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> Running our own affairs, Is it time to abolish Newbury Town Council?
Bofem
post Oct 4 2011, 12:32 PM
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A rather interesting opportunity has arisen..

As Newbury Town Councillors have refused to listen to the 1200 people who petitioned for a fenced off play area in Victoria Park, I was wondering if it was time to do away with them and run the things they run ourselves.

By happy coindidence, 1200 is the number required to trigger a referendum on this very question..alternatively, it's enough to trigger a review of the town council by WBC (I know....glass houses and all that, but it seems a sensible place to start).


Alternative structures could be.....

Nothing. Various community groups simply take on the services
Devolved community councils for the various parts (eg Turnpike Community Council)
Maybe the BID could manage things like Vicky Park/the market.

Most of you probably don't care, but when 10% of your customers ask you to do soomething and you refuse, voting em out isn't really an option...not enough seats are contested

Before you say "I don't care", there's a chance to save you £60 a year if you vote yes to abolition. But at what cost?





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Guest_xjay1337_*
post Oct 4 2011, 12:41 PM
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Would not work unless you want to end up like China. We all say "wow <insert person/company/government authority here> did something bad" but in all honesty with all of the bureaucratic red tape do you honestly think you could do any better?
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Dodgys smarter b...
post Oct 4 2011, 12:55 PM
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Seems to be simply an issue of cost.

If each of those 1200+ 'concerned parents' handed over £29.00 each, they could have their fencing. I'm sure NTC would be happy to help then. But perhaps they only want a fence provided if others help to pay for it? (You know, those who don't or can't use the park play area, the elderly, the disabled, those who cannot get into into Newbury Town, single persons, etc etc.... )
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stewiegriffin
post Oct 4 2011, 01:27 PM
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I'm not sure what they feel the need to fence off. It's a play area in a park. Why does it need a fence?

The issue of people taking charge of the expenditure sounds good in theory, but in practice I think it would lead to the inevitable cabal of self important people looking after their own self interest. It needs the vast majority to be actively involved or everything gets run for the benefit of the few who want to hold the reins themselves.
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Guest_xjay1337_*
post Oct 4 2011, 02:51 PM
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QUOTE (stewiegriffin @ Oct 4 2011, 02:27 PM) *
I'm not sure what they feel the need to fence off. It's a play area in a park. Why does it need a fence?


Protection from the scumbags I'd imagine. I thought Vicky Park had a fenced off play area anyway. Oh well, no harm.
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Cognosco
post Oct 4 2011, 03:43 PM
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QUOTE (xjay1337 @ Oct 4 2011, 03:51 PM) *
Protection from the scumbags I'd imagine. I thought Vicky Park had a fenced off play area anyway. Oh well, no harm.


It did not, sure why they had to get rid of the existing fencing, why could they have not kept the fencing and just replaced the rest of the play items in the same original area?


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SMJ
post Oct 4 2011, 03:46 PM
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QUOTE (xjay1337 @ Oct 4 2011, 02:51 PM) *
Protection from the scumbags I'd imagine. I thought Vicky Park had a fenced off play area anyway. Oh well, no harm.


Well yes - Vicky park HAD a fenced in area but NTC saw fit to remove the fence. Hence the protestations. I think they call it removal of an amenity. Notice a ridiculously vast sum was quoted to replace the fence - if so expensive to replace maybe they should have left the old one up. Sad to see that money is more important than children's safety.
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Guest_xjay1337_*
post Oct 4 2011, 03:50 PM
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QUOTE (SMJ @ Oct 4 2011, 04:46 PM) *
Well yes - Vicky park HAD a fenced in area but NTC saw fit to remove the fence. Hence the protestations. I think they call it removal of an amenity. Notice a ridiculously vast sum was quoted to replace the fence - if so expensive to replace maybe they should have left the old one up. Sad to see that money is more important than children's safety.


Yeah, thanks smile.gif I just read the article on NewburyToday. Apparently it was £36,000 for a "new fence". Exactly what type of contractors do they use for a job like this? That's almost what it costs to build a house from Brick! And is more than the price of those Ikea Houses people are getting (you know, the flat pack ones..)

Simply crazy. huh.gif
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dannyboy
post Oct 4 2011, 03:59 PM
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QUOTE (SMJ @ Oct 4 2011, 04:46 PM) *
Well yes - Vicky park HAD a fenced in area but NTC saw fit to remove the fence. Hence the protestations. I think they call it removal of an amenity. Notice a ridiculously vast sum was quoted to replace the fence - if so expensive to replace maybe they should have left the old one up. Sad to see that money is more important than children's safety.



Ahem,

the Park had a clapped out load of old play equipment which was replaced with some new equipment. This new equipment, being much larger in size would not have fitted inside the old area & a new fence would have to enclose a far larger are of the park.
Parents who value fences as the most important aspect of a play area can always use on of the many fenced off play areas in & around Newbury, some of which have some rather good equipment.
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Guest_xjay1337_*
post Oct 4 2011, 04:22 PM
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A play area is only a play area when it's surrounded by a fence. Keeps children in and the pervy old men out. Also stops the children from running away from their obviously miserable parents who are so strung up ABOUT A FENCE WHICH IS WAIST HEIGHT AND SERVES NO PURPOSE.

wacko.gif
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dannyboy
post Oct 4 2011, 04:27 PM
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QUOTE (xjay1337 @ Oct 4 2011, 05:22 PM) *
A play area is only a play area when it's surrounded by a fence. Keeps children in and the pervy old men out. Also stops the children from running away from their obviously miserable parents who are so strung up ABOUT A FENCE WHICH IS WAIST HEIGHT AND SERVES NO PURPOSE.

wacko.gif

what do you call play equipment gathered together with no fence around it then?
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Richard Garvie
post Oct 4 2011, 05:33 PM
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Those who campaigned wanted a fence to protect those using the toddler area from falling into the pond or canal, and to also protect from dogs not on a leash. The council should be applauded for spending this money on new equipment, but I would take issue with the way they carried out the process. I remember highlighting the lack of fencing at a NTC meeting prior to work beginning, and I was told parents and park users had been consulted. We are still waiting for that consultation document to appear!!!

Once again, councillors know best and appear surprised when those who have more knowledge (this time it's the parents) come forward and ask questions. I support the town council model, we just need to scrutinise how much it costs and the decisions it makes.
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SMJ
post Oct 4 2011, 06:14 PM
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QUOTE (dannyboy @ Oct 4 2011, 03:59 PM) *
Ahem,

the Park had a clapped out load of old play equipment which was replaced with some new equipment. This new equipment, being much larger in size would not have fitted inside the old area & a new fence would have to enclose a far larger are of the park.
Parents who value fences as the most important aspect of a play area can always use on of the many fenced off play areas in & around Newbury, some of which have some rather good equipment.


Indeed but the request was for fencing to be placed around the TODDLER area, not the entire play area. The toddler equipment would have easily fitted inside the old fencing which in itself was a bit clapped out - but at least it was there.

And yes - many parents have been forced to use the other the fenced off play areas as they no longer feel Victoria Park is a safe environment for their children.
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user23
post Oct 4 2011, 06:22 PM
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QUOTE (SMJ @ Oct 4 2011, 04:46 PM) *
Well yes - Vicky park HAD a fenced in area but NTC saw fit to remove the fence. Hence the protestations. I think they call it removal of an amenity. Notice a ridiculously vast sum was quoted to replace the fence - if so expensive to replace maybe they should have left the old one up. Sad to see that money is more important than children's safety.
The new play area wouldn't have fitted in the old fence as it's much bigger.

As has already been suggested, and in the spirit of this thread perhaps those who want a fence should club together and raise the funds for it. Surely they wouldn't have a problem with this, if children's safety is more important than money?

Will you be willing to act as organiser for raising this funding?
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SMJ
post Oct 4 2011, 07:13 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Oct 4 2011, 07:22 PM) *
The new play area wouldn't have fitted in the old fence as it's much bigger.

As has already been suggested, and in the spirit of this thread perhaps those who want a fence should club together and raise the funds for it. Surely they wouldn't have a problem with this, if children's safety is more important than money?

Will you be willing to act as organiser for raising this funding?


That's not out of the question. Still would need the agreement of NTC to fence the area though at least in principle.
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SMJ
post Oct 4 2011, 07:15 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Oct 4 2011, 07:22 PM) *
The new play area wouldn't have fitted in the old fence as it's much bigger.



See above.
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user23
post Oct 4 2011, 07:17 PM
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QUOTE (SMJ @ Oct 4 2011, 08:13 PM) *
That's not out of the question. Still would need the agreement of NTC to fence the area though at least in principle.
And you'd also need to win over those who don't want it fenced off too, there's a few hundred of these.
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Andy Capp
post Oct 4 2011, 07:29 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Oct 4 2011, 08:17 PM) *
And you'd also need to win over those who don't want it fenced off too, there's a few hundred of these.

Against 1,200?
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Cognosco
post Oct 4 2011, 07:38 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Oct 4 2011, 07:22 PM) *
The new play area wouldn't have fitted in the old fence as it's much bigger.

As has already been suggested, and in the spirit of this thread perhaps those who want a fence should club together and raise the funds for it. Surely they wouldn't have a problem with this, if children's safety is more important than money?

Will you be willing to act as organiser for raising this funding?


Does this apply to all other council projects? I don't want the Wharf built on so let all those who do pay for it? Think of all the other projects in our two looney local councils pipelines? I suddenly have a feeling I don't want them so let those who do pay for it? I do think you may have some grovelling to do when you reach the Supreme Leaders Office tomorrow User for coming up with this excellent suggestion. Way to go User! rolleyes.gif


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Strafin
post Oct 4 2011, 07:45 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Oct 4 2011, 08:17 PM) *
And you'd also need to win over those who don't want it fenced off too, there's a few hundred of these.

And those who don't care enough to sign a petition.
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