all 'Universities". For a lot it's just a 3 or 4 year jolly where they do 5 hours a week, end up with a 2 2 and 50k of debt that they will never have a job well paid enough to pay back. Crock of sh1t.

To an extent I agree. When I went, that's exactly how it was - 10% went. I think there should be more than 10% and I think for most, degrees should be vocational - teaching, law, nursing etc. Certainly if you've got to pay for it, it ought to earn its money.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 13 2019, 09:29 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 13 2019, 09:24 PM) *
To an extent I agree. When I went, that's exactly how it was - 10% went. I think there should be more than 10% and I think for most, degrees should be vocational - teaching, law, nursing etc. Certainly if you've got to pay for it, it ought to earn its money.

Correct and vocational degrees like you mention should be free, with a prerequisite that you do a certain amount of time in the case of nursing for example say in the NHS after. You see we can agree on something. And yes ten percent is probably a bit low. 15 to 20? Free degrees for vocational subjects would encourage people to do degrees that would benefit society. Pay for your media studies or sports science..

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 13 2019, 09:50 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 13 2019, 06:52 PM) *
What are you moaning about? Youíre still here. tongue.gif


Second opinions are always welcome. dry.gif

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 13 2019, 11:41 PM

Also interesting is Toyota's decision to build the new version of the world's best-selling car at Burnaston in Derbyshire, producing more than 130,000 cars a year - along with 130,000 engines (including the hybrids) at Deeside - and employing 3,000 people.

If you've missed it - and the BBC hasn't even mentioned the Corolla in over a month - it's because it's certainly not as interesting a news story as absolutely no job losses from Nissan choosing not to make a couple of thousand large off-roaders a year in Sunderland because it can't make the Renault diesel engines Euro6b compliant and the diesel market share is shrinking to the point of Nissan cutting diesel engines (like most other manufacturers) before the end of 2021, and making the petrol versions would require shipping the petrol engines from Japan to be mated to the cars in the UK when it would be cheaper to just make the RHD cars in Japan in the first place. I mean BECAUSE BREXIT. DEFINITELY BECAUSE BREXIT.

Posted by: newres Feb 14 2019, 06:09 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 13 2019, 11:41 PM) *
Also interesting is Toyota's decision to build the new version of the world's best-selling car at Burnaston in Derbyshire, producing more than 130,000 cars a year - along with 130,000 engines (including the hybrids) at Deeside - and employing 3,000 people.

If you've missed it - and the BBC hasn't even mentioned the Corolla in over a month - it's because it's certainly not as interesting a news story as absolutely no job losses from Nissan choosing not to make a couple of thousand large off-roaders a year in Sunderland because it can't make the Renault diesel engines Euro6b compliant and the diesel market share is shrinking to the point of Nissan cutting diesel engines (like most other manufacturers) before the end of 2021, and making the petrol versions would require shipping the petrol engines from Japan to be mated to the cars in the UK when it would be cheaper to just make the RHD cars in Japan in the first place. I mean BECAUSE BREXIT. DEFINITELY BECAUSE BREXIT.

I confess I wasnít aware of that, however the decision was taken in 2017. No one with half a brain cell would have taken that decision now or in the last 12 months. I expect that like Nissan they were given assurances. The climate changed when it became clear that the EU would not capitulate on its principles and the loons started talking about no deal and WTO. Iím trying hard not to be disparaging about the members of the public that have picked this up and peddle the idea on phone ins and social media, but it is economic suicide and would deliver us back to the 70s.


Posted by: newres Feb 14 2019, 06:11 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 13 2019, 09:29 PM) *
Correct and vocational degrees like you mention should be free, with a prerequisite that you do a certain amount of time in the case of nursing for example say in the NHS after. You see we can agree on something. And yes ten percent is probably a bit low. 15 to 20? Free degrees for vocational subjects would encourage people to do degrees that would benefit society. Pay for your media studies or sports science..

Prince Charles is a big fan of free degrees I recall.

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 14 2019, 09:04 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 14 2019, 06:11 AM) *
Prince Charles is a big fan of free degrees I recall.


There was a consensus at the time that rather hoped the next queen was going to be one Shelia Ferguson but I'm afraid we had to await till the next generation before diverse marriage became acceptable in royal circles. Shame really as I think she would have done an excellent job but in hindsight she probably made the right decision.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 14 2019, 09:26 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 14 2019, 06:09 AM) *
I confess I wasnít aware of that, however the decision was taken in 2017. No one with half a brain cell would have taken that decision now or in the last 12 months. I expect that like Nissan they were given assurances. The climate changed when it became clear that the EU would not capitulate on its principles and the loons started talking about no deal and WTO. Iím trying hard not to be disparaging about the members of the public that have picked this up and peddle the idea on phone ins and social media, but it is economic suicide and would deliver us back to the 70s.

No, you weren't aware, because the only headlines the media are peddling are anti brexit. If Toyota aren't happy why don't they pull out like nissan did? Because it's got **** all to do with brexit. Oh and as expected, news brewing on both German AND eurozone economy.

"Germany narrowly avoided a recession in the fourth quarter, reporting only zero growth as foreign trade made little contribution to Europeís largest economy.

The lackluster figure released Thursday by the state statistics agency followed a 0.2% fall in output during the preceding third quarter. Business spending on machinery and equipment as well as construction supported the economy in the fourth quarter and kept Germany from suffering two straight quarters of negative growth, one definition of a recession."

"Claus Vistesen, economist at Pantheon, says Germanyís economy was held back by weak net trade and sluggish consumersí spending.

He fears that the eurozone growth figures, which will be updated at 10am, will be lowered from 0.2% to just 0.1% for the last quarter.

Just as bad as we feared, adding to our conviction that todayís second estimate quarter-on-quarter for the eurozone as a whole will be revised down, by 0.1pp, to 0.1%.

We donít see numerical details in this report, but the statistical office provide hints, indicating that domestic demand, mainly investment in construction and machinery and equipment, and government spending supported the economy. By contrast, growth in consumersí spending remained subdued, and net exports remained a severe drag on headline GDP growth."

All of a sudden it starts to look like this magical European powerhouse is running short of coal.

Posted by: Strafin Feb 14 2019, 12:05 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 14 2019, 06:11 AM) *
Prince Charles is a big fan of free degrees I recall.

Hes a fan of a free anything - what with getting given everything for free for his entire life. But maybe that's for another thread.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 14 2019, 01:46 PM

It was cold in Motown last night, Three degrees, Four Tops. 😀

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 14 2019, 03:26 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 14 2019, 01:46 PM) *
It was cold in Motown last night, Three degrees, Four Tops. 😀


Name dropping again I see. cool.gif

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 14 2019, 06:21 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 12 2019, 04:41 PM) *
Being at the heart of the largest most successful trading bloc on the planet doesn't swing it?

You don't say,
"EU BOMBSHELL: Economists claim 'eurozone is FAILING' for THIS reason
THE EU is not the force it once was and, according to credible forecasts, by 2050, it will account for less than a tenth of the worldís economy, two leading economists claimed in a book on the state of the bloc.". 🐒

Posted by: je suis Charlie Feb 14 2019, 07:09 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 14 2019, 06:21 PM) *
You don't say,
"EU BOMBSHELL: Economists claim 'eurozone is FAILING' for THIS reason
THE EU is not the force it once was and, according to credible forecasts, by 2050, it will account for less than a tenth of the worldís economy, two leading economists claimed in a book on the state of the bloc.". 🐒

Gonna be a basket case, Germany on the brink of recession, Italy in recession, French economy stagnating, Poland has a shrinking economy. Not looking good is it.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 14 2019, 07:33 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 14 2019, 07:09 PM) *
Gonna be a basket case, Germany on the brink of recession, Italy in recession, French economy stagnating, Poland has a shrinking economy. Not looking good is it.

It is for the UK if this rabble in parliament can extricate themselves from the trough of the EU expenses and the like.

Posted by: SirWilliam Feb 14 2019, 07:39 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 14 2019, 07:09 PM) *
Gonna be a basket case, Germany on the brink of recession, Italy in recession, French economy stagnating, Poland has a shrinking economy. Not looking good is it.


The result of letting clueless individuals run the shop. May be completely non pc to advocate unfettered entrepreneurism but it sure as **** beats state control. One does not have to be an accountant graduate to see where Europe is heading but they won't change until it's too late. Does that ring any bells? Viertes Reich anyone.

Posted by: Turin Machine Feb 14 2019, 08:02 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 14 2019, 06:09 AM) *
I confess I wasnít aware of that, however the decision was taken in 2017. No one with half a brain cell would have taken that decision now or in the last 12 months. I expect that like Nissan they were given assurances. The climate changed when it became clear that the EU would not capitulate on its principles and the loons started talking about no deal and WTO. Iím trying hard not to be disparaging about the members of the public that have picked this up and peddle the idea on phone ins and social media, but it is economic suicide and would deliver us back to the 70s.

Toyota already has the Burnaston and Deeside plants. They're simply building the Corolla - the best-selling car in the world - here (along with the Auris and Avensis) and continuing to build the hybrid powertrains here. That safeguards 3,000 jobs.

But that doesn't make the news. Instead Nissan choosing not to build the X-Trail here having previously decided to do so, and Ford pulling out make the news, because they're bad Brexit stories. Except Nissan's X-Trail decision is a business decision - it makes/sells a handful of cars, it's phasing out diesel because it can't make diesel fit emissions regulations (thank the French and Germans cheating for that one) and it's simply less expensive to make the cars and the petrol engines together in Japan. No jobs are at risk in Sunderland, not that you'd know from the "NO X-TRAIL BECAUSE BREXIT" reporting.

Meanwhile Ford hasn't made a car in the UK since 2005, and Ford USA is sick to death of the deeply unprofitable European division - which is valued at -$2bn - and is restructuring the whole thing. I'm pretty sure that the closure of Saarlouis (Germany) and Bordeaux (France) aren't much to do with Brexit. Sorry, I mean they're definitely because of Brexit.


Do we need to mention the government getting Airbus to warn everyone about hard Brexit while it's struggling to sell its awful A380 (it's great, but very expensive to make and fly, and not very adaptable) and has now cancelled it entirely. Obviously the 3,500 jobs at risk across Europe are because of Brexit...

Posted by: newres Feb 14 2019, 08:04 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Feb 14 2019, 06:21 PM) *
You don't say,
"EU BOMBSHELL: Economists claim 'eurozone is FAILING' for THIS reason
THE EU is not the force it once was and, according to credible forecasts, by 2050, it will account for less than a tenth of the worldís economy, two leading economists claimed in a book on the state of the bloc.". 🐒

That may be more to do with the growth of emerging economies as anything if it transpires. It seems to me that people are desperate for the EU to collapse because it would make our population look less stupid when our own economy collapses.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Feb 14 2019, 08:06 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Feb 14 2019, 06:09 AM) *
I confess I wasnít aware of that, however the decision was taken in 2017. No one with half a brain cell would have taken that decision now or in the last 12 months. I expect that like Nissan they were given assurances. The climate changed when it became clear that the EU would not capitulate on its principles and the loons started talking about no deal and WTO. Iím trying hard not to be disparaging about the members of the public that have picked this up and peddle the idea on phone ins and social media, but it is economic suicide and would deliver us back to the 70s.

We will never be back in the 70s. Thatcher saw to that. The days of Union's holding the Country to ransom are gone. More drivel from our resident remainiac...

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