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> Calls to reduce the A34 to a 50mph limit, Yet more namby pamby nonsense
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post Jan 23 2012, 11:59 AM
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http://www.newburytoday.co.uk/News/Article...articleID=18949

Basically, Brightwalton resident and Green party activist Adrian Hollister has said “enough is enough.” and wants the A34 between Oxfordshire boarder and the M4 to be a 50mph limit.

Apparently his year of living in West Ilsey was "living ****" (aww, bless him would he like a lollypop?)
According to this clearly very entertaining fellow he has no idea how he would get out of his driveway and worries about his children bicycling in town.

Adrian suggests average speed cameras (he fails to mention the large install and upkeep cost, plus paying for fines to be processed, that's not very green is it, plus the cameras are yellow), he adds:

QUOTE
“By doing so, I reckon 99 per cent of all the accidents on that road will go away, the traffic will flow more timely and the Downlands will be spared the anti-social driving of the panicked drivers searching for a diversion.”


Since when has a member of the green party been able to give advice on what to do with the roads without having a conflict of interests?

Oh no a few cars might have scratched their bumpers from time to time but at the end of the day changing the speed limit will not reduce crashes, it will just result in angrier drivers. Like when you're driving down the motorway and a lorry overtakes someone doing 52mph, causing the whole carridgeway to get tailbacked...inevitable they will be driving a Daewoo.

Brightwalton is a 6.8mile drive from the A34 and a 2.6 mile drive from the A338. The B4494 is closer but it's also quieter.
Well Adrian, I sincerely hope your children don't fall off their bicycles. And frankly assuming you live in the centre of Brightwalton, if you are letting your children cycle out far enough to get near to these major roads then I suggest you fit them with GPS tracking devices were you can not only monitor their speed and also keep an eye on their location so you can call upon your good friend the Honey Badger to rescue them. But if they did I doubt it would be because of someone doing 70mph on the A34.

*real reason for edit; being awesome*
Reason for edit: Breaching the rules of the forum
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Adrian Hollister
post Jan 23 2012, 02:34 PM
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QUOTE (xjay1337 @ Jan 23 2012, 11:59 AM) *
changing the speed limit will not reduce crashes, it will just result in angrier drivers


angry, but alive and well? rofl

Best laugh I've had all day thanks.
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Downlander
post Jan 23 2012, 02:51 PM
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Ahh, give the kid a break. I've got shoes that are older than him.
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Strafin
post Jan 23 2012, 03:50 PM
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I see where Adrian is coming from, I just don't think it would work. Compulsory motorway training would be a better idea, although the A34 isn't a motorway the principles are the same. Remaining in the left lane unless overtaking, and maintaining a proper distance between cars used to be a given.
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JeffG
post Jan 23 2012, 04:03 PM
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QUOTE (Strafin @ Jan 23 2012, 03:50 PM) *
Remaining in the left lane unless overtaking, and maintaining a proper distance between cars used to be a given.

I thought that already applied to any road, not just motorways (no special 'motorway training' needed).
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Guest_xjay1337_*
post Jan 23 2012, 04:08 PM
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I'm about as old as my shoe size actually. laugh.gif

QUOTE (Adrian Hollister @ Jan 23 2012, 02:34 PM) *
angry, but alive and well? rofl

Best laugh I've had all day thanks.


I did hope you spotted this! tongue.gif No-one dies from speed do they? Unless it's speed the drug. But then if you were driving at speed on speed then you'd probably have a bigger problem than your speed. blink.gif

I drive at 80mph on the motorway and the A34, in complete safety by being observant of cars in my mirrors and any possible queues up ahead, and by keeping a safe following distance, using the correct lane, etc, have never nearly had an accident on the motorway or the A34. And as most traffic goes about 70-80mph anyway you're hardly flying past everyone. Only times were things happen are when Deadrie in her Volvo is sat there doing 55mph chatting away to her friend, or sat about 2 inches from the wheel, tunnel vision engaged, not looking in her mirrors and realising she's causing massive tailbacks because lorries are going past at no rate of speed at all, thereby causing tailbacks for faster traffic!!

When I went on a plane (boy that was exciting, I slept most of the way) we were going at 500mph and we didn't have shunt! Unfortunately the causes of most accidents on the motorways are caused by falling asleep, texting, whatever. And whether you're doing 7 or 70 if you fall asleep or text while driving you will probably crash.
There aren't any corners, or junctions (well there's like one) or traffic lights, or pedestrians on the A34 which is where most accidents happen - and I think if the national limit dual carridgeways and the motorways were de restricted (aka go as fast as you like) the accident rate wouldn't rise by more than 5% because only about 5% of people would go over the limit, and maybe only 1% of them would crash...

The amounts of accidents caused by excessive speed are in the very low single percentile figures (between 3 and 8% depending where you look). In fact there are more accidents with cars in 30mph limits going UNDER the speed limit than there are on motorways AND dual carridgeways, full stop. So prooving that speeding does NOT cause accidents. Only a member of the green party would fight the battle on "speed" when in actual fact the modern day cars can stop about half as quickly as those cars on the road when the 70mph limit was introduced. So surely as logic goes we should be able to drive twice as quickly smile.gif

If there is a speed limit which makes no sense to the motoring public in general it will be ignored. The 50mph limit you would like makes no sense so it would be ignored.
It won't happen and if it does I'd eat my hat and be your milkman for a week.

**** why don't we just take your ideas and go one further and ban going over 30 all together? That way both the honey badger and your children on their bicycles would be safe and the fields would be green for many years to come (they won't, it'll just be colder and more rainy)

Edit: I forgot to mention that in this countries seemingly endless and relentless attack on speed and infact anything even slightly fun, you forgot to note that compared to 50 years ago, there are nearly 7 times as many cars on the roads and yet there are 3 times the number of deaths. Vehicle numbers aside, we are using cars far more often than before as well.

The accident rate has been near enough the same for the last 8 or 9 years - there's only so much you can do to reduce it, there will be a point where you can't have any less because there is only so much space.
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Downlander
post Jan 23 2012, 04:10 PM
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I'd like to see them extend the northbound slip road ex West Ilsley so that it directly joins the sliproad at the Chilton exit. It's only about half a mile. That would give an extra lane so that, in the event of accidents causing tailbacks, it would be quicker to get traffic off the A34 and diverted on to the old northbound route via Rowstock. (In the same way that the exit slip from the petrol station joins the West Ilsley exit southbound, with no need to rejoin the main carriageway)
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Strafin
post Jan 23 2012, 04:21 PM
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QUOTE (JeffG @ Jan 23 2012, 04:03 PM) *
I thought that already applied to any road, not just motorways (no special 'motorway training' needed).

It does apply all the time but it is still one of the biggest causes of tailbacks because people don't do it.
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Guest_xjay1337_*
post Jan 23 2012, 04:39 PM
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QUOTE (Downlander @ Jan 23 2012, 04:10 PM) *
I'd like to see them extend the northbound slip road ex West Ilsley so that it directly joins the sliproad at the Chilton exit. It's only about half a mile. That would give an extra lane so that, in the event of accidents causing tailbacks, it would be quicker to get traffic off the A34 and diverted on to the old northbound route via Rowstock. (In the same way that the exit slip from the petrol station joins the West Ilsley exit southbound, with no need to rejoin the main carriageway)


That would actually work pretty well thinking about it. Plus wouldn't cost all that much to do in relative terms. The winter is nearly over so old people don't need heating anymore. laugh.gif
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HJD
post Jan 23 2012, 05:14 PM
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QUOTE (xjay1337 @ Jan 23 2012, 04:08 PM) *
If there is a speed limit which makes no sense to the motoring public in general it will be ignored. The 50mph limit you would like makes no sense so it would be ignored.


C'mon xjay i thought you had a sense of adventure. Just imagine if Adrian Hollister got his wish the fun you could have overtaking & being undertook in return by those safety conscious juggernaut drivers laugh.gif You could be just like them & cause tailbacks for bleeding miles, oh that happens already doesn't it angry.gif Maybe you could also join those other cretins that stay over in the overtaking lane leaving the inside lane empty travelling inches behind each other so that anyone on the inside lane can't move out , i mean what would it matter. I suppose someone will propose a blanket 50 limit between Great Shefford & Wantage next ! Oh bugger there already is one now isn't there. sad.gif
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Adrian Hollister
post Jan 23 2012, 05:53 PM
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Speeding is such an emotive issue. So many people take it for granted and don't consider breaking the speed limit a problem. Of course in true nimby style, most don't want speeding near their house, but near your house is just fine.

It would be interesting to know if speed is your priority? The 9 miles from the M4 to the Harwell junction equates to just three minutes journey time difference (70<50). What does it honestly gain you?

I've always had my family and the welfare of my friends, family and community as my priority.


As to my political beliefs - at least I stand up for what I believe in. I don't hide behind pseudonyms and I hold myself accountable for what I say. It's easy to knock it, it's more difficult to go public and be judged. btw... interesting to note how most political parties shy away from these issues as they stir up emotional issues. Best we've had recently is a bit of jingoism about raising the speed limit on some motorways. If the government wanted to make a real difference, they would consider a road toll for non-UK vehicles - bet there would be a lot less long haul lorries on our roads allowing you your 'freedom of expression'.


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blackdog
post Jan 23 2012, 05:56 PM
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Every time I go up the A34 the traffic is rarely going more than 60mph - it's a road crying out for another lane or two. Bring on the M34!


And XJ - you seem to miss the point about speed limits. They don't prevent accidents but they do reduce the damage caused by the accidents - especially to the occupants of the vehicles involved.

Speed is a factor in every accident involving death or injury to the occupant of a car - halve the speed, quarter the damage.

And. lets face it, collisions between two stationary vehicles are not very common.
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Andy Capp
post Jan 23 2012, 05:59 PM
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QUOTE (Adrian Hollister @ Jan 23 2012, 05:53 PM) *
It would be interesting to know if speed is your priority? The 9 miles from the M4 to the Harwell junction equates to just three minutes journey time difference (70<50). What does it honestly gain you?

Is people going between 50 and 70 the problem?
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Guest_xjay1337_*
post Jan 23 2012, 06:08 PM
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QUOTE (Adrian Hollister @ Jan 23 2012, 05:53 PM) *
Speeding is such an emotive issue. So many people take it for granted and don't consider breaking the speed limit a problem. Of course in true nimby style, most don't want speeding near their house, but near your house is just fine.

It would be interesting to know if speed is your priority? The 9 miles from the M4 to the Harwell junction equates to just three minutes journey time difference (70<50). What does it honestly gain you?


Yes yes the whole "70 is only 3 minutes quicker than 50" - yes, technically yes but it feels so much quicker. If you only did things because of logical and boring reasons where would we be? I'm sure the fact that a teaspoon of your favourite table dressing would suffice for the given purpose but you put loads and loads in, 'cause you like it, right?

I don't think it's fine to speed near anyone's house, except that on the A34 there aren't any houses. Your choice to live within a 10 mile vicinity of said road doesn't mean you can complain. For example with the people who chose to move near to a race circuit. You KNEW there was a racetrack there, it's been there for hundreds of years before you moved (or in the case of the A34 maybe a few years) and yet instead of either accepting it and dealing with it, you "ignore" it and the complain about it later.

rolleyes.gif

QUOTE
I've always had my family and the welfare of my friends, family and community as my priority.


Excellent let's turn this into a party-political broadcast.


QUOTE
a road toll for non-UK vehicles - bet there would be a lot less long haul lorries on our roads allowing you your 'freedom of expression'.


Make that for commercial vehicles only (not really fair on Pierce and Audrey from France in their Renault Clio would it?) and I think that would be a good idea.

QUOTE (HJD @ Jan 23 2012, 05:14 PM) *
C'mon xjay i thought you had a sense of adventure. Just imagine if Adrian Hollister got his wish the fun you could have overtaking & being undertook in return by those safety conscious juggernaut drivers laugh.gif You could be just like them & cause tailbacks for bleeding miles, oh that happens already doesn't it angry.gif Maybe you could also join those other cretins that stay over in the overtaking lane leaving the inside lane empty travelling inches behind each other so that anyone on the inside lane can't move out , i mean what would it matter. I suppose someone will propose a blanket 50 limit between Great Shefford & Wantage next ! Oh bugger there already is one now isn't there. sad.gif


That sounds like a rounded days entertainment to be honest. smile.gif
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Adrian Hollister
post Jan 23 2012, 06:18 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Jan 23 2012, 05:59 PM) *
Is people going between 50 and 70 the problem?


Terminal speed between lorries crawling at 30mph or so and 70mph is twice that of 30mph to 50mph. Who knows what the difference is between the speeders and the lorries.
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Adrian Hollister
post Jan 23 2012, 06:24 PM
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QUOTE (xjay1337 @ Jan 23 2012, 06:08 PM) *
You KNEW there was a racetrack there, it's been there for hundreds of years before you moved (or in the case of the A34 maybe a few years) and yet instead of either accepting it and dealing with it, you "ignore" it and the complain about it later.


I must have missed the planning application for a racetrack called the A34 tongue.gif

So you agree that speed needs to be moderated, just near your house. rofl. nimby.

It also seems that in your world, nothing would ever change, even if it was broken. There is an accident blackspot at Ilsley. It's caused my a whole bunch of factors, I've not seen one that wouldn't be mitigated by a reduction in the speed differential between the slower traffic and the fastest.

QUOTE (xjay1337 @ Jan 23 2012, 06:08 PM) *
Excellent let's turn this into a party-political broadcast.


noob. you mentioned it over and over again... rofl.
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Guest_xjay1337_*
post Jan 23 2012, 06:35 PM
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QUOTE (Adrian Hollister @ Jan 23 2012, 06:24 PM) *
I must have missed the planning application for a racetrack called the A34 tongue.gif


Indeed I must

QUOTE
So you agree that speed needs to be moderated, just near your house. rofl. nimby.


Nope, that's not what I said is it now Adrian? You can tell you're in politics! rolleyes.gif I said it's not OK to speed near anyone's house, but the fact there isn't a house on the A34 means your argument isn't valid!

QUOTE
It also seems that in your world, nothing would ever change, even if it was broken. There is an accident blackspot at Ilsley. It's caused my a whole bunch of factors, I've not seen one that wouldn't be mitigated by a reduction in the speed differential between the slower traffic and the fastest.


Not really - Banning tractors would be easier for all than putting up a speedlimit no-one listens to. If you drive to Reading down the A4, from Aldi all the way up until the roundabout with the Beefeater thing on it, that used to be a 40mph. They made that into a 30 now. For no reason. They did it quietly as well, just a small sign, probably about half a foot tall and maybe 1 ft across saying "THIS AREA IS NOW A 30MPH ZONE" in size 8 font.
No-one listens to it (I actually do believe it or not) - Do you know why the speed limit was brought in?

Was it because there were lots of accidents in that area? - No...
Was it because residents complained about 40mph traffic through a fairly populated area? Not at all..
Was it because Reading Borough Council made a ****load of money?* Can't be...
Would it be because....oh wait, no - it was the money.

RBC got a grant/subsidy (I'm not exactly sure all I know is there council got a good chunk of money from it) as part of the "safer roads initiative" - nothing to do with safety as no accident rates were noted or measured. The simple act of making roads within the councils durastiction a 30 means more money. I have this as fact and would prefer to not say my sources incase I get people into trouble, can either believe or disbelieve that as you will. mellow.gif
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Adrian Hollister
post Jan 23 2012, 06:39 PM
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QUOTE (xjay1337 @ Jan 23 2012, 06:35 PM) *
RBC got a grant/subsidy (I'm not exactly sure all I know is there council got a good chunk of money from it) as part of the "safer roads initiative" - nothing to do with safety as no accident rates were noted or measured. I have this as fact and would prefer to not say my sources incase I get people into trouble, can either believe or disbelieve that as you will. mellow.gif

Would be happy to investigate. Send me a pm if it helps.
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Andy Capp
post Jan 23 2012, 06:42 PM
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QUOTE (Adrian Hollister @ Jan 23 2012, 06:18 PM) *
Terminal speed between lorries crawling at 30mph or so and 70mph is twice that of 30mph to 50mph. Who knows what the difference is between the speeders and the lorries.

I don't know what you mean by terminal speed in this instance, but the point I'm asking is, is the problem cause by vehicles travelling anywhere between 50 and 70mph?
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Rusty Bullet
post Jan 23 2012, 06:53 PM
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QUOTE (xjay1337 @ Jan 23 2012, 04:08 PM) *
I'm about as old as my shoe size actually.

That may just be your I.Q.

QUOTE (xjay1337 @ Jan 23 2012, 04:08 PM) *
No-one dies from speed do they?

Sadly, Donald Campbell is not able to join the forum at this juncture.

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