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> Nelson Mandela
spartacus
post Jun 24 2013, 02:05 AM
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At some stage President Zuma is going to allow Mandela's family to pull the plug on the fella (he's teetering on the edge of death if he hasn't actually pegged it by the time I post this) and that will be the signal for global mourning, hours of TV news articles taking over all schedules (on every channel, so no escape), forcible wearing of black arm bands by everyone in the western world, pseudo-'sincere' messages from everyone from Tony Blair to Ginger Spice and any other sort of 'recognised grieving signals' that Guardian readers and Daily Mail readers can think of....


I've a sneaky feeling that anyone caught not taking part will be branded a racist.... and I don't like that thought. Why do we have to care or pretend to be interested?


Thing is, it was something that someone was chatting about at a party over the weekend. Normal small talk rubbish, but when this subject came up suddenly it got all serious. I said I couldn't care less about Mandela and that sort of kicked things off........ Drink was involved so it didn't take much for one of the wives to jump onto a soap box and spout some pretend politics, and then she needed backing up by hubby, and anyone that put an alternative view in about the state of South African politics was branded a racist Boer bore....


If he pegs it (and he will) would you be happy if the Council (and Buck' House) flew their flags at half mast? (I said no, but THAT response did not get me any points at the party and I ended up getting grabbed by the scruff of the neck by Mrs Spartacus and we toddled off home....)

Hope we get invited back for the Mandela Street Party.....
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motormad
post Jun 24 2013, 07:41 AM
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I don't think it's racist if you don't care about what Mandella has done for this world.
It's ignorant yes, racist no.

Just like Ross Kemp on Gangs.. on the impressions show.
"I could see things were about to kick off, so I got out of there."


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shedboy
post Jun 24 2013, 10:23 AM
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Oh dear Spartacus, we are all entitled to our own view but I do feel saddened by your feelings (or lack of them ) on this matter.
I agree, this is ignorance rather than racism. It would be good if you could at least show a little respect for Mr Mandala, his friends & family at this difficult time for them all.
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Andy Capp
post Jun 24 2013, 12:14 PM
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Sometimes it is worth considering if what one is about to say will improve upon the silence.
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TallDarkAndHands...
post Jun 24 2013, 01:03 PM
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Though freedom of speech is something Mandela himself would approve of.....
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Andy Capp
post Jun 24 2013, 01:08 PM
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Being free to say what one thinks about things doesn't make someone immune from being rude. Just because we are free to think what we like, we have to accept that there are consequences to letting other people know what those thoughts are.
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pbonnay
post Jun 24 2013, 03:29 PM
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By many accounts, Nelson Mandela was a nasty piece of work as a young man. But, following release from his long incarceration he did a lot of good. He brought hope and some reconciliation to a very troubled part of the world - and for that he will be remembered in positive terms by many.

It is his first wife, Winnie, who I think deserves to be judged harshly.
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Strafin
post Jun 24 2013, 03:32 PM
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I don't care that much, he did a lot of good, but he also did a lot of bad, including murder I believe. I'm with you, there's nothing wrong with your views, I think the people at the party sound more ignorant for not accepting that there are more than one train of thought on the subject. It will be a sad day for a lot of people, but I wouldn't see a reason to fly the state flag here at half mast.
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motormad
post Jun 24 2013, 04:04 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jun 24 2013, 02:08 PM) *
Being free to say what one thinks about things doesn't make someone immune from being rude. Just because we are free to think what we like, we have to accept that there are consequences to letting other people know what those thoughts are.


A lot of people also cannot differentiate being honest with being rude.


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CBW137Y
post Jun 24 2013, 04:26 PM
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QUOTE (pbonnay @ Jun 24 2013, 04:29 PM) *
It is his first wife, Winnie, who I think deserves to be judged harshly.


Winnie was his second wife. Just to be irritatingly pedantic wink.gif
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Simon Kirby
post Jun 24 2013, 06:22 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jun 24 2013, 01:14 PM) *
Sometimes it is worth considering if what one is about to say will improve upon the silence.

smile.gif


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newres
post Jun 25 2013, 08:21 PM
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He will be more deserving of an outpouring than Diana. Now that was vomit inducing.
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Squelchy
post Jun 26 2013, 09:31 PM
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QUOTE (spartacus @ Jun 24 2013, 03:05 AM) *
I said I couldn't care less about Mandela and that sort of kicked things off.



You're entitled to hold an opinion. That doesn't automatically mean it's one that's entitled to respect though.

What's going to be really nauseating is watching Cameron stand up and hail Mandela as some kind of Statesman.

In 1985 Cameron was a leading light in the Federation of Conservative Students who produced the infamous "Hang Nelson Mandela" posters. Then, in 1989 when he worked in the Tory Policy Unit at Conservative Central Office he went on an anti-sanctions 'fact finding' mission to South Africa with a pro apartheid Lobby firm which was then found to be sponsored by Botha himself.

Lets see how two-faced Cameron can be when Mandela finally shuffles off.
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motormad
post Jun 27 2013, 06:55 PM
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I heard on the news his condition has improved although he is still in what they call a serious state.


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NWNREADER
post Jun 27 2013, 07:29 PM
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QUOTE (motormad @ Jun 27 2013, 07:55 PM) *
I heard on the news his condition has improved although he is still in what they call a serious state.



Indeed. South Africa is not to be sniffed at, and definitely not laughed at
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x2lls
post Jun 27 2013, 08:12 PM
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QUOTE (newres @ Jun 25 2013, 09:21 PM) *
He will be more deserving of an outpouring than Diana. Now that was vomit inducing.



Why?

Totally different people, no comparison.


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Andy Capp
post Jun 27 2013, 08:12 PM
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QUOTE (motormad @ Jun 27 2013, 07:55 PM) *
I heard on the news his condition has improved although he is still in what they call a serious state.

One last big blast of morphine I would imagine! mellow.gif That's how some of my family members have spent there last days in the 'Rainbow Rooms' anyway, RIP. sad.gif
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user23
post Jun 27 2013, 08:16 PM
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QUOTE (NWNREADER @ Jun 27 2013, 08:29 PM) *
Indeed. South Africa is not to be sniffed at, and definitely not laughed at
Well I got it, if no one else did.
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Andy Capp
post Jun 27 2013, 08:18 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Jun 27 2013, 09:16 PM) *
Well I got it, if no one else did.

So did I, but let's say I didn't need a corset to stop my sides from splitting! tongue.gif
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Exhausted
post Jun 30 2013, 06:24 PM
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At least South Africa devolved into a reasonable place to live even though the crime rate is out of control. The opposite side of the coin is the way Zimbabwe has, through corrupt government, crippled itself since becoming independent.
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