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Posted by: Bofem Oct 8 2010, 03:34 PM

http://www.newburytoday.co.uk/News/Article.aspx?articleID=14740

The NWN has been sensationally blamed for the cracks in Victoria Park after extracting too many stories from the area.

Neighbours have complained to Newbury Town Council that a 300 word update this week is causing local interest in the story to subside.

One said: "They've been filling in the cracks every week by regurgitating stuff about the bowling green and football pitch. "

Survey experts have measured the wordcount every week since the summer, and found that coverage is growing by 50mm a week.

An NWN statement said: "Sod off! It's the town's biggest story since Woolworths closed."

Posted by: user23 Oct 8 2010, 04:33 PM

Posted by: Simon Kirby Oct 8 2010, 10:23 PM

Cracking story Bofem!

Posted by: Iommi Oct 9 2010, 10:58 AM

Opinion is split on the matter.

Posted by: Steve Price Oct 11 2010, 10:58 AM

The most noticeable thing about the Victoria Park story is how it's becoming clear that we're being "set up" for the survey report.....

First of all, it was noted that we - the people who are actually PAYING for the report - will be provided with full details of the survey "subject to certain legal considerations" - another way of interpreting this is to say that the Council can withhold certain elements of it IF the results might cause a storm of their own. Now we hear that the cracks aren't expanding - at least not last week - "because of recent heavy rain" - which immediately and fairly deliberately, in my view, creates the impression that such cracks as are already there will have been caused by the lack of rain earlier in the year. Never mind that we've had much drier years before, and never mind that we've had plenty of rain over the last month or two - all of a sudden "recent rainfall" has succeeded in stopping the problem in its tracks !

The Council has spun and spun the whole VISION thing for so long now that it's now GOT to be seen to have been a good idea. The Developer needs an underground car park because, without it, there's no space for parking and the development will fail miserably (not that it's exactly a runaway success to date, frankly). I fully expect we'll get a report heavily censored through "legal considerations" - and if we do, you can bet your bottom dollar it will be because neither party can be seen to be at fault and the best way to ensure that is to keep the whole thing secret. That in turn will allow negotiation on how much the Council will contribute to the "repair" of Victoria Park and how much will be considered a "goodwill contribution" from the Developer.

What I do find funny is the asphalt cover over the "goodwill pipe" the Developer laid to the Bowling Green - it's sunk by about an inch since they put it in !

Posted by: Bofem Nov 5 2010, 12:27 PM

Breaking news - there's nothing new on the cracks story.

http://www.newburytoday.co.uk/News/Article.aspx?articleID=15019

Posted by: Iommi Nov 5 2010, 03:56 PM

They stop dewatering and the cracks stop moving wider apart... funny that.

Posted by: user23 Nov 5 2010, 05:10 PM

The one of the driest spring and summers for ages is over and the cracks stop growing?

Who'd have thunk it?

Posted by: Iommi Nov 5 2010, 05:12 PM

I knew I'd draw you out!

Posted by: user23 Nov 5 2010, 05:13 PM

I've just got in.

Posted by: Simon Kirby Nov 5 2010, 06:24 PM

Actually they were still dewatering last night because I went and had a look at the outfall into the canal.

Posted by: Iommi Nov 5 2010, 07:11 PM

Sorry, misinformed; I had heard they had stopped (I was only really trying to draw a comment form user23 anyway! ).

Posted by: Richard Garvie Nov 5 2010, 07:19 PM

http://newburytoday.co.uk/News/Article.aspx?articleID=15019

Costain have told the media that pumping has stopped.

Posted by: Iommi Nov 5 2010, 07:26 PM

"The underground work which necessitated the water being abstracted has now finished and the pipes have been shut off."

Posted by: Richard Garvie Nov 5 2010, 07:38 PM

Maybe somebody forgot to turn the tap!!!

Posted by: Iommi Nov 5 2010, 07:51 PM

Maybe the water that is visible is residual water within the pipe network? Or maybe it is a major conspiracy???? Regrettably, I do think that the delays and the apparent secretive nature (WBC see the results in secret first) adds to the cynicism though.

Posted by: Exhausted Nov 6 2010, 05:57 PM

The survey was commisioned and paid for by the Town Concil, not West Berks Council. I do not think that WBC can expect to see the results in order to sanitize them in that case. If NTC do hide the results because of pressure from either Costain or WBC then I would suggest that there should be an investigation into the ethics of the town council. They are or should be independant of WBC and therefore have the right to ask for compensation from WBC as the developers or Costain as the contractors or civil engineers if the survey suggest that the pumping has caused the problem. I am surprised at User 23's comments about the driest summer etc. That really is a red herring but even if that was partially the culprit, it has been compounded by further water extraction. They are, I'm sure, capable of spinning their own web of deceit without help from us.

Posted by: David Allen Nov 6 2010, 08:31 PM

Hi, please trust me, we are independent of WBC and we will not be hiding any results from pressure of Costain or WBC or anybody else.

We simply want to know why the Park is in the state it is, and unfortunately it has cost us and therefore the people of Newbury several thousands of pounds to find out why it is in the state we find it.

WBC can request to see the results, but they certainly can't insist on seeing them.

Regards

Posted by: Exhausted Nov 6 2010, 09:03 PM

Exactly, and thanks for that honest update. There always seems to be a deal of confusion between the activities of Newbury Town Council and West Berks Council.

My last line "They are, I'm sure, capable of spinning their own web of deceit without help from us. " was aimed at WBC and/or Costain not NTC.

Posted by: Simon Kirby Nov 8 2010, 05:29 PM

Still dewatering today. The outfall pipe is attached to the stanchion of the Parkway Bridge.

Posted by: Iommi Nov 8 2010, 05:42 PM

So why are they dewatering when it is meant to have been switched off?

Posted by: user23 Nov 8 2010, 07:08 PM

Where did you read they were meant to have finished dewatering?

Posted by: HJD Nov 8 2010, 07:45 PM

http://newburytoday.co.uk/News/Article.aspx?articleID=15019

Costain have told the media that pumping has stopped.

Wake up at the back .

Posted by: user23 Nov 8 2010, 08:10 PM

It doesn't say that in the article you posted.

Posted by: Iommi Nov 8 2010, 08:22 PM

From the article above it says:"The underground work which necessitated the water being abstracted has now finished and the pipes have been shut off. "

Posted by: user23 Nov 8 2010, 08:27 PM

But they haven't have they, so it looks like the NWN have got it wrong.

Posted by: Iommi Nov 8 2010, 08:30 PM

Which is why I asked the question, but it seems strange that they would continue to dewater if the work that necessitated it has been finished.

Posted by: user23 Nov 8 2010, 08:34 PM

I haven't seen it reported that this work has finished, where did you see it?

Posted by: Iommi Nov 8 2010, 08:36 PM

From the article above it says:"The underground work which necessitated the water being abstracted has now finished and the pipes have been shut off. "

Posted by: user23 Nov 8 2010, 08:44 PM

Again no source. Basically the NWN just made it up didn't they, which goes back to what the original poster was saying.

Posted by: Iommi Nov 8 2010, 08:50 PM

They might have made it up, but they could have been lied to. Perhaps Cllr Allen could clear this up; to some here it looks suspicious.

Posted by: Richard Garvie Nov 8 2010, 08:53 PM

"The underground work which necessitated the water being abstracted has now finished and the pipes have been shut off."

- Quote from Newbury News

Posted by: user23 Nov 8 2010, 08:53 PM

I'd go with the former as there's no source credited to the statements.

Posted by: Iommi Nov 8 2010, 08:54 PM

ER, yes...we've already been down this one!

Posted by: Iommi Nov 8 2010, 08:55 PM

You may speculate, but I have read it in good faith and it seems a strange thing to report. BTW - the dewatering was scheduled to finish in November.

Posted by: user23 Nov 8 2010, 09:06 PM

Perhaps they should have sent someone down to check given the whole thing seems to be behind schedule.

It is after all, five minutes walk from their HQ.

Posted by: David Allen Nov 8 2010, 10:56 PM

Anything to oblige. The water pumping cannot simply be shut off; it needs to be gradually shut-down in an orderly fashion. Althought I agree the conflicting news and reports are a bit frustrating.

I've asked for an update from Costain tomorrow (9/11) and I'll post any reply I get.

Regards

Posted by: Iommi Nov 8 2010, 11:20 PM

Thank you Cllr Allen, a voice of calm in a sea of chaos!

Posted by: Bofem Nov 9 2010, 11:56 AM

Hey User. Do you still rent out your house in Park Terrace? Maybe you are in a better position to update us all.

Posted by: Simon Kirby Nov 9 2010, 01:11 PM

I have some questions the Council might like to answer:

Does the Council not insure against damage to the park's walls and buildings?
Does NTC have a repairing obligation to all of the affected buildings - even the toilet block?
Do any of the Friends of Victoria Park own property affected by the supposed subsidance?
Is the damage to the walls and buildings not a result of tree root damage and collapse after felling?
Couldn't you just have repaired the football pitches with a couple of dumpy bags of topsoil?
How much exactly is the survey costing?
Why is the survey delayed?

Posted by: user23 Nov 9 2010, 06:22 PM

I've never owned a house in Park Terrance.

In times gone by having one's own stalker was a sign one had made it in life. The stalker had to put time and effort into being a weirdo, going through bins, hiding outside the house of who they were obsessed with, and so on.

Nowadays all it takes for the lonely to attempt to become a stalker is few chinese whispers and a keyboard and they're away.

The Internet has so devalued the art of stalking.

Posted by: Richard Garvie Nov 9 2010, 06:58 PM

Can I ask what you are going on about now?

Posted by: Cognosco Nov 9 2010, 07:10 PM

If they do shut it off completely will the new underground car park become a new boating Lake?

Posted by: Iommi Nov 9 2010, 08:01 PM

Perhaps the person collecting the data pressed the delete key by accident.


There are rumours as to who user23 is and this is probably propagated by people using the Internet, as opposed to snooping around refuse bins for clues about ID.

I personally don't like people who would rather remain anonymous being 'outed' on forums. It smacks of vigilantism.

Posted by: Cognosco Nov 10 2010, 06:42 PM

Don't believe it should make any difference who he is or what he does for a living, whether self employed or employed, he is still entitled to his opinions if you disagree with him certainly tell him but he should not be stopped from expressing his opinions.

Posted by: Tania Feb 9 2011, 01:33 PM

Did we ever receive the results of the Hydrological Survey or are we still waiting?

Posted by: NWNREADER Feb 9 2011, 01:35 PM

yes

Posted by: Tania Feb 9 2011, 01:38 PM

Excellent ...
Are they online? And if so where?

Posted by: NWNREADER Feb 9 2011, 02:07 PM

There is the rub - typical of so many forum members you asked two questions in one........

Posted by: Iommi Feb 9 2011, 02:15 PM

Still waiting!

Posted by: Tania Feb 9 2011, 02:24 PM

Thanks I would have hated to have missed the results.

Posted by: Tania Feb 9 2011, 02:32 PM

Posted by: Iommi Feb 9 2011, 05:14 PM

Still waiting!

Hachi: A Dog's Tale

Posted by: dannyboy Feb 9 2011, 10:24 PM

Is this a Korean movie?

Posted by: Iommi Feb 9 2011, 10:43 PM

Close...but no cigar!

Posted by: Richard Garvie Feb 12 2011, 04:05 PM

Has the dewatering stopped yet? Still seems to be flowing into the river at the minute.

Posted by: NWNREADER Feb 12 2011, 07:48 PM

Last week there was info from the contractors it was still going on. can't remember where I saw it...

Posted by: Cognosco Feb 12 2011, 09:01 PM

Don't think they will ever be able to stop? Up until a few years ago there were pumps under some of the shops in Northbrook Street that were running 24 hours a day if they ever stopped the shops flooded. Somewhere near Smiths cant remember what shops exactly? Not sure if this is still the case though?
Victoria Park was always known to my Grandparents as the Marsh as it was always flooded apparently and has always been known to have a very high water table.

Posted by: NWNREADER Feb 12 2011, 10:22 PM

Look on any old map of the town and it is shown as marsh. Even now the northern end by the A339 turns to mud after rain.

I think there is one culverted stream under the football pitches, and another came under Marsh Lane (clue!) which is almost opposite Smiths....

Posted by: Cognosco Feb 12 2011, 10:29 PM

So as I stated in a previous post underground car park = indoor boating lake if pumps turned off then?

Posted by: NWNREADER Feb 12 2011, 10:41 PM

Maybe. That is a techie thing outside my sphere. But it is a question worth asking, and would then beg the question why the issue was not dealt with by any of the army of consultants used in the project......

Posted by: Richard Garvie Feb 12 2011, 10:54 PM

It was well publicised by objectors from what I remember... but West Berks know best ;-)

Posted by: NWNREADER Feb 12 2011, 11:03 PM

I do not remember the detail, but my vague recollection is that the objectors did not have the clout of the developers consultants. Maybe another situation where the Planning Officers were confronted with 'evidence' they could not counter in the face of an appeal, so had to let the proposal through. Now it is built the developers shrug their shoulders and move on to the next project.

Posted by: Iommi Feb 12 2011, 11:05 PM

We didn't have to sell the land to the developers...for £1.00

Nothing has been proved yet (to my knowledge), but should the problems be down to this development, the councillors that endorsed this should hang their heads in shame.

Posted by: NWNREADER Feb 12 2011, 11:15 PM

Problem is the Councillors follow Officers advice, usually. If the Members vote out something the Officers have to recommend for approval an appeal will surely follow, which the Council pay for, win or lose.

Posted by: Iommi Feb 12 2011, 11:22 PM

Then lets save money and get rid of councillors, they are pointless. Or even better, start firing some officers. Bear in mind this is all officially speculation at the moment.

Posted by: Ron Feb 12 2011, 11:26 PM

Shouldn't do IF it was built properly!

Posted by: Richard Garvie Feb 12 2011, 11:33 PM

Shhhh... don't mention the "A" word...








* Accountability

Posted by: NWNREADER Feb 13 2011, 12:03 AM

Or make developers accountable for the guff so many consultants pass off as expert findings. Consultants will always(?) present the case their paymaster asks for, then walk away protected by some E & OE or 'unforeseen circumstance' caveat.

Posted by: Cognosco Feb 13 2011, 09:43 AM

So far in this debate I think we can come to the conclusion then that the Planning Department is a waste of time and that councillors are superfluous? Lets save the taxpayer a lot of cash and just let the developers do what they want? OH hang on a minute......

Posted by: blackdog Feb 16 2011, 03:49 AM

In theory the Localism Bill will change this crazy situation - but the cynic in me is not yet convinced.

Posted by: blackdog Feb 16 2011, 03:49 AM

In theory the Localism Bill will change this crazy situation - but the cynic in me is not yet convinced.

Posted by: Richard Garvie Mar 9 2011, 04:21 PM

Has either the crack survey been published or the pumping stopped pumping water into the canal yet? I can't recall reading anything about the cracks and I seem to recall water being pumped into the canal as recently as yesterday. Anyone know what the latest is?

Posted by: dannyboy Mar 9 2011, 04:27 PM

Lots of water deep under PW on Sunday. Stream like almost.

Posted by: Richard Garvie Mar 9 2011, 04:32 PM

Do you think the pumping of water will ever stop?

Posted by: dannyboy Mar 9 2011, 04:39 PM

dunno. There were none of the large pipes used to take water to the canal rising from the open manhole cover where the sound of rushing water was coming from.

It was explained as being to do with the environmentally friendly way in which rainwater is collected & channelled away from the roof.

Posted by: Richard Garvie Mar 9 2011, 04:43 PM

So the rainwater is being pumped into the canal?

Posted by: dannyboy Mar 9 2011, 04:44 PM

No, the rainwater soaks into the ground, but has to flow there, from the roof to do so.

Posted by: Richard Garvie Mar 9 2011, 04:46 PM

So what water is coming through the big pipe into the canal causing the bubbles?

Posted by: dannyboy Mar 9 2011, 04:47 PM

You'd have to ask Costain. The question was not raised on Sunday.

Posted by: Cognosco Mar 9 2011, 06:52 PM

Torrential rain on Sunday was it then? Are all the roofs on yet?

Posted by: dannyboy Mar 9 2011, 06:57 PM

Clear & windy.

Not all roofs are on, but floors are all in, so in the absence of a roof above the highest floor acts as a roof.

Posted by: Cognosco Mar 9 2011, 07:36 PM

Yes thought so? Where was all the rushing water coming from then if not from the roofs when it was raining?

Posted by: dannyboy Mar 10 2011, 12:28 AM

Takes time for the water to soak away apparently. Something to do with flash flooding & its prevention, being ecological, upto 4 days for the rainwater to disperse. I'm sure if you email Costain they'll tell you all about it.

Posted by: blackdog Mar 10 2011, 02:02 PM

What has happened to the hydrological survey? Will it ever be delivered?

Posted by: Andy Capp Mar 10 2011, 02:19 PM

It's with the NTC lawyers.

Posted by: Exhausted Mar 10 2011, 05:39 PM

Somebody else having a bite of the cherry no doubt. It has already overspent by a considerable amount. Just goes to show, you can't buck big business it seems.

Posted by: Simon Kirby Mar 10 2011, 05:52 PM

Was that a typo?

Perhaps the Council shouldn't have mouthed-off so widely about it being all the fault of the nasty developers until after the results were in.

Posted by: Cognosco Mar 10 2011, 07:21 PM

A decent council may have had a chance I think but NTC?