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Newbury Today Forum _ Random Rants _ Monster Rabid Tories pledge to give MPs free vote on fox hunting

Posted by: Andy Capp May 10 2017, 01:34 PM

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/09/theresa-may-pledges-lift-dropping-fox-hunting-pledge-conservative

"As it happens personally I have always been in favour of fox hunting and we maintain our commitment. We have had a commitment previously as a Conservative Party to allow a free vote and that’s what it will allow, would allow, Parliament the opportunity to take a decision on this.” - Theresa May PM, 2017.

Another reason not to vote for them.

Posted by: newres May 10 2017, 01:40 PM

What's wrong with that? They didn't like the result of the last vote so they're having another. Oh, hold on.....

Posted by: Andy Capp May 10 2017, 03:45 PM

QUOTE (newres @ May 10 2017, 02:40 PM) *
What's wrong with that? They didn't like the result of the last vote so they're having another. Oh, hold on.....

It wasn't her party that called for foxit, but some Noncester Rabid Tories miss their slaughter and gin.

A hunting ban is all rather left wing for their liking, what!

Posted by: blackdog May 10 2017, 04:25 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 10 2017, 02:34 PM) *
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/09/theresa-may-pledges-lift-dropping-fox-hunting-pledge-conservative

"As it happens personally I have always been in favour of fox hunting and we maintain our commitment. We have had a commitment previously as a Conservative Party to allow a free vote and that’s what it will allow, would allow, Parliament the opportunity to take a decision on this.” - Theresa May PM, 2017.

Another reason not to vote for them.


Perhaps she'd like to give Parliament a free vote on every other issue as well. Or would that be too democratic?

Posted by: Biker1 May 10 2017, 05:46 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 10 2017, 02:34 PM) *
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/09/theresa-may-pledges-lift-dropping-fox-hunting-pledge-conservative

"As it happens personally I have always been in favour of fox hunting and we maintain our commitment. We have had a commitment previously as a Conservative Party to allow a free vote and that’s what it will allow, would allow, Parliament the opportunity to take a decision on this.” - Theresa May PM, 2017.

Another reason not to vote for them.

Yep, Just lost mine as well!! angry.gif

Posted by: Simon Kirby May 10 2017, 06:55 PM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ May 10 2017, 06:46 PM) *
Yep, Just lost mine as well!! angry.gif

I voted Lib Dem when Rendel last stood in Newbury on this single issue - I always admired that he made such a definite anti-hunting stand in a constituency where that was obviously going to cost him votes. For me it's just another reason why I'm voting Labour.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 10 2017, 07:04 PM

Although I very much doubt it, this just might throw Labour a lifeline. Just need to get the young adults motivated to vote, if only on this issue. If the Noncester Rabid Twot part have a landslide, then there's a strong possibility of a return to fox hunting.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 10 2017, 07:06 PM

In West Berkshire that would mean voting Limp Dem, but I suspect Toryboi will walk it!

Posted by: Simon Kirby May 10 2017, 07:21 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 10 2017, 08:06 PM) *
In West Berkshire that would mean voting Limp Dem, but I suspect Toryboi will walk it!

The best a Lib Dem vote does is produce a Tory coalition, and I don't want a Tory government. It's got to be Labour, for this and all the other social-justice reasons.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 10 2017, 07:29 PM

QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ May 10 2017, 08:21 PM) *
The best a Lib Dem vote does is produce a Tory coalition, and I don't want a Tory government. It's got to be Labour, for this and all the other social-justice reasons.

I'd give up work if Labour got in. May as well enjoy a good spend and max out all the cards. The country will be bust so may as well join in.

Posted by: Simon Kirby May 10 2017, 08:00 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 10 2017, 08:29 PM) *
I'd give up work if Labour got in. May as well enjoy a good spend and max out all the cards. The country will be bust so may as well join in.

Labour have pledged to invest £500 billion in infrastructure and industry so that people have jobs - don't you want people to have jobs and work for a living?

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 10 2017, 08:12 PM

QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ May 10 2017, 09:00 PM) *
Labour have pledged to invest £500 billion in infrastructure and industry so that people have jobs - don't you want people to have jobs and work for a living?


I want people to have jobs as a result of responsible government spending. For some reason if you borrow 500 billion you then have to pay it back... With interest. Otherwise the IMF give you a greek style rating and it costs you a lot more to borrow. But hey why bother with economics. Free money for everyone!!

Posted by: Simon Kirby May 10 2017, 08:24 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 10 2017, 09:12 PM) *
I want people to have jobs as a result of responsible government spending. For some reason if you borrow 500 billion you then have to pay it back... With interest. Otherwise the IMF give you a greek style rating and it costs you a lot more to borrow. But hey why bother with economics. Free money for everyone!!

But aren't you always moaning about the cost of keeping the jobless on the dole? And don't you strongly support the £200Billion cost of the Trident defence-job scheme? Labour's pledge is not a job scheme, Labour are pledging to invest that money in infrastructure and industry so that Britain can have manufacturing jobs rather than depending so heavily on a fragile service industry.

Posted by: On the edge May 10 2017, 08:32 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 10 2017, 09:12 PM) *
I want people to have jobs as a result of responsible government spending. For some reason if you borrow 500 billion you then have to pay it back... With interest. Otherwise the IMF give you a greek style rating and it costs you a lot more to borrow. But hey why bother with economics. Free money for everyone!!


It's rather odd that with your anti socialist stance, you are happy to see state protected continental firms buying our infrastructure and then ripping us off for use. By the way, even George Osbourne was getting worried about the jobs that Tory investment / city policy was delivering. Do your kids like burgers?

Even round here we can see 'responsible' spending by the coalition partners in our local councils. Strip out affordable homes, libraries etc but build a splash pad and spend big on the control tower? Do we really want that? No, Labour is the only answer.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 10 2017, 09:00 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 10 2017, 09:32 PM) *
It's rather odd that with your anti socialist stance, you are happy to see state protected continental firms buying our infrastructure and then ripping us off for use. By the way, even George Osbourne was getting worried about the jobs that Tory investment / city policy was delivering. Do your kids like burgers?

Even round here we can see 'responsible' spending by the coalition partners in our local councils. Strip out affordable homes, libraries etc but build a splash pad and spend big on the control tower? Do we really want that? No, Labour is the only answer.


You vote Labour if it makes you feel better. Im just glad they have zero chance of getting elected.😄

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 10 2017, 09:04 PM

QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ May 10 2017, 09:24 PM) *
But aren't you always moaning about the cost of keeping the jobless on the dole? And don't you strongly support the £200Billion cost of the Trident defence-job scheme? Labour's pledge is not a job scheme, Labour are pledging to invest that money in infrastructure and industry so that Britain can have manufacturing jobs rather than depending so heavily on a fragile service industry.


I understand your view Simon. I just disagree. I think Labour would bankrupt the Country and leave future generations in even greater trouble trying to pay back an unaffordable national debt. They do have "history".

Posted by: Andy Capp May 10 2017, 09:22 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 10 2017, 08:29 PM) *
I'd give up work if Labour got in.

I don't know you but I doubt you would. I suspect you will do what most remoaners will do faced with their own personal nightmare and begger on.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 10 2017, 09:25 PM

QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ May 10 2017, 08:21 PM) *
The best a Lib Dem vote does is produce a Tory coalition, and I don't want a Tory government. It's got to be Labour, for this and all the other social-justice reasons.

I think the best outcome we can hope for is a victory that doesn't provide the margin the lying PM gambled on.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 10 2017, 09:38 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 10 2017, 10:22 PM) *
I don't know you but I doubt you would. I suspect you will do what most remoaners will do faced with their own personal nightmare and begger on.

Id go to University. Free tuition fees. Paid to go. Free grant. Luvly jubbly. Get to University on my student railcard free of course. Must be a useless course on lefty BBC media studies I can do for 12 hours a week. Beats doing the 80 hours I do at the moment. 👍

Posted by: Andy Capp May 10 2017, 09:50 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 10 2017, 10:38 PM) *
Beats doing the 80 hours I do at the moment. 👍

And you want more of the same? You want to cling on to that?

Posted by: Simon Kirby May 10 2017, 09:51 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 10 2017, 10:25 PM) *
I think the best outcome we can hope for is a victory that doesn't provide the margin the lying PM gambled on.

At the moment, yes, though there's a month to go and things can change.

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 10 2017, 10:06 PM

Labour, economics by Karl Marx, government by Groucho Marx. Clowns who don't do 'numbers' and keep falling over when asked for details, like the shadow education minister today. Comedy gold.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 10 2017, 10:09 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 10 2017, 10:50 PM) *
And you want more of the same? You want to cling on to that?


Yep. Love it. Working with MS at the moment on hot fix bundle 6 for D365FO. Yes its hard work but it gives you a sense of pride. Perhaps I should be less hard working. Sometimes I want it. Sometimes I dont. But.... the lack of talent in the Country is staggering. If you cant google it people give up!!! Odd.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 10 2017, 10:19 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 10 2017, 11:06 PM) *
Labour, economics by Karl Marx, government by Groucho Marx. Clowns who don't do 'numbers' and keep falling over when asked for details, like the shadow education minister today. Comedy gold.

Yes, it makes you wonder why they don't just flat-out lie and or force the journos to ask the questions in advance like the stinking rotten Tormatos do.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-refuse-press-questions-pre-approved-michael-crick-election-2017-campaign-team-a7726856.html

Posted by: Andy Capp May 10 2017, 10:20 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 10 2017, 11:09 PM) *
Yep. Love it. Working with MS at the moment on hot fix bundle 6 for D365FO. Yes its hard work but it gives you a sense of pride. Perhaps I should be less hard working. Sometimes I want it. Sometimes I dont. But.... the lack of talent in the Country is staggering. If you cant google it people give up!!! Odd.

Thus 'taking a job away' from someone.

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 10 2017, 10:27 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 10 2017, 11:19 PM) *
Yes, it makes you wonder why they don't just flat-out lie and or force the journos to ask the questions in advance like the stinking rotten Tormatos do.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-refuse-press-questions-pre-approved-michael-crick-election-2017-campaign-team-a7726856.html

Now, remember what we agreed on? Forehead, keyboard? Remember?

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 11 2017, 02:31 AM

I find it staggering that people are actually considering voting labour. If he gets in I shall of course be reminding those that voted for him just how "thick" they are at every opportunity and also blame Labour for everything that ever gos wrong. I call myself a Condemner.... 😂

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 11 2017, 05:30 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 11 2017, 03:31 AM) *
I find it staggering that people are actually considering voting labour. If he gets in I shall of course be reminding those that voted for him just how "thick" they are at every opportunity and also blame Labour for everything that ever gos wrong. I call myself a Condemner.... 😂

Didn't they get to number three a few years ago?

Posted by: Andy Capp May 11 2017, 07:14 AM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 11 2017, 03:31 AM) *
I find it staggering that people are actually considering voting labour. If he gets in I shall of course be reminding those that voted for him just how "thick" they are at every opportunity and also blame Labour for everything that ever gos wrong. I call myself a Condemner.... 😂

Because some people don't like tories and a PM who approves of fox hunting.

Posted by: Biker1 May 11 2017, 08:30 AM

QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ May 10 2017, 07:55 PM) *
I voted Lib Dem when Rendel last stood in Newbury on this single issue - I always admired that he made such a definite anti-hunting stand in a constituency where that was obviously going to cost him votes.

Yes, I went for him once on that very issue plus his pledge on green issues........
And then he went and supported the Western By-pass to court popularity.
Seems I need to join the ranks of abstainers!! rolleyes.gif

Posted by: Andy Capp May 11 2017, 12:11 PM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ May 11 2017, 09:30 AM) *
Yes, I went for him once on that very issue plus his pledge on green issues........
And then he went and supported the Western By-pass to court popularity.

He might have done it for that, but I doubt it. The Western By-pass was an inevitably, the worst he might have done is wanting to be associated with something that was seen as successful. I attended more than one event where he turned up to argue the case. The problem with a by-pass, without a Newbury equivalent to an M25, there was not an ideal solution.

QUOTE (Biker1 @ May 11 2017, 09:30 AM) *
Seems I need to join the ranks of abstainers!! rolleyes.gif

That is a vote for Tory in practical terms. Tories will want people not to turn-up, unless it is for them, but I agree there is not a preferred candidate or party.

The only way I can philosophically square this conundrum is vote Lib Dem for Newbury MP, in the hope that it doesn't cause a Labour government, but does mitigate against an increase in a Tory majority, but I would be staggered if the Lib Dems won here.

I think if people are strongly anti fox hunting, they would be better off voting tactically for the Lib Dems. Voting Labour ain't going to work here.

Posted by: Turin Machine May 11 2017, 01:20 PM

I told you Corbynites was dangerous 😂

BBC cameraman's foot run over by Jeremy Corbyn's car - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-39882969

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 11 2017, 05:25 PM

Anyone know where we can find a delorian? I am thinking of selling a blockbuster of an idea to Hollywood, it's about a weird old guy who invents a way of traveling back in time. Starring Jeremy Corbyn it's called 'Back To The 70's'. Coming soon to an election near you! laugh.gif

Posted by: On the edge May 11 2017, 06:09 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 10 2017, 11:09 PM) *
Yep. Love it. Working with MS at the moment on hot fix bundle 6 for D365FO. Yes its hard work but it gives you a sense of pride. Perhaps I should be less hard working. Sometimes I want it. Sometimes I dont. But.... the lack of talent in the Country is staggering. If you cant google it people give up!!! Odd.


Yes; its hideously sad! You doing 80 hours a week (I'm sure you are well rewarded) so, simeone might just be exploiting you. Anyway, you carry on enjoying your doing whilst your knowledge base lasts.....

Just an aside, we don't let lorry drivers work such long hours because their concentration wanes and they start making errors. Presumably, the IT systems you practice on are non critical?

Posted by: On the edge May 11 2017, 06:17 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 11 2017, 01:11 PM) *
He might have done it for that, but I doubt it. The Western By-pass was an inevitably, the worst he might have done is wanting to be associated with something that was seen as successful. I attended more than one event where he turned up to argue the case. The problem with a by-pass, without a Newbury equivalent to an M25, there was not an ideal solution.


That is a vote for Tory in practical terms. Tories will want people not to turn-up, unless it is for them, but I agree there is not a preferred candidate or party.

The only way I can philosophically square this conundrum is vote Lib Dem for Newbury MP, in the hope that it doesn't cause a Labour government, but does mitigate against an increase in a Tory majority, but I would be staggered if the Lib Dems won here.

I think if people are strongly anti fox hunting, they would be better off voting tactically for the Lib Dems. Voting Labour ain't going to work here.


No, having a balance of LibDem MPs won't result in a Labour Government, just another Coalition, which in spite of all the fine words is a Tory Government. Pushing Labour to second place round here would badly disturb Tory Central Office at least.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 11 2017, 06:38 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 11 2017, 07:09 PM) *
Yes; its hideously sad! You doing 80 hours a week (I'm sure you are well rewarded) so, simeone might just be exploiting you. Anyway, you carry on enjoying your doing whilst your knowledge base lasts.....

Just an aside, we don't let lorry drivers work such long hours because their concentration wanes and they start making errors. Presumably, the IT systems you practice on are non critical?


Commercial. Anyway some people enjoy there job. Believe it or not!! Perhaps you ought to get one you enjoy. Whilst my knowledge lasts?? You almost sound jealous. I suppose you espouse to this...

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x34cuiq_strawbs-you-don-t-get-me-i-m-part-of-the-union_fun



Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 11 2017, 06:39 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 11 2017, 07:17 PM) *
No, having a balance of LibDem MPs won't result in a Labour Government, just another Coalition, which in spite of all the fine words is a Tory Government. Pushing Labour to second place round here would badly disturb Tory Central Office at least.


Lost Deposit.

Posted by: On the edge May 11 2017, 07:19 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 11 2017, 07:38 PM) *
Commercial. Anyway some people enjoy there job. Believe it or not!! Perhaps you ought to get one you enjoy. Whilst my knowledge lasts?? You almost sound jealous. I suppose you espouse to this...

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x34cuiq_strawbs-you-don-t-get-me-i-m-part-of-the-union_fun


Yep, I enjoy my job, and have reached the stage where it's almost a hobby. So, perhaps a touch of sage advice. Put it this way, I worked somewhere we changed from ICL mainframes as did many others. VME, like OS.2, they comes they goes. Some kept upgrading their skills; meant leaving the workbench now and again. Then there is the other issue; loss of concentration and effectiveness after sustained long hours. Ironically, even accountants worry about colleagues working very long hours. All the time your employers don't worry about quality or security you haven't got a problem. In my line of business, it's critical; they want to keep customers.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 11 2017, 07:20 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 11 2017, 07:17 PM) *
No, having a balance of LibDem MPs won't result in a Labour Government, just another Coalition, which in spite of all the fine words is a Tory Government. Pushing Labour to second place round here would badly disturb Tory Central Office at least.

If ones thoughts are anyone but the Mindless Regressive Toffs, then one would be foolish to not vote for the second favourite party in West Berkshire. Labour have simply too big a hill to climb, notwithstanding some of their leaked policies are beyond absurd.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 11 2017, 07:23 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 11 2017, 08:19 PM) *
Yep, I enjoy my job, and have reached the stage where it's almost a hobby. So, perhaps a touch of sage advice. Put it this way, I worked somewhere we changed from ICL mainframes as did many others. VME, like OS.2, they comes they goes. Some kept upgrading their skills; meant leaving the workbench now and again. Then there is the other issue; loss of concentration and effectiveness after sustained long hours. Ironically, even accountants worry about colleagues working very long hours. All the time your employers don't worry about quality or security you haven't got a problem. In my line of business, it's critical; they want to keep customers.

In our company, very long hours is considered an issue and suggests being overwhelmed.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 11 2017, 07:31 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 11 2017, 08:19 PM) *
Yep, I enjoy my job, and have reached the stage where it's almost a hobby. So, perhaps a touch of sage advice. Put it this way, I worked somewhere we changed from ICL mainframes as did many others. VME, like OS.2, they comes they goes. Some kept upgrading their skills; meant leaving the workbench now and again. Then there is the other issue; loss of concentration and effectiveness after sustained long hours. Ironically, even accountants worry about colleagues working very long hours. All the time your employers don't worry about quality or security you haven't got a problem. In my line of business, it's critical; they want to keep customers.


May I auggest you retire then and give your job to someone who wont consider it a hobby. Judging by the technology you were using back in the day it must be pretty close anyway.🐢

Posted by: blackdog May 11 2017, 07:35 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 11 2017, 01:11 PM) *
That is a vote for Tory in practical terms. Tories will want people not to turn-up, unless it is for them, but I agree there is not a preferred candidate or party.

I think all parties subscribe to that view.

Posted by: On the edge May 11 2017, 08:21 PM

QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 11 2017, 08:31 PM) *
May I auggest you retire then and give your job to someone who wont consider it a hobby. Judging by the technology you were using back in the day it must be pretty close anyway.��


Your enthusiasm and commitment are laudable, but why the hours; what are you so afraid of? Even if you discount the professional downside; surely there is more to your life than just work. I've clearly touched a raw nerve, sorry.

(Hobby was perhaps the wrong word in this conversation, for a better descriptor look at the top of Maslows pyramid)

Posted by: Andy Capp May 11 2017, 08:27 PM

QUOTE (blackdog @ May 11 2017, 08:35 PM) *
I think all parties subscribe to that view.

Not necessarily as it is conditional. If I were Labour in West Berks, I'd hope people would vote Lib Dem.

Posted by: On the edge May 11 2017, 08:56 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 11 2017, 09:27 PM) *
Not necessarily as it is conditional. If I were Labour in West Berks, I'd hope people would vote Lib Dem.


I suppose that's logical if you think they have even a gnat's chance of defeating RB. Trouble is, they are throwing all they've got at it and as our country Cousins believe they'll bring back hunting, RB is here to stay. So, as the opportunity to de seat isn't there, I'd rather point out to the local establishment that Liberal Democracy isn't the alternative.

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 11 2017, 11:55 PM

Jeremy Corbyn = weapons grade disaster.

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome May 12 2017, 05:21 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 12 2017, 12:55 AM) *
Jeremy Corbyn = weapons grade disaster.

La La land. I want a unicorn and a dragon. And im going on strike unless it is provided.Why not aim a bit higher? I suggest some deep space mining and the exploration and colonization of planets in another dimension. Oh and every one has a human right to win 20 million on the lottery.

Posted by: On the edge May 12 2017, 06:10 AM

Interesting stuff! Anyone care to say what they think is so bad about any item on the Labour manifesto, then we might be getting somewhere. The media are suggesting Labour want to take us back to the 1970's quite forgetting the Tories want to go further and take us back to the 1870s.

Posted by: GrumblingAgain May 12 2017, 07:23 AM

QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ May 10 2017, 07:55 PM) *
I voted Lib Dem when Rendel last stood in Newbury on this single issue - I always admired that he made such a definite anti-hunting stand in a constituency where that was obviously going to cost him votes. For me it's just another reason why I'm voting Labour.

No sugar Sherlock, you're a labour activist who floods every thread here in the forum and every story in the main part of the website with leftist drivel, whenever there's a hint of Council or Government involvement, and from memory even on threads and stories that have no political stuff in them will attract your propaganda. The usual "Pin the red rosette to the donkey"....

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 12 2017, 08:15 AM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 12 2017, 07:10 AM) *
Interesting stuff! Anyone care to say what they think is so bad about any item on the Labour manifesto, then we might be getting somewhere. The media are suggesting Labour want to take us back to the 1970's quite forgetting the Tories want to go further and take us back to the 1870s.

That's best left to the Labour party, and I quote, "One senior Labour candidate said: "This is nothing more than an expensive wishlist. Some of it may be harmless but the rest of it reads like a 10 year old's letter to Santa Claus."

Another, fighting to hold onto a marginal seat, said: "You could promise unicorns for everyone, none of this is going to happen.

"It's a ludicrous document, it won't serve Labour MPs well on the doorstep and the public have largely stopped listening and taking us seriously anyway.”

And there, dear readers, you have it.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 12 2017, 08:24 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 12 2017, 09:15 AM) *
That's best left to the Labour party, and I quote, "One senior Labour candidate said: "This is nothing more than an expensive wishlist. Some of it may be harmless but the rest of it reads like a 10 year old's letter to Santa Claus."

Another, fighting to hold onto a marginal seat, said: "You could promise unicorns for everyone, none of this is going to happen.

"It's a ludicrous document, it won't serve Labour MPs well on the doorstep and the public have largely stopped listening and taking us seriously anyway.”

And there, dear readers, you have it.

Except you didn't answer his question.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 12 2017, 08:27 AM

My view is I remember public ownership and union militancy.

Posted by: On the edge May 12 2017, 08:35 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 12 2017, 09:15 AM) *
That's best left to the Labour party, and I quote, "One senior Labour candidate said: "This is nothing more than an expensive wishlist. Some of it may be harmless but the rest of it reads like a 10 year old's letter to Santa Claus."

Another, fighting to hold onto a marginal seat, said: "You could promise unicorns for everyone, none of this is going to happen.

"It's a ludicrous document, it won't serve Labour MPs well on the doorstep and the public have largely stopped listening and taking us seriously anyway.”

And there, dear readers, you have it.


Rather like the LibDem manifestos then, but they are rather more dangerous, because of the chance they get to deliver some of the weirder and more expensive nostrums. Like free meals for your kids, designed to dramatically increase scholastic perfirmance! Notice any difference in the tables yet?

Now that's the detail I was hoping for. Not the knock about jokes published by that tribune of the people, dear Lord Rothermere. By the way, Rothermere had a lot in common with the late Tony Benn - both have acknowledged mad ancestors! Shock, horror, Rothermere had socialist tendancies!

Posted by: On the edge May 12 2017, 08:42 AM

QUOTE (GrumblingAgain @ May 12 2017, 08:23 AM) *
No sugar Sherlock, you're a labour activist who floods every thread here in the forum and every story in the main part of the website with leftist drivel, whenever there's a hint of Council or Government involvement, and from memory even on threads and stories that have no political stuff in them will attract your propaganda. The usual "Pin the red rosette to the donkey"....


Last time he appeared to support another party, and then another. To me, that suggests a bit of analysis and thinking - rather than simply doing whatever this week's party mantra happens to be. Suggesting that government should butt out of our lives is actually the true free trade Liberalisim of Cobden, Bright, Gladstone and ironically Mrs Thatcher. I appreciate thinking in the County where the term 'if they painted a pig blue, they'd vote for it' probably came from is difficult, but in spite of the frustration, worth it.

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 12 2017, 08:44 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 12 2017, 09:24 AM) *
Except you didn't answer his question.

Yes, yes I did.

Posted by: On the edge May 12 2017, 09:02 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 12 2017, 09:27 AM) *
My view is I remember public ownership and union militancy.


Yes, potent issues.

Personally, I think Labour's trouble with public ownership was to equate it with centralisation and deliver it through a traditional civil service model. I worked for a few. However, we can all now see that certain things, particularly common services, are in effect de facto monopolies. Electricity distribution, railways, telecom networks etc. In constrained free market competition, even with sophisticated rules to create pseudo markets doesn't work. So, let's take them into public control, perhaps franchised by region to aid performance measurement, but modelled on a cooperative (John Lewis) or non profit basis (BBC).

Trades Unions are likely to be a harder nut to crack. However, most business schools now accept that the bad behaviours which came out of the UK Trades Union model in the 1970s hid an even worse and far more damaging phenomena. Poor British management coupled with under or misplaced investment in British industry. Hindsight is always 20/20, but the collapse of British Leyland, BSA motorcycles, etc,etc,etc wasn't just down to labour disputes however ugly they were.

Ironically, with us coming out of Europe, the German Union model is far far better, as employees become properly involved in the management and direction of the business. They also treat management and management training very seriously as well as having properly constructed financial backing. Probably the reason they still have two mass market car producers.

So, I think Labour is on the right track BUT and its a very big but, there will need to be some paradigm change in concepts. Hence nationally we do need many more political thinkers who are willing to input propositions .

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 12 2017, 10:51 AM

If true,this smacks of desperation verging on insanity,
"Jeremy Corbyn's most loyal supporters have accused a BBC cameraman of intentionally getting run over by a car carrying the Labour leader yesterday in a 'set up'.
Giles Wooltorton fell to the ground yelling in pain when his foot was driven over by the vehicle taking Mr Corbyn to a manifesto meeting with MPs and other Labour figures yesterday.
The 51-year-old cameraman suffered two broken toes and bruising to his foot in the incident, which happened outside the Institution of Engineering and Technology in London.
But some of Mr Corbyn's supporters have suggested that it was an attempt to undermine his election campaign hours after Labour's manifesto was leaked a week early.
BBC political editor Laura Kuenssberg has also been accused of being in on a bizarre conspiracy to 'smear' the under pressure Labour leader because Mr Wooltorton was her cameraman.
Trolls calling her 'Laura Torygirl' and a 'Conservative stooge' and even accusing the experienced journalist of pushing him in the way or 'kicking his foot'."

Bear in mind it's from the swivel eyed loons handbook cool.gif

Posted by: On the edge May 12 2017, 11:59 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 12 2017, 11:51 AM) *
If true,this smacks of desperation verging on insanity,
"Jeremy Corbyn's most loyal supporters have accused a BBC cameraman of intentionally getting run over by a car carrying the Labour leader yesterday in a 'set up'.
Giles Wooltorton fell to the ground yelling in pain when his foot was driven over by the vehicle taking Mr Corbyn to a manifesto meeting with MPs and other Labour figures yesterday.
The 51-year-old cameraman suffered two broken toes and bruising to his foot in the incident, which happened outside the Institution of Engineering and Technology in London.
But some of Mr Corbyn's supporters have suggested that it was an attempt to undermine his election campaign hours after Labour's manifesto was leaked a week early.
BBC political editor Laura Kuenssberg has also been accused of being in on a bizarre conspiracy to 'smear' the under pressure Labour leader because Mr Wooltorton was her cameraman.
Trolls calling her 'Laura Torygirl' and a 'Conservative stooge' and even accusing the experienced journalist of pushing him in the way or 'kicking his foot'."

Bear in mind it's from the swivel eyed loons handbook cool.gif



I have heard Jeremy Corbyn's great grandparents won't be backing him at the polls. He also cuts his finger nails and usually has a sh1t at least once a day which can smell bad. He's also used public transport when he has purchased a ticket, often not knowing the names of the ticket collectors kids. What a ****.

Apparently, there are even people about who believe press reporters make up,their own stories and even use illegal ways of getting information shocking isn't it. There's a name for these people, High Court Judges.....

Now then, as to the manifesto, which you clearly haven't read..........


Posted by: Andy Capp May 12 2017, 12:09 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 12 2017, 07:10 AM) *
Interesting stuff! Anyone care to say what they think is so bad about any item on the Labour manifesto, then we might be getting somewhere. The media are suggesting Labour want to take us back to the 1970's quite forgetting the Tories want to go further and take us back to the 1870s.
QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 12 2017, 09:15 AM) *

That's best left to the Labour party, and I quote, "One senior Labour candidate said: "This is nothing more than an expensive wishlist. Some of it may be harmless but the rest of it reads like a 10 year old's letter to Santa Claus."

Another, fighting to hold onto a marginal seat, said: "You could promise unicorns for everyone, none of this is going to happen.

"It's a ludicrous document, it won't serve Labour MPs well on the doorstep and the public have largely stopped listening and taking us seriously anyway.”

And there, dear readers, you have it.


QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 12 2017, 09:24 AM) *
Except you didn't answer his question.
QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 12 2017, 09:44 AM) *
Yes, yes I did.


You made oblique references to comments about the manifesto, but have not singled out anything in particular, so I don't think you have.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 12 2017, 12:16 PM

Hold-on you bleedin' hijackers, this is about Tory toffs in hunting pink killing foxes for fun!!! angry.gif

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 12 2017, 12:58 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 12 2017, 12:59 PM) *
Now then, as to the manifesto, which you clearly haven't read..........

Actually, I have, and despite there being one of two points I agree with they're buried under an avalanche of expensive, badly costed and potentially disastrous drivel designed to appeal to those voters who still believe, and I quote "labour is for the working man". Well, a certain T Blair drove the final nails into that coffin.

Posted by: On the edge May 12 2017, 12:58 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 12 2017, 01:16 PM) *
Hold-on you bleedin' hijackers, this is about Tory toffs in hunting pink killing foxes for fun!!! angry.gif


Yes, you are quite right.

They aren't doing it for fun though. Foxes are vermin and have to be controlled. Mind, it's quite astounding that the aristocracy and even members of the Royal Family have vocational qualifications in pest control.

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 12 2017, 01:13 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 12 2017, 01:58 PM) *
Yes, you are quite right.

They aren't doing it for fun though. Labour are vermin and have to be controlled. Mind, it's quite astounding that the government and even members of the Lords have vocational qualifications in pest control.

Fixxored that for u. laugh.gif

Posted by: Turin Machine May 12 2017, 01:21 PM

Foxes are vermin and in SOME circumstances need to be controlled, the key point is that this should be done humanely. "The unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible" just about sums it up. 😤

Posted by: Andy Capp May 12 2017, 03:45 PM

QUOTE (On the edge @ May 12 2017, 01:58 PM) *
Yes, you are quite right.

They aren't doing it for fun though.

The overwhelming majority of fox hunters are doing it for fun. Any apparent pest control is coincidental.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 12 2017, 03:53 PM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 12 2017, 01:58 PM) *
Actually, I have

That's clever, it ain't out yet.

Posted by: Simon Kirby May 12 2017, 04:31 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ May 12 2017, 02:21 PM) *
Foxes are vermin and in SOME circumstances need to be controlled, the key point is that this should be done humanely. "The unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible" just about sums it up. 😤

I can agree with that.

Posted by: On the edge May 12 2017, 04:44 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 12 2017, 04:45 PM) *
The overwhelming majority of fox hunters are doing it for fun. Any apparent pest control is coincidental.


Quite, arguably given the other humane methods that have been avaliable for years, they are ALL doing it for fun. I'm pretty sure I'm far from alone in not wanting anyone who feels this repugnant practice to continue to have anything to do with running the Country.

Posted by: Turin Machine May 12 2017, 09:44 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 12 2017, 04:53 PM) *
That's clever, it ain't out yet.

Oh, so it hasn't been leaked then. Wow, there's me and the rest of the world thinking it had!

Posted by: Turin Machine May 12 2017, 09:48 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 12 2017, 01:16 PM) *
Hold-on you bleedin' hijackers, this is about Tory toffs in hunting pink killing foxes for fun!!! angry.gif

I think if you bothered to find out its people of all hues of the political​ spectrum who take part in this vile action. I was going to call it a bloodsport but for the life of me I can't see where the 'sport' comes into it.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 12 2017, 11:59 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ May 12 2017, 10:44 PM) *
Oh, so it hasn't been leaked then. Wow, there's me and the rest of the world thinking it had!

The manifesto hasn't been released yet, so Billy Bullshoite couldn't have read it.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 13 2017, 12:00 AM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ May 12 2017, 10:48 PM) *
I think if you bothered to find out its people of all hues of the political​ spectrum who take part in this vile action. I was going to call it a bloodsport but for the life of me I can't see where the 'sport' comes into it.

I have bothered, but I just like trolling the swivel eyed amongst us!

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 13 2017, 08:33 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 13 2017, 12:59 AM) *
The manifesto hasn't been released yet, so Billy Bullshoite couldn't have read it.

Its been leaked, all over the media, and it's been approved albeit with some modifications. Are you that stupid? Hold on, just answered that haven't you.

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 13 2017, 08:35 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 13 2017, 01:00 AM) *
I have bothered, but I just like trolling the swivel eyed amongst us!

And that sums you up, nasty little troll figure. Typical lefty, nought to offer but dissent.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 13 2017, 08:44 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 13 2017, 09:33 AM) *
Its been leaked, all over the media, and it's been approved albeit with some modifications. Are you that stupid? Hold on, just answered that haven't you.

A draft has been leaked, but it is not the manifesto.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 13 2017, 08:47 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 13 2017, 09:35 AM) *
And that sums you up, nasty little troll figure. Typical lefty, nought to offer but dissent.

😂
Reel 'em in!

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 13 2017, 09:25 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 13 2017, 09:44 AM) *
A draft has been leaked, but it is not the manifesto.

The draft was approved. Troll. You're like Corbyn, just Bat**** crazy.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 13 2017, 09:54 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 13 2017, 10:25 AM) *
The draft was approved. Troll. You're like Corbyn, just Bat**** crazy.


"It was approved, it was approved..". 🤣

But it isn't the manifesto.

How many posts and still haven't answered his question! I suppose if you haven't read it, that would explain it

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 13 2017, 10:15 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 13 2017, 10:54 AM) *
"It was approved, it was approved..". 🤣

But it isn't the manifesto.

How many posts and still haven't answered his question! I suppose if you haven't read it, that would explain it

Troll.

Posted by: Turin Machine May 13 2017, 10:48 AM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 13 2017, 10:54 AM) *
"It was approved, it was approved..". 🤣

But it isn't the manifesto.

How many posts and still haven't answered his question! I suppose if you haven't read it, that would explain it

Kindly explain for the benefit of us 'mere' mortals what the difference will be between the 'draft' and the finalised documents? And we're looking for meaningful differences here.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 13 2017, 11:36 AM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ May 13 2017, 11:48 AM) *
Kindly explain for the benefit of us 'mere' mortals what the difference will be between the 'draft' and the finalised documents? And we're looking for meaningful differences here.

Who knows, it hasn't been published yet!

There may be no difference, but I wouldn't say I have read a document until I had, I certainly wouldn't rely on the media to tell me what is in it.

Posted by: Andy Capp May 13 2017, 11:37 AM

QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ May 13 2017, 11:15 AM) *
Troll.


I'm going tell mummy on you 😢

Here you go Charlie me lad. Read it carefully; there'll be a test on it later! 😋

http://uk.businessinsider.com/document/59141d99833c9e1e2c9f8698/348012594-full-labour-party-manifesto-draft.pdf

Posted by: je suis Charlie May 13 2017, 12:58 PM

QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 13 2017, 12:37 PM) *
I'm going tell mummy on you 😢

Here you go Charlie me lad. Read it carefully; there'll be a test on it later! 😋

http://uk.businessinsider.com/document/59141d99833c9e1e2c9f8698/348012594-full-labour-party-manifesto-draft.pdf

Yup, what I read.

Posted by: blackdog May 13 2017, 03:13 PM

QUOTE (Turin Machine @ May 13 2017, 11:48 AM) *
Kindly explain for the benefit of us 'mere' mortals what the difference will be between the 'draft' and the finalised documents? And we're looking for meaningful differences here.


Some drafts are ripped up and totally rewritten, later drafts will be almost indistinguisable from the final document - we won't know what the differences are until the manifesto is issued.

The leaked draft is a huge boost for Corbyn - gives them a chance to test reactions, drop unpopular bits, strengthen popular bits - and say they were intending to do it that way from the start.

Posted by: Biker1 May 16 2017, 04:28 AM

If any of you on here are anti cruel "sports" (and it seems many of you are) then DO NOT support http://www.highclerecountryshow.co.uk/ blood"sports" promoting event. angry.gif

Posted by: Simon Kirby May 16 2017, 10:12 AM

QUOTE (Biker1 @ May 16 2017, 05:28 AM) *
If any of you on here are anti cruel "sports" (and it seems many of you are) then DO NOT support http://www.highclerecountryshow.co.uk/ blood"sports" promoting event. angry.gif

Agreed.

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