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> Halal, why should we put up with this?, If fox hunting with dogs is outlawed, why not Halal?
Strafin
post Oct 11 2018, 08:02 AM
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We can live now, comfortably and easily without eating animals. The idea that because we have incisor teeth means we somehow need meat is incorrect and kind of stupid. Millions of years ago we did all sorts of things that we don't do now, including running about and catching/hunting our own food. We are not as active, we have much better farming, we understand the science of our bodies over the primal urges and massive corporations have found it financially viable to produce vegetarian and vegan food.

I don't think there is anyone who is a true vegan, and most vegetarians have the odd slip so I don't believe we will get to a place where we will never eat animals, but it is a choice and not a necessity.

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Strafin
post Oct 11 2018, 08:07 AM
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QUOTE (newres @ Oct 11 2018, 08:55 AM) *
It's staggering that it bothers you. I'm an atheist but I couldn't care less what someone else believes.

I care what others believe when it has an impact on society. Religous people are nuts and it's getting worse, people are literally killing thousands of other people for not believing in their chosen faith. We have regular terrorists attacks. We have genital mutilation, we have mass paedophilia and we have world leaders making huge decisions based on faith. It's b0llocks and childish and we all have to pander to these idiots and try not offend them.

I do like Christmas though. But I don't see it as religious. In fact this year I am going to start wishing people Happy Holidays.
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Strafin
post Oct 11 2018, 08:08 AM
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QUOTE (The Hatter @ Oct 11 2018, 08:25 AM) *
Don't understand this at all. What is a non sentient being? Presumably plants, but who are we to say plants don't feel pain? Some people believe that fish don't feel pain, so we still have the barbaric sport of angling.

Fish some believe are not sentient as youv'e already mentioned, insects are another good source of protein. Laboratory grown meat is on the cards too.
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Biker1
post Oct 11 2018, 08:20 AM
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QUOTE (Strafin @ Oct 11 2018, 09:07 AM) *
I care what others believe when it has an impact on society. Religous people are nuts and it's getting worse, people are literally killing thousands of other people for not believing in their chosen faith. We have regular terrorists attacks. We have genital mutilation, we have mass paedophilia and we have world leaders making huge decisions based on faith. It's b0llocks and childish and we all have to pander to these idiots and try not offend them.

Absolutely Strafin.
Well said (especially the "bollocks" bit! wink.gif ).
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SirWilliam
post Oct 11 2018, 09:20 AM
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QUOTE (Strafin @ Oct 11 2018, 09:02 AM) *
We can live now, comfortably and easily without eating animals. The idea that because we have incisor teeth means we somehow need meat is incorrect and kind of stupid. Millions of years ago we did all sorts of things that we don't do now, including running about and catching/hunting our own food. We are not as active, we have much better farming, we understand the science of our bodies over the primal urges and massive corporations have found it financially viable to produce vegetarian and vegan food.

I don't think there is anyone who is a true vegan, and most vegetarians have the odd slip so I don't believe we will get to a place where we will never eat animals, but it is a choice and not a necessity.


We could argue the pros and cons of a vegetable diet but with a world population of seven and a half billion which could hit 10 billion in the next 30 years we need to address the very real problem of feeding everyone. Now it may well be that the scientific boffins come up with a synthetic protein/carbohydrate but it is more than likely that global famine will ensue. Not sure on how much area two and a half billion extra require but it eats into the existing food producing land. Now the religious barmpots may be relying on their chosen one to "save" them but I wouldn't want to put my pension on it.
Not to mention brexit. rolleyes.gif


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The Hatter
post Oct 11 2018, 10:43 AM
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QUOTE (Strafin @ Oct 11 2018, 09:08 AM) *
Fish some believe are not sentient as youv'e already mentioned, insects are another good source of protein. Laboratory grown meat is on the cards too.


There has been a lot of research and it's becoming quite clear that fish are sentient. Insects too, but in a different way. I've a hypocritical friend who is vegetatian, works in a University sealife reasearch department, well into sealife intelligence, but still eats seafood. Even worse, he goes course fishing, throwing the fish whose mouths he had mutilated back.
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x2lls
post Oct 11 2018, 11:17 AM
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QUOTE (Strafin @ Oct 11 2018, 09:07 AM) *
I care what others believe when it has an impact on society. Religous people are nuts and it's getting worse, people are literally killing thousands of other people for not believing in their chosen faith. We have regular terrorists attacks. We have genital mutilation, we have mass paedophilia and we have world leaders making huge decisions based on faith. It's b0llocks and childish and we all have to pander to these idiots and try not offend them.

I do like Christmas though. But I don't see it as religious. In fact this year I am going to start wishing people Happy Holidays.



Fully agree! biggrin.gif


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Andy Capp
post Oct 11 2018, 12:42 PM
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QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Oct 10 2018, 11:03 PM) *
I disagree. The last time I checked human beings had both incisors and molars which made us.... Omnivores. This means we are meant to eat both veg and meat. If we do have to eat meat then the animal we are eating should be given a good a life as possible and then dispatched in the quickest and most pain free way. Until such time as meat can be produced from none sentient beings (that is not far away) then this is a necessary evil. When meat is produced from none sentient beings then I guess our future selves wil look upon us as murdering evil bstds. But then looking back is easy to criticise.

Your argument insinuates intelligent design; although a not very good one: our teeth and stomachs are poorly designed for eating meat, we have to use knives and cook meat. That doesnít shout Ďmeant to eat meatí to me.

However, that wasnít my point.
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newres
post Oct 11 2018, 01:19 PM
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QUOTE (Strafin @ Oct 11 2018, 09:07 AM) *
I care what others believe when it has an impact on society. Religous people are nuts and it's getting worse, people are literally killing thousands of other people for not believing in their chosen faith. We have regular terrorists attacks. We have genital mutilation, we have mass paedophilia and we have world leaders making huge decisions based on faith. It's b0llocks and childish and we all have to pander to these idiots and try not offend them.

I do like Christmas though. But I don't see it as religious. In fact this year I am going to start wishing people Happy Holidays.

What an utterly nonsense rant. Just one glaring idiot statement Iíll question though. Which religion avows paedophilia?
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newres
post Oct 11 2018, 01:20 PM
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QUOTE (x2lls @ Oct 11 2018, 12:17 PM) *
Fully agree! biggrin.gif

Quelle surprise.
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Strafin
post Oct 11 2018, 01:44 PM
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QUOTE (newres @ Oct 11 2018, 02:19 PM) *
What an utterly nonsense rant. Just one glaring idiot statement I’ll question though. Which religion avows paedophilia?

The catholic church has a huge issue with it, Islam has a huge issue with it and there have been two people convicted of it from out very own C of E church in Thatcham.

You're not religious are you?
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x2lls
post Oct 11 2018, 02:23 PM
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QUOTE (Strafin @ Oct 11 2018, 02:44 PM) *
The catholic church has a huge issue with it, Islam has a huge issue with it and there have been two people convicted of it from out very own C of E church in Thatcham.

You're not religious are you?



Guffaw guffaw guffaw laugh.gif


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je suis Charlie
post Oct 11 2018, 02:59 PM
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QUOTE (newres @ Oct 11 2018, 02:19 PM) *
What an utterly nonsense rant. Just one glaring idiot statement Iíll question though. Which religion avows paedophilia?


"Aisha's age at the time of her marriage is frequently mentioned in Islamic literature. According to Sunni hadith sources, Aisha was six or seven years old when she was married to Muhammad in Mecca. The marriage was consummated after the Hegira to Medina, when she had reached the age of nine or ten years old. Many scholars interpret this to indicate that she reached puberty at this age.For example, Sahih al-Bukhari states that Aisha narrated that "the Prophet married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old."

There is I believe a saying, "The fruit don't fall far from the tree".


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The Hatter
post Oct 11 2018, 03:16 PM
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QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Oct 11 2018, 03:59 PM) *
"Aisha's age at the time of her marriage is frequently mentioned in Islamic literature. According to Sunni hadith sources, Aisha was six or seven years old when she was married to Muhammad in Mecca. The marriage was consummated after the Hegira to Medina, when she had reached the age of nine or ten years old. Many scholars interpret this to indicate that she reached puberty at this age.For example, Sahih al-Bukhari states that Aisha narrated that "the Prophet married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old."

There is I believe a saying, "The fruit don't fall far from the tree".


Add a year and it could have been done legally here, plus the Aristos, including the Royals married a earlier. Presumably that was OK because they were British. laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif
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newres
post Oct 11 2018, 04:25 PM
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QUOTE (Strafin @ Oct 11 2018, 02:44 PM) *
The catholic church has a huge issue with it, Islam has a huge issue with it and there have been two people convicted of it from out very own C of E church in Thatcham.

You're not religious are you?

But they donít do it because of their religion and their religion doesnít cause it.

No, Iím an atheist.
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newres
post Oct 11 2018, 04:30 PM
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QUOTE (The Hatter @ Oct 11 2018, 04:16 PM) *
Add a year and it could have been done legally here, plus the Aristos, including the Royals married a earlier. Presumably that was OK because they were British. laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif

Plus there is much debate about the truth of that, but as you say, marriage was permissible at a very young age in the west until comparatively recently. Besides which, even if true there is nothing in the Muslim faith that condones paedophilia. Or any mainstream faith that I know of. Interesting that the people attacking religious bigotry demonstrate their own bigotry in their ranting.
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je suis Charlie
post Oct 11 2018, 05:02 PM
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QUOTE (The Hatter @ Oct 11 2018, 04:16 PM) *
Add a year and it could have been done legally here, plus the Aristos, including the Royals married a earlier. Presumably that was OK because they were British. laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif

Except not many Aristos [sic] founded world religions thus condoning the practice.


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je suis Charlie
post Oct 11 2018, 05:04 PM
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QUOTE (newres @ Oct 11 2018, 05:30 PM) *
Plus there is much debate about the truth of that, but as you say, marriage was permissible at a very young age in the west until comparatively recently. Besides which, even if true there is nothing in the Muslim faith that condones paedophilia. Or any mainstream faith that I know of. Interesting that the people attacking religious bigotry demonstrate their own bigotry in their ranting.

Marriage for political reasons, not to consummate with a nine year old. Monkey see, monkey do.


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je suis Charlie
post Oct 11 2018, 05:05 PM
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QUOTE (newres @ Oct 11 2018, 05:25 PM) *
But they donít do it because of their religion and their religion doesnít cause it.

No, Iím an atheist.

It condones through example.


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Berkshirelad
post Oct 11 2018, 06:55 PM
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QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Oct 11 2018, 10:20 AM) *
Now it may well be that the scientific boffins come up with a synthetic protein/carbohydrate

I think they called it Solyent Green...
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