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Newbury Today Forum _ Newbury News _ Isn't WBC wonderful?

Posted by: Berkshirelad Aug 1 2018, 10:14 PM

I have today received a letter from WBC about paying an extra £50/year to have my green bin emptied of garden waste from 3rd September.

I make the following points (in no particular order):-

1) The website referred to in the letter to either subscribe or obtain answers to FAQ doesn't work they have started it www. when they should have used info. Use the link in the letter simply results in a not found response.

2) The main website still lists 01635 42400 as the main switchboard number - despite this being changed to 01635 551111. Not even a automated transfer is set up. Just a snarky message about the change.

3) It also clearly stated in the FAQ that even if you leave the area (or worse, die), there is no refund proportional or otherwise - I'm not sure that a commercial company would get away with this.

4) I will not be succumbing to this extortion (small amount or not, it is extortion) and having to find it a single payment may not be easy for anybody on a fixed or low income. Any garden waste will simply go into the black bin I guess...

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Aug 2 2018, 07:39 AM

QUOTE (Berkshirelad @ Aug 1 2018, 11:14 PM) *
I have today received a letter from WBC about paying an extra £50/year to have my green bin emptied of garden waste from 3rd September.

I make the following points (in no particular order):-

1) The website referred to in the letter to either subscribe or obtain answers to FAQ doesn't work they have started it www. when they should have used info. Use the link in the letter simply results in a not found response.

2) The main website still lists 01635 42400 as the main switchboard number - despite this being changed to 01635 551111. Not even a automated transfer is set up. Just a snarky message about the change.

3) It also clearly stated in the FAQ that even if you leave the area (or worse, die), there is no refund proportional or otherwise - I'm not sure that a commercial company would get away with this.

4) I will not be succumbing to this extortion (small amount or not, it is extortion) and having to find it a single payment may not be easy for anybody on a fixed or low income. Any garden waste will simply go into the black bin I guess...


You would have thought the extra x thousand homes on the racecouse that must be generating millions of extra pounds in council tax would cover it. But hey I guess they must have built schools and doctors surgeries to cope with the extra demand....oh....

Posted by: newres Aug 2 2018, 08:46 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Aug 2 2018, 08:39 AM) *
You would have thought the extra x thousand homes on the racecouse that must be generating millions of extra pounds in council tax would cover it. But hey I guess they must have built schools and doctors surgeries to cope with the extra demand....oh....

The extra thousands on the racecourse does bring in extra revenue, but it also brings in more people. rolleyes.gif

Posted by: Strafin Aug 2 2018, 09:05 AM

fly tip. It's green waste it won't hurt anyone and it's the only way to send a message.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Aug 2 2018, 12:21 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Aug 2 2018, 10:05 AM) *
fly tip. It's green waste it won't hurt anyone and it's the only way to send a message.

Lots of people will be doing this. Or putting green waste in someones bim who has paid.

Posted by: SirWilliam Aug 2 2018, 12:24 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Aug 2 2018, 10:05 AM) *
fly tip. It's green waste it won't hurt anyone and it's the only way to send a message.


One wonders how the law stands on tipping "garden" waste? Like you say it's not going to cause damage and is no different to the council leaving the grass cuttings behind. The one that tickled me was that we are retaining the green bin for food waste but will not have it emptied should we add green stuff. In other words I can put my peelings in but not an uncooked potato.
Wake me up when common sense returns. rolleyes.gif

Posted by: On the edge Aug 2 2018, 03:58 PM

Well, when we were kids, Dad kept all his prunings and cuttings in a heap until November 5, then with the neighbours, we'd build a collective bonfire on a bit of waste ground in the middle of the estate. Us kids happy with fireworks and baked spuds, Mum's happy because no tea to get, dads happy, nice blaze and a good few pints of home brew. Fun when the blue lights showed up and squirted water, but a day or so later Council came and removed debris and raked over what was left. job done!

Posted by: SirWilliam Aug 2 2018, 06:52 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 2 2018, 04:58 PM) *
Well, when we were kids, Dad kept all his prunings and cuttings in a heap until November 5, then with the neighbours, we'd build a collective bonfire on a bit of waste ground in the middle of the estate. Us kids happy with fireworks and baked spuds, Mum's happy because no tea to get, dads happy, nice blaze and a good few pints of home brew. Fun when the blue lights showed up and squirted water, but a day or so later Council came and removed debris and raked over what was left. job done!


So you're suggesting that we pile up all our collective green waste in a convenient spot, say WBC's car park, and on a cold November night we chuck a match on it, after dowsing with a few gallons of 4 star, and await the fire brigade? This could catch on you know.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Aug 2 2018, 07:19 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Aug 2 2018, 07:52 PM) *
So you're suggesting that we pile up all our collective green waste in a convenient spot, say WBC's car park, and on a cold November night we chuck a match on it, after dowsing with a few gallons of 4 star, and await the fire brigade? This could catch on you know.

We could make effigies of some of the eejits that came up with this nonsense and dance around the flames...

Posted by: betsy Aug 4 2018, 02:37 PM

The NWN says that West Berkshire Council consulted with the residents? Does anyone know anyone who was consulted. Thought not!!

Posted by: Cognosco Aug 4 2018, 03:26 PM

QUOTE (betsy @ Aug 4 2018, 03:37 PM) *
The NWN says that West Berkshire Council consulted with the residents? Does anyone know anyone who was consulted. Thought not!!


Of course there was a full consultation as usual, a shout round the WBC office, all those in favour sa aye! rolleyes.gif

Posted by: newres Aug 4 2018, 05:43 PM

Will the council pick up the surplus to requirements green bins?

Posted by: On the edge Aug 4 2018, 06:25 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Aug 4 2018, 06:43 PM) *
Will the council pick up the surplus to requirements green bins?


Apparently not. Seems you can still use it gratis for 'food waste'. I'm holding on to mine because given the noise they are making, the LibDems will reverse the charge if they get a majority in next year's election.

I'm fortunate enough to have a reasonable garden, so I'm back to nice peaty November slow burns again.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Aug 4 2018, 06:35 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 4 2018, 07:25 PM) *
Apparently not. Seems you can still use it gratis for 'food waste'. I'm holding on to mine because given the noise they are making, the LibDems will reverse the charge if they get a majority in next year's election.

I'm fortunate enough to have a reasonable garden, so I'm back to nice peaty November slow burns again.

Most of the green waste will end up in the environmenrt. Unfortunaltely some people will also chuck none green waste at the same time. And they may not have done so without the new charge.

Posted by: Turin Machine Aug 4 2018, 07:35 PM

stick e lettuce leaf in the green bin and dump all garden waste in black bin. simples

Posted by: SirWilliam Aug 5 2018, 08:06 AM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Aug 4 2018, 08:35 PM) *
stick e lettuce leaf in the green bin and dump all garden waste in black bin. simples


According to the "small print" non contributors to the scheme will still have their green bin emptied of kitchen waste but not garden waste, and any such material found in said bin will not be removed. My question is are they not defaulting on removing my food waste even if it is contaminated by lawn mowings?
Or are they going to segregate at each property? rolleyes.gif

Posted by: betsy Aug 6 2018, 10:16 AM

QUOTE (Cognosco @ Aug 4 2018, 04:26 PM) *
Of course there was a full consultation as usual, a shout round the WBC office, all those in favour sa aye! rolleyes.gif

They didn't shout loud enough then.

Posted by: Andy Capp Aug 6 2018, 12:02 PM

Isnít this about trying to fill a funding gap?

Posted by: SirWilliam Aug 6 2018, 03:47 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Aug 6 2018, 01:02 PM) *
Isnít this about trying to fill a funding gap?


As the collection vehicle travels the same route whether it empties one bin or 20 then the saving is going to be minimal. The saving, if any, must be at the recycling plant and as most people will now be taking their waste to the Newtown road centre it is difficult to see how this equates. I can only surmise that the next trick up their sleeve will be to charge us for using that.

Posted by: Andy Capp Aug 6 2018, 08:10 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Aug 6 2018, 04:47 PM) *
As the collection vehicle travels the same route whether it empties one bin or 20 then the saving is going to be minimal. The saving, if any, must be at the recycling plant and as most people will now be taking their waste to the Newtown road centre it is difficult to see how this equates. I can only surmise that the next trick up their sleeve will be to charge us for using that.

Itís a money raiser, not a saver; to plug a funding gap.

Posted by: user23 Aug 6 2018, 08:34 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Aug 6 2018, 08:10 PM) *
Itís a money raiser, not a saver; to plug a funding gap.
It could well be. One council has all but gone bust, another is heading that way, with more county councils rumoured to be not far off. WBC being a unitary can charge for luxury services like this, so it has more money to fund social care for the elderly, or protecting vulnerable children.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-45058677

Posted by: Cognosco Aug 6 2018, 09:29 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Aug 6 2018, 09:10 PM) *
Itís a money raiser, not a saver; to plug a funding gap.


But only if enough people opt, or can afford, to pay for it. And with all the suggestions that it will increase the already increasing fly tipping it may actually cost more perhaps? unsure.gif

Posted by: Biker1 Aug 20 2018, 08:44 AM

You've probably all seen this, but just in case you haven't.....
https://www.change.org/p/west-berkshire-council-do-not-charge-residents-to-recycle-scrap-the-50-charge

Posted by: Strafin Aug 20 2018, 02:35 PM

If you require a second green bin, it's £70 as they have an admin charge for more than one!

Posted by: James_Trinder Aug 20 2018, 03:33 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Aug 20 2018, 03:35 PM) *
If you require a second green bin, it's £70 as they have an admin charge for more than one!


It could be worse. You could be living across the border in Hampshire where you only get two sacks and no bin for £35 per year, plus £17.50 per additional sack:

https://www.basingstoke.gov.uk/gardenwaste

All other local districts/counties/boroughs have a similar charge for a similar service so really we should be grateful that we are one of the last areas to implement this and have therefore managed to avoid paying this charge for longer than most. Of course you can still dispose of green waste yourself for free at the tip so you are paying for the convenience of not having to do that.

Posted by: Strafin Aug 20 2018, 03:55 PM

some fair and good points there James!

Posted by: newres Aug 20 2018, 04:13 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Aug 20 2018, 04:55 PM) *
some fair and good points there James!

Agreed. Iím in two minds about it tbh. Why not an option to pay for a weekly black bin collection as it would be better value?

Posted by: SirWilliam Aug 20 2018, 06:44 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Aug 20 2018, 03:35 PM) *
If you require a second green bin, it's £70 as they have an admin charge for more than one!


You can have mine for 50. One careful owner and now surplus to requirement. Delivery extra. cool.gif

Posted by: SirWilliam Aug 20 2018, 07:04 PM

So I am an elderly resident who no longer drives, ( tip not an option ), my only income is the state pension, ( £50/year is not within my annual budget I'm afraid ), but I do enjoy my garden even though it is only a front one and therefore a compost heap is not acceptable. So what am I supposed to do?
The above scenario is hypothetical but I am sure quite a few who fall in the above category will feel pressured in to coughing up the money even though they may disagree in principle.

Posted by: On the edge Aug 20 2018, 08:03 PM

QUOTE (James_Trinder @ Aug 20 2018, 04:33 PM) *
It could be worse. You could be living across the border in Hampshire where you only get two sacks and no bin for £35 per year, plus £17.50 per additional sack:

https://www.basingstoke.gov.uk/gardenwaste

All other local districts/counties/boroughs have a similar charge for a similar service so really we should be grateful that we are one of the last areas to implement this and have therefore managed to avoid paying this charge for longer than most. Of course you can still dispose of green waste yourself for free at the tip so you are paying for the convenience of not having to do that.


We aren't supposed to notice 'harminisation'. It will take a wee while but nationally, all refuse collection arrangements are slowly being harmonised. Bit of a debate about 'wheeled bins v plastic sacks but that's being sorted. Round here, the sophisticated inter authority accounting methods between councils to pay for dumps have been stripped out. We then get a basic arrangement, same nationwide that gets put out to a central agency......even less reason for WBC to exist!

Posted by: spartacus Aug 28 2018, 05:50 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Aug 20 2018, 08:04 PM) *
So I am an elderly resident who no longer drives, ( tip not an option ), my only income is the state pension, ( £50/year is not within my annual budget I'm afraid ), but I do enjoy my garden even though it is only a front one and therefore a compost heap is not acceptable. So what am I supposed to do?
The above scenario is hypothetical but I am sure quite a few who fall in the above category will feel pressured in to coughing up the money even though they may disagree in principle.
An elderly resident 'probably' doesn't fill the black bin in two weeks. I suspect they'd have room for a bag or three of garden waste if they only had a small front garden.

Front garden would be full of garden gnomes and other such tat that the elderly enjoy anyway.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Aug 28 2018, 09:04 PM

QUOTE (spartacus @ Aug 28 2018, 06:50 PM) *
An elderly resident 'probably' doesn't fill the black bin in two weeks. I suspect they'd have room for a bag or three of garden waste if they only had a small front garden.

Front garden would be full of garden gnomes and other such tat that the elderly enjoy anyway.

Unlike your's which is no doubt filled with old lager tins, doorless fridges and piles of faeces from your rotweiller. because that's what you people enjoy anyway.

Posted by: spartacus Aug 29 2018, 08:50 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Aug 28 2018, 10:04 PM) *
Unlike your's which is no doubt filled with old lager tins, doorless fridges and piles of faeces from your rotweiller. because that's what you people enjoy anyway.
A bit presumptuous... accurate, but presumptuous. Touchy though aren't we? . Do you have a collection of gnomes that you're a bit over-protective of? Wind chimes as well no doubt and 3ft plastic 'butterfly' things nailed to the front of the house and a 'dreamcatcher' behind those grotty net curtains of yours....


Anyway how come you're able to get online and comment? I thought you'd been banged up for running a brothel full of Vietnamese nail painters at your gaff...

Posted by: SirWilliam Aug 29 2018, 09:22 AM

QUOTE (spartacus @ Aug 28 2018, 06:50 PM) *
An elderly resident 'probably' doesn't fill the black bin in two weeks. I suspect they'd have room for a bag or three of garden waste if they only had a small front garden.

Front garden would be full of garden gnomes and other such tat that the elderly enjoy anyway.


I was under the impression that we, (the tax payer), were under an obligation to segregate green from general waste? Makes a complete mockery of an already shaky system if we are going to send everything to landfill.
Incidentally my gnomes have moved out on the premise, as yet unfounded, that any brexit deal will disadvantage their civil liberties.

Posted by: Berkshirelad Aug 29 2018, 08:53 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Aug 29 2018, 10:22 AM) *
I was under the impression that we, (the tax payer), were under an obligation to segregate green from general waste? Makes a complete mockery of an already shaky system if we are going to send everything to landfill.
Incidentally my gnomes have moved out on the premise, as yet unfounded, that any brexit deal will disadvantage their civil liberties.


Nope.

Councils have re-cycling targets and govt 'fines' if they don't do enough.

There is no legal duty to re-cycle on the individual.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Aug 30 2018, 12:03 AM

QUOTE (spartacus @ Aug 29 2018, 09:50 AM) *
A bit presumptuous... accurate, but presumptuous. Touchy though aren't we? . Do you have a collection of gnomes that you're a bit over-protective of? Wind chimes as well no doubt and 3ft plastic 'butterfly' things nailed to the front of the house and a 'dreamcatcher' behind those grotty net curtains of yours....


Anyway how come you're able to get online and comment? I thought you'd been banged up for running a brothel full of Vietnamese nail painters at your gaff...

Presumptuous? Moi? And how is life on the Turnpike these days? still eking out an existence selling drugs outside the school gates are you? How's that going?

Posted by: Strafin Aug 31 2018, 10:06 AM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Aug 29 2018, 10:22 AM) *
Incidentally my gnomes have moved out on the premise, as yet unfounded, that any brexit deal will disadvantage their civil liberties.

I think you will find the term gnome is offensive. They're vertically challenged.

Posted by: regor Sep 1 2018, 06:03 AM

Yesterday, in bitterness and resentment I had to give the council £50 so my green bin will carry on being emptied. There seemed no other choice, Trekinng to the dump every time there was garden waste (hard work and inconvenient), using the black bin (it is often pretty full anyway) fly tipping (not nice) were considered and rejected.

The gentlemen and ladies of the ruling party may come to regret this new levy come next election time. I sincerely hope so!

Posted by: SirWilliam Sep 1 2018, 08:27 AM

QUOTE (regor @ Sep 1 2018, 07:03 AM) *
Yesterday, in bitterness and resentment I had to give the council £50 so my green bin will carry on being emptied. There seemed no other choice, Trekinng to the dump every time there was garden waste (hard work and inconvenient), using the black bin (it is often pretty full anyway) fly tipping (not nice) were considered and rejected.

The gentlemen and ladies of the ruling party may come to regret this new levy come next election time. I sincerely hope so!


A very much local vox pop on the matter resulted in 4 saying no, 2 were paying and 1 didn't know anything about it. I think once it has settled down those turkeys who voted for xmas will do so again as those who objected will have forgotten this little fracas and be happily travelling up to newtown road twice a month.

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 1 2018, 12:12 PM

QUOTE (regor @ Sep 1 2018, 07:03 AM) *
Yesterday, in bitterness and resentment I had to give the council £50 so my green bin will carry on being emptied. There seemed no other choice, Trekinng to the dump every time there was garden waste (hard work and inconvenient), using the black bin (it is often pretty full anyway) fly tipping (not nice) were considered and rejected.

The gentlemen and ladies of the ruling party may come to regret this new levy come next election time. I sincerely hope so!

Doubt it; thereís plenty of Tory support in Newbs. £3 worth of builders sacks and an occasional trip to the tip is no hardship. Iíd have happily paid £5 a month more, but Iím not doing £50 on the nose; itís regressive. Iíd rather be out of pocket.

Posted by: Biker1 Sep 1 2018, 01:17 PM

QUOTE (regor @ Sep 1 2018, 07:03 AM) *
Yesterday, in bitterness and resentment I had to give the council £50 so my green bin will carry on being emptied. There seemed no other choice,

There was / is another choice and that is not to pay.
What happened to the process of collective protest?
If no-one had paid what would they have done then?

Posted by: Biker1 Sep 1 2018, 01:21 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 1 2018, 01:12 PM) *
£3 worth of builders sacks and an occasional trip to the tip is no hardship.

Yes it is.
Depends where you live and if you have access to a suitable vehicle.
Plus the additional cost and pollution of driving to the tip.
Where is the saving to the council anyway?
Presumably the same lorry will make the same trips using the same fuel but this time will be mostly empty. rolleyes.gif

Posted by: SirWilliam Sep 1 2018, 01:39 PM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Sep 1 2018, 02:21 PM) *
Yes it is.
Depends where you live and if you have access to a suitable vehicle.
Plus the additional cost and pollution of driving to the tip.
Where is the saving to the council anyway?
Presumably the same lorry will make the same trips using the same fuel but this time will be mostly empty. rolleyes.gif


Since when has logic been a town councillors forte? They will quite happily impose any harebrain scheme based loosely on the premise that they know best. One only has to look at the money wasted on cycle routes to follow their mindset.

Posted by: newres Sep 1 2018, 04:01 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Sep 1 2018, 02:39 PM) *
Since when has logic been a town councillors forte? They will quite happily impose any harebrain scheme based loosely on the premise that they know best. One only has to look at the money wasted on cycle routes to follow their mindset.

Whatís wrong with cycle routes? I think itís an excellent idea to provide a safe means of cycling. I think the St John Roundabout track is mad though.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Sep 1 2018, 07:02 PM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Sep 1 2018, 02:21 PM) *
Yes it is.
Depends where you live and if you have access to a suitable vehicle.
Plus the additional cost and pollution of driving to the tip.
Where is the saving to the council anyway?
Presumably the same lorry will make the same trips using the same fuel but this time will be mostly empty. rolleyes.gif

They still come and empty kitchen waste so as you say "where's the saving"?

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 1 2018, 07:47 PM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Sep 1 2018, 02:21 PM) *
Yes it is.
Depends where you live and if you have access to a suitable vehicle.
Plus the additional cost and pollution of driving to the tip.
Where is the saving to the council anyway?
Presumably the same lorry will make the same trips using the same fuel but this time will be mostly empty. rolleyes.gif

Itís not about saving money or the planet; itís about raising cash. With the amount of Monster Raving Tories this town has means it will succeed.

Posted by: SirWilliam Sep 2 2018, 08:13 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Sep 1 2018, 05:01 PM) *
Whatís wrong with cycle routes? I think itís an excellent idea to provide a safe means of cycling. I think the St John Roundabout track is mad though.


Quite! Exempli gratia; I quite often have to push a wheelchair on pavements that have a cycle track alongside. Half of the pedestrian route is so overgrown that I need to go on the cycle part where I am harangued by lycra lunatics who think they have a god given right to emulate Eddie Merckx. If that is not bad enough, the designer of said track has decided, for reasons best known to himself, to place ribbed blocks running at right angles to the path on the pedestrian side so once again forcing me over to the cyclist's M1.

I have nothing against the principle, just the incompetence of design and upkeep. angry.gif

Posted by: je suis Charlie Sep 2 2018, 10:36 PM

Do what I do, put a bag of kitchen waste in the green bin, put as much garden waste as I can in my black bin and burn what doesn't fit in. Winner winner, the WBC still has to empty my green bin for free, they take away my garden waste and I've reinstituted nice smelly bonfires.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Sep 2 2018, 10:38 PM

QUOTE (newres @ Sep 1 2018, 05:01 PM) *
Whatís wrong with cycle routes? I think itís an excellent idea to provide a safe means of cycling. I think the St John Roundabout track is mad though.

No cyclist is safe from Mr Range Rover, When they pay road tax is when I let em past.

Posted by: spartacus Sep 2 2018, 11:43 PM

QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Sep 2 2018, 09:13 AM) *
...If that is not bad enough, the designer of said track has decided, for reasons best known to himself, to place ribbed blocks running at right angles to the path on the pedestrian side so once again forcing me over to the cyclist's M1.

I have nothing against the principle, just the incompetence of design and upkeep. angry.gif
I take it you're not visually impaired? Lucky you. This newspiece gives an insight into the reasons for the different sorts of tactile paving, including the corduroy paving you refer to

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-44861568

Posted by: newres Sep 3 2018, 01:35 AM

QUOTE (spartacus @ Sep 3 2018, 12:43 AM) *
I take it you're not visually impaired? Lucky you. This newspiece gives an insight into the reasons for the different sorts of tactile paving, including the corduroy paving you refer to

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-44861568

Cheers. I didnít know that.

Posted by: SirWilliam Sep 3 2018, 07:53 AM

QUOTE (newres @ Sep 3 2018, 02:35 AM) *
Cheers. I didnít know that.


Neither did I, so it now makes sense. I will now negotiate without the usual mutterings of contempt. This still does not excuse the overgrown border.

Posted by: Strafin Sep 3 2018, 08:34 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Sep 2 2018, 11:38 PM) *
No cyclist is safe from Mr Range Rover, When they pay road tax is when I let em past.

Nobody pays road tax. Or was that your point?

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 3 2018, 07:56 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Sep 2 2018, 11:38 PM) *
No cyclist is safe from Mr Range Rover, When they pay road tax is when I let em past.

I pay car tax and cycle; kids donít so I presume they are your preferred victim.

Posted by: je suis Charlie Sep 3 2018, 10:23 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 3 2018, 08:56 PM) *
I pay car tax and cycle; kids donít so I presume they are your preferred victim.

Three questions,
a, They let you breed?
b, You didn't need a special licence or anything?
c, Are you sure they're yours?

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 3 2018, 11:45 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Sep 3 2018, 11:23 PM) *
Three questions,
a, They let you breed?
b, You didn't need a special licence or anything?
c, Are you sure they're yours?

Who said anything about me having kids? Thereís plenty of kids all over the place for you to run over in your Tory tractor. Your puerile and spiteful twaddle is wasted on me.

Posted by: Andy1 Sep 6 2018, 11:41 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp the bell end @ Sep 3 2018, 08:56 PM) *
I pay car tax and cycle; kids donít so I presume they are your preferred victim.


You don't pay road tax, you pay for VED, which has nothing to do with the up keep of roads.

Posted by: SirWilliam Sep 6 2018, 03:09 PM

QUOTE (Andy1 @ Sep 6 2018, 12:41 PM) *
You don't pay road tax, you pay for VED, which has nothing to do with the up keep of roads.


Tax is tax whatever the name. What it is used for is, or at least should be, the public requirement and road maintenance is just one of many. If you want better roads and safer cycle routes then pay more tax.

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 6 2018, 06:27 PM

QUOTE (Andy1 @ Sep 6 2018, 12:41 PM) *
You don't pay road tax, you pay for VED, which has nothing to do with the up keep of roads.

I said car tax and it is also known as road tax, both euphemisms for VED. Common knowledge, but you already knew that didnít you? tongue.gif

Posted by: Biker1 Sep 6 2018, 07:23 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 6 2018, 07:27 PM) *
I said car tax and it is also known as road tax, both euphemisms for VED. Common knowledge, but you already knew that didn’t you? tongue.gif

We know what you mean, he's just being pedantic.
Probably dates from the days it was called the Road Fund Licence.
Just like we still say MOT test.
Saying it has nothing to do with the upkeep of roads is not really correct as main highways are paid for from the general tax fund anyway.
Although I believe local roads are paid for by local taxation. Not sure where the demarcation is but I think it is between the Highways Agency and the local council?

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 6 2018, 10:19 PM

However, the argument remains intact: people who pay to use the road are resentful of those who donít.

Posted by: Biker1 Sep 7 2018, 06:42 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 6 2018, 11:19 PM) *
However, the argument remains intact: people who pay to use the road are resentful of those who don’t.

There are very few who do not pay for the roads as we have already established that there is no specific tax to do so.
Therefore every time someone pays tax, which is most of us most of the time, they pay towards the roads.
Just as they fund the maintenance and running of the railways, whether they use them or not.

Posted by: Strafin Sep 7 2018, 07:57 AM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Sep 7 2018, 07:42 AM) *
There are very few who do not pay for the roads as we have already established that there is no specific tax to do so.
Therefore every time someone pays tax, which is most of us most of the time, they pay towards the roads.
Just as they fund the maintenance and running of the railways, whether they use them or not.

Bang on Biker!

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 8 2018, 07:09 AM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Sep 7 2018, 07:42 AM) *
There are very few who do not pay for the roads as we have already established that there is no specific tax to do so.
Therefore every time someone pays tax, which is most of us most of the time, they pay towards the roads.
Just as they fund the maintenance and running of the railways, whether they use them or not.

I said pay to use it. Motorists have to pay a specific charge that other users donít.

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 8 2018, 07:10 AM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Sep 7 2018, 08:57 AM) *
Bang on Biker!

Yes he is, except he misread my post.

Posted by: Biker1 Sep 8 2018, 08:04 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 8 2018, 08:10 AM) *
Yes he is, except he misread my post.

No I didn't!
Mind you, it's not difficult with some of yours AC! wink.gif

Posted by: Strafin Sep 8 2018, 09:30 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 8 2018, 08:10 AM) *
Yes he is, except he misread my post.

I dont think your post is very clear then. There is no specific charge to use any roads other than the odd bridge and the M6 expressway!

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 9 2018, 10:00 AM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Sep 8 2018, 10:30 AM) *
I dont think your post is very clear then. There is no specific charge to use any roads other than the odd bridge and the M6 expressway!

Donít be daft both of you, a cyclist doesnít have to pay to use the road, car drivers do!!!

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 9 2018, 10:01 AM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Sep 8 2018, 09:04 AM) *
No I didn't!
Mind you, it's not difficult with some of yours AC! wink.gif

You demonstrably did.

Posted by: Strafin Sep 9 2018, 10:46 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 9 2018, 11:00 AM) *
Donít be daft both of you, a cyclist doesnít have to pay to use the road, car drivers do!!!

Please elaborate. Because it sounds like you're wrong.

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 9 2018, 05:16 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Sep 9 2018, 11:46 AM) *
Please elaborate. Because it sounds like you're wrong.

Cyclists donít have to pay VED!!!! rolleyes.gif

Posted by: Biker1 Sep 10 2018, 07:21 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 9 2018, 06:16 PM) *
Cyclists don’t have to pay VED!!!! rolleyes.gif

Let's run over it again for you Andy.
We have already established that there is no specific tax to pay for the maintenance of roads ...yes? (See post 57.)
So, although cyclists do not pay VED they pay taxes every day like the rest of us.
QED they pay to use the roads as do we all.

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 10 2018, 08:29 AM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Sep 10 2018, 08:21 AM) *
Let's run over it again for you Andy.
We have already established that there is no specific tax to pay for the maintenance of roads ...yes? (See post 57.)
So, although cyclists do not pay VED they pay taxes every day like the rest of us.
QED they pay to use the roads as do we all.

AND I SAID MOTORISTS HAVE TO PAY A CHARGE TO USE THE HIGHWAY THAT CYCLISTS DONíT!

Posted by: Strafin Sep 10 2018, 09:40 AM

I'm a cyclist and I pay VED

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 10 2018, 12:35 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Sep 10 2018, 10:40 AM) *
I'm a cyclist and I pay VED

Good for you, but that doesnít invalidate my point.

Posted by: x2lls Sep 10 2018, 02:00 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 10 2018, 01:35 PM) *
Good for you, but that doesnít invalidate my point.



I agree with you on this one.





Posted by: x2lls Sep 10 2018, 07:07 PM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Sep 10 2018, 08:21 AM) *
Let's run over it again for you Andy.
We have already established that there is no specific tax to pay for the maintenance of roads ...yes? (See post 57.)
So, although cyclists do not pay VED they pay taxes every day like the rest of us.
QED they pay to use the roads as do we all.



There is a specific payment required, aimed at any motor vehicle user and owner. It does not apply to cyclists.

THAT is AC's point.

Posted by: Berkshirelad Sep 10 2018, 07:15 PM

QUOTE (x2lls @ Sep 10 2018, 08:07 PM) *
There is a specific payment required, aimed at any motor vehicle user and owner. It does not apply to cyclists.

THAT is AC's point.


...but it goes to central funds - it is not a Road Fund and hasn't been for decades

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 10 2018, 07:21 PM

QUOTE (Berkshirelad @ Sep 10 2018, 08:15 PM) *
...but it goes to central funds - it is not a Road Fund and hasn't been for decades

We know.

Posted by: Andy1 Sep 10 2018, 07:42 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 10 2018, 09:29 AM) *
AND I SAID MOTORISTS HAVE TO PAY A CHARGE TO USE THE HIGHWAY THAT CYCLISTS DON’T!


No they don't, they're are not paying to use the roads, the only road that motorists pay to use are toll roads or congestion zones, none of which apply to A band motor vehicles or electric.

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 10 2018, 10:07 PM

QUOTE (Andy1 @ Sep 10 2018, 08:42 PM) *
No they don't, they're are not paying to use the roads, the only road that motorists pay to use are toll roads or congestion zones, none of which apply to A band motor vehicles or electric.

ďVehicle Excise Duty (VED) (also known as "vehicle tax", "car tax" or "road tax", and formerly as a "tax disc") is a tax that is levied as an excise duty and which must be paid for most types of vehicles which are to be used (or parked) on public roads in the United Kingdom.Ē

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vehicle_Excise_Duty

Posted by: Biker1 Sep 11 2018, 07:18 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 10 2018, 09:29 AM) *
AND I SAID MOTORISTS HAVE TO PAY A CHARGE TO USE THE HIGHWAY THAT CYCLISTS DONíT!

Well I don't.
My VED is £0.00.............HAH!!!! tongue.gif

Posted by: x2lls Sep 11 2018, 09:04 AM

QUOTE (Berkshirelad @ Sep 10 2018, 08:15 PM) *
...but it goes to central funds - it is not a Road Fund and hasn't been for decades



Regardless where it goes, if you don't pay you are breaking the law.

Posted by: Biker1 Sep 11 2018, 11:15 AM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ Sep 11 2018, 08:18 AM) *
Well I don't.
My VED is £0.00.............HAH!!!! tongue.gif

Don't think pure electric vehicles pay either do they?

Posted by: Strafin Sep 11 2018, 01:38 PM

I don't think VED is a law either is it? Surely that would be an act?

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 11 2018, 04:50 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Sep 11 2018, 02:38 PM) *
I don't think VED is a law either is it? Surely that would be an act?

That should save you a few quid then.

Posted by: Strafin Sep 11 2018, 04:56 PM

Breaking the law can put you in jail. Not paying VED won't. But lets not let facts get in the way, this is the NewburyToday forum after all.

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 11 2018, 05:49 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Sep 11 2018, 05:56 PM) *
Breaking the law can put you in jail. Not paying VED won't. But lets not let facts get in the way, this is the NewburyToday forum after all.

Not paying the fine will ultimately land you in gaol.

Posted by: Strafin Sep 12 2018, 08:46 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 11 2018, 06:49 PM) *
Not paying the fine will ultimately land you in gaol.

I don't believe that is true.

Non payment of criminal fines or council tax are the only bills which you can be imprisoned for as far as I can tell. Happy to be corrected but I can't find anything to suggest otherwise. Non payment of VED incurs a charge not a fine.

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 12 2018, 09:08 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Sep 12 2018, 09:46 AM) *
I don't believe that is true.

Non payment of criminal fines or council tax are the only bills which you can be imprisoned for as far as I can tell. Happy to be corrected but I can't find anything to suggest otherwise. Non payment of VED incurs a charge not a fine.

Being found to have a motor vehicle on the road without VED can mean:

Out of Court Settlement (OCS) letter issued.

OCS set at £30 plus one and a half times the outstanding vehicle tax rate.

If settlement is not paid, as a criminal offence the case may be pursued via the Magistrates Court. Penalty is the greater of £1,000 or five times the amount of tax chargeable.

Vehicle may be clamped.

I believe not setting Magistrates' court fines could then lead to prison, even if unlikely.


Posted by: Strafin Sep 14 2018, 08:22 AM

The offence of not paying a fine is different and seperate though, even if it is related.

Posted by: Andy Capp Sep 14 2018, 09:17 PM

QUOTE (Strafin @ Sep 14 2018, 09:22 AM) *
The offence of not paying a fine is different and seperate though, even if it is related.

In my statement I said Ďultimatelyí for that reason.

Posted by: Turin Machine Sep 15 2018, 07:27 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Sep 14 2018, 10:17 PM) *
In my statement I said Ďultimatelyí for that reason.

And you are of course quite right.

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