Petrol prices in Newbury Options

[dannyboy]

Fuel stations pretty much offer the the same facilities whereever you go; with beer, the 'landlord' may, or may not invest more in the business than a filling station. This might be entertainment, facilities, more exclusive products, wider variation in local rental price (rent tending to be more expensive in the town centre than the suburbs where you are more likely to find filling stations).


That is an easy bet to make under the current circumstances.

it is an easy bet.

Sainsbury's are only 1.2p a litre off Asda's prices. On a 60 litre fill up that's £0.72. The calls for 'Newbury needs a fuel discounter now' are unfounded. I say there would be no change. ( other than being able to buy George clothing of course ).

[On the edge]

WTFAYOA?

My point is quite simply that with selling beer, there can be more reasons for why beer has a wider price variation than filling stations.

I must admit, I couldn't see any other reasons as to why beer has wider variations either.

[dannyboy]

WTFAYOA?

My point is quite simply that with selling beer, there can be more reasons for why beer has a wider price variation than filling stations.

There could be more reasons, but thats isn't actually borne out. Fullers charge what they do in Newbury simply because they know that can get away with it.

[Andy Capp]

The argument is about fractions of a penny after all.

It can be a matter of only a fraction of a pence, but it can be much wider too.

Using public transport makes you no less independent, after all as a car driver you are at the mercy of the fuel companies and the maintenance firms.

You don't live in Newbury, do you? Public transport in London is a viable option, but not necessarily in towns like Newbury; as we all have gas-guzzling 4x4s, public transport is rather patchy!

If a train breaks down with serious mechanical problems, there is likely to be another. All the time we live in a capitalist democracy you are likely to see difference. If it were all the same, you'd likely have to fill your Trabant at the State fuel station.

Sorry, I don't really see the point you are trying to make.

[Andy Capp]

There could be more reasons, but thats isn't actually borne out. Fullers charge what they do in Newbury simply because they know that can get away with it.

Yes, like Tesco et al. with their fuel. IN other towns with a more competitive supplier base, they wouldn't .. maybe?

[Andy Capp]

it is an easy bet.

Sainsbury's are only 1.2p a litre off Asda's prices. On a 60 litre fill up that's £0.72. The calls for 'Newbury needs a fuel discounter now' are unfounded. I say there would be no change. ( other than being able to buy George clothing of course ).

You arguments are getting more and more churlish. This is the case today, but the gap has been much wider too. Perhaps the fuel barons in their ivory supermarket towers have been reading this thread!

[Andy Capp]

I must admit, I couldn't see any other reasons as to why beer has wider variations either.

Fuel stations pretty much offer the the same facilities whereever you go; with beer, the 'landlord' may, or may not invest more in the business than a filling station. This might be entertainment, facilities, more exclusive products, wider variation in local rental price (rent tending to be more expensive in the town centre than the suburbs where you are more likely to find filling stations).

And some landlords might make their prices more expensive to simply repel the 'undesirables'. I doubt filling stations care who they serve so long as they pay. Comparing the two industries is daft and I'm surprised you and 'dannyrandompost' would even use the two as examples.

[dannyboy]

You arguments are getting more and more churlish. This is the case today, but the gap has been much wider too. Perhaps the fuel barons in their ivory supermarket towers have been reading this thread!

Churlish? I thought that was a pre-requsite of this forum.

[Andy Capp]

Churlish? I thought that was a pre-requsite of this forum.

That explains a lot!

What I mean is, you are not a daft person, but some of your arguments are intellectually of a lower standard than I would expect from you!

[dannyboy]

Yes, like Tesco et al. with their fuel. IN other towns with a more competitive supplier base, they wouldn't .. maybe?

I don't believe that either Tesco or Sainsbury would match Asda if there was one in Newbury.

[dannyboy]

That explains a lot!

What I mean is, you are not a daft person, but some of your arguments are intellectually of a lower standard than I would expect from you!

Look I started my new job with Tesco yesterday & I'm having to actually cioncentrate for a change.

[Andy Capp]

Look I started my new job with Tesco yesterday & I'm having to actually cioncentrate for a change.

Good point!

[On the edge]

Look I started my new job with Tesco yesterday & I'm having to actually cioncentrate for a change.

Does that mean I won't see you at the job centre next week?

[dannyboy]

Does that mean I won't see you at the job centre next week?

So long as I can remember to get up each morning & don't get sacked - I'm afraid I won't.

[On the edge]

And some landlords might make their prices more expensive to simply repel the 'undesirables'. I doubt filling stations care who they serve so long as they pay. Comparing the two industries is daft and I'm surprised you and 'dannyrandompost' would even use the two as examples.

Strange as it might be, in some rural areas, garages have a similar pricing policy. One I'm very familiar with in North Scotland charges an exorbitant rate for passing trade, simply because he needs to conserve supplies for locals.

The comparison is a good one, if you look at it in simple market / product terms. A brand of keg beer is an undifferentiated product, just like a brand of petrol. Whatever pub it gets sold in makes no real difference. So the question is the same - why significant differences between towns.

[Andy Capp]

Strange as it might be, in some rural areas, garages have a similar pricing policy. One I'm very familiar with in North Scotland charges an exorbitant rate for passing trade, simply because he needs to conserve supplies for locals.

The comparison is a good one, if you look at it in simple market / product terms. A brand of keg beer is an undifferentiated product, just like a brand of petrol. Whatever pub it gets sold in makes no real difference. So the question is the same - why significant differences between towns.

How does this point relate to the differentiation in Newbury petrol (or any other automotive fuel) prices with adjacent towns? Is discrimination likely to be a reason for a difference in price for fuel in Newbury and Swindon? I doubt it, and this is one reason why I think the beer analogy is specious.

In any case, your assertion that "A brand of keg beer is an undifferentiated product" is not true. There are a number of reasons why beer can be a different price without it simply being about supply and demand.

So! If we are to continue with this squabble, can you produce any proof that the price of fuel in Newbury would be no more competitive if we had a recognise fuel discounter in town? If not, I have nothing more worthwhile to add to this argument.

[On the edge]

How does this point relate to the differentiation in Newbury petrol (or any other automotive fuel) prices with adjacent towns? Is discrimination likely to be a reason for a difference in price for fuel in Newbury and Swindon? I doubt it, and this is one reason why I think the beer analogy is specious.

In any case, your assertion that "A brand of keg beer is an undifferentiated product" is not true. There are a number of reasons why beer can be a different price without it simply being about supply and demand.

So! If we are to continue with this squabble, can you produce any proof that the price of fuel in Newbury would be no more competitive if we had a recognise fuel discounter in town? If not, I have nothing more worthwhile to add to this argument.

Beer does not change in taste or quality because the price changes. There is no difference between the beer in Pub A who charge £y per pint or Pub B who charge £x - hence undifferentiated. Of course, if another player comes on the scene and charges less, the effect will be to drive prices down. Weatherspoon being a good example. However, when the started trading not all the local pubs changed their price.

So, I'd wholly agree, at this moment in time, with Asda in the district you would be able to get cheap petrol, that does not necessarily mean the other providers would follow suit. With rock bottom prices, there will be an effect on profit, so in many circumstances the other players may well be quite content to let the discounter take the loss, which could, of course, eventually drive them out of business.

As for Regulation, I think you'll find this is how the UK's existing industry regulators see a market working - so they wouldn't do anything to hinder what is happening now.

In fact, in the electricity industry, the 'big 6' all charge near enough the same price and are significantly increasing them. As the Regulator can do nothing about that (not being a Russian Gas provider) they are trying to grow some more competition - but only by removing a new entrant's obligation to pay the green levies. In other words, giving some players a subsidy.

[Andy Capp]

Beer does not change in taste or quality because the price changes.

That isn't strictly true, although I'd reverse the logic: the more one charges, the greater expectation that beer is well kept and served in a nicer or more impressive environment; hence price differentiation.

There is no difference between the beer in Pub A who charge £y per pint or Pub B who charge £x - hence undifferentiated.

But there is a difference between beer1a and beer1b, notwithstanding all the other reasons I have listed as to why it is quite understandable that pubs will charge different prices.

Of course, if another player comes on the scene and charges less, the effect will be to drive prices down. Weatherspoon being a good example. However, when the started trading not all the local pubs changed their price.

But the choice was there to decide. Unlike fuel prices in Newbury. Not only that, but the price of drinks is of less importance to customers when deciding where to go for a beer, than for customers deciding where to buy petrol, although I know there are limits. Some people fear using supermarket fuel due to its presumed quality.

Your argument would carry more weight if you were to compare filling stations with off-licence sales, as that is a more like for like comparison; however, I understand alcohol in the local supermarkets is very aggressively priced by most, and the ones that don't perhaps have a more 'esoteric' stock, or are more particular about who shops in their emporium!

[Simon Kirby]

That isn't strictly true, although I'd reverse the logic: the more one charges, the greater expectation that beer is well kept buy a better cellarman, and served in a nicer, or more impressive environment; hence price differentiation.

I agree. The same beer does taste different in different pubs which must be down to how well it is kept, but you're also paying for the vibe and ambiance of the pub you're drinking in and that's worth an awful lot.

None of that applies to petrol however, unless there really are some people so snobbish that they wouldn't be seen filling up at one of the cheaper supermarkets - it could happen.

[Andy Capp]

I agree. The same beer does taste different in different pubs which must be down to how well it is kept, but you're also paying for the vibe and ambiance of the pub you're drinking in and that's worth an awful lot.

None of that applies to petrol however, unless there really are some people so snobbish that they wouldn't be seen filling up at one of the cheaper supermarkets - it could happen.

That is exaclty my argument and why I think comparing the price of beer in pubs with the price of petrol at the pump is specious. There are some similarities, but there are some big differences in the commercial model too.