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> Europe - In or Out, Straw Poll for Forumisters
Andy Capp
post Feb 21 2016, 04:30 PM
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QUOTE (blackdog @ Feb 21 2016, 04:03 PM) *
How much of an opportunity? The boundary changes will ensure they are in power for another 20 years unless a miracle happens.

And what's the alternative? Give me EU bureaucrats over any politicians (any party, any country).

I would also be happy to join a United States of Europe - my only objection to the Euro is the absurdity of one currency, multiple economies.

The point is, if a sufficient amount of people wish it, then they can be removed. With Europe in control we have no mechanism as a country to reject their policies.
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Andy Capp
post Feb 21 2016, 04:35 PM
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I would be more in favour of a EU light, but to decide on the current one I have to say: 'Non'.
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user23
post Feb 21 2016, 05:42 PM
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In.

One look the collection of swivel eyed and leftie loons leading the Out campaign (some of whom would like to see us more closely aligned with Russia if we leave the EU) should tell you everything you need to know.

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TallDarkAndHands...
post Feb 21 2016, 06:00 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Feb 21 2016, 05:42 PM) *
In.

One look the collection of swivel eyed and leftie loons leading the Out campaign (some of whom would like to see us more closely aligned with Russia if we leave the EU) should tell you everything you need to know.



This is exactly the sort of c**p that gets my goat.
Don't vote out because 2 people you don't like are in favour of out.
So..... if these people were for "in" I guess you'd vote "out"??? laugh.gif
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Cognosco
post Feb 21 2016, 06:34 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Feb 21 2016, 05:42 PM) *
In.

One look the collection of swivel eyed and leftie loons leading the Out campaign (some of whom would like to see us more closely aligned with Russia if we leave the EU) should tell you everything you need to know.



Well you have confirmed I have chosen correctly by voting out if WBC spokesperson want's to stay in. rolleyes.gif


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user23
post Feb 21 2016, 07:01 PM
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QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 21 2016, 06:00 PM) *
This is exactly the sort of c**p that gets my goat.
Don't vote out because 2 people you don't like are in favour of out.
So..... if these people were for "in" I guess you'd vote "out"??? laugh.gif
Firstly they'd never be "in", it's not in their interests, secondly it's not just two, the Out roster including Michael Gove, Frank Field, Boris Jonhson and Jacob Rees-Mogg looks like a collection of the most eccentric politicians in the UK.
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TallDarkAndHands...
post Feb 21 2016, 07:16 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Feb 21 2016, 07:01 PM) *
Firstly they'd never be "in", it's not in their interests, secondly it's not just two, the Out roster including Michael Gove, Frank Field, Boris Jonhson and Jacob Rees-Mogg looks like a collection of the most eccentric politicians in the UK.


Define "Eccentric"? You are obviously a bigot. Intolerant of other peoples views that don't conform to your own. biggrin.gif
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On the edge
post Feb 21 2016, 07:56 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Feb 21 2016, 07:01 PM) *
Firstly they'd never be "in", it's not in their interests, secondly it's not just two, the Out roster including Michael Gove, Frank Field, Boris Jonhson and Jacob Rees-Mogg looks like a collection of the most eccentric politicians in the UK.


Throughout political history the big intellects in each party have never been popular;zi suppose because they don't court the cause of the moment. What is interesting is that these big thinkers are in the out camp. Ironically, they are also old liberals - small government, so would necessarily upset people who believe in a collective centrist approach to all things.

The concept of a common market (and if you think about it, that inevitably means eventual integration) is great in theory but experience demonstrates it simply doesn't work in practice.


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TallDarkAndHands...
post Feb 21 2016, 08:01 PM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Feb 21 2016, 07:56 PM) *
Throughout political history the big intellects in each party have never been popular;zi suppose because they don't court the cause of the moment. What is interesting is that these big thinkers are in the out camp. Ironically, they are also old liberals - small government, so would necessarily upset people who believe in a collective centrist approach to all things.

The concept of a common market (and if you think about it, that inevitably means eventual integration) is great in theory but experience demonstrates it simply doesn't work in practice.


Exactly. Nothing more to add.

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Simon Kirby
post Feb 21 2016, 08:09 PM
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I'm undecided. I don't particularly like the the concept of a trade association, mush less a federal Europe, and I would sooner Blighty was a sovereign state with a small government and that British companies were free to buy and sell stuff with whoever they liked. I don't like the degree to which the state - both European and domestic, has insinuated itself into every aspect of our lives when the role of the state should be nothing more than to provide for the peace and protection. It's not just Europe, but government at every level is self-serving and self-absorbed. However, I'm inclined to vote in because I really don't like the motivation behind some of the outers.


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TallDarkAndHands...
post Feb 21 2016, 08:23 PM
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QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ Feb 21 2016, 08:09 PM) *
I'm undecided. I don't particularly like the the concept of a trade association, mush less a federal Europe, and I would sooner Blighty was a sovereign state with a small government and that British companies were free to buy and sell stuff with whoever they liked. I don't like the degree to which the state - both European and domestic, has insinuated itself into every aspect of our lives when the role of the state should be nothing more than to provide for the peace and protection. It's not just Europe, but government at every level is self-serving and self-absorbed. However, I'm inclined to vote in because I really don't like the motivation behind some of the outers.


So you'd vote in not because that is what you believe but because of other peoples "motives"
Again the insinuation is that all "outers" have a hidden agenda.

99.9% don't. Why change your vote because of 0.01% of idiots??
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user23
post Feb 21 2016, 08:40 PM
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QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 21 2016, 07:16 PM) *
Define "Eccentric"? You are obviously a bigot. Intolerant of other peoples views that don't conform to your own.
I think I might need me to define both "Eccentric" and "Bigot" to you, before you throw around any more insults at people who don't agree with you.
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je suis Charlie
post Feb 21 2016, 08:42 PM
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QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ Feb 21 2016, 08:09 PM) *
I'm undecided. I don't particularly like the the concept of a trade association, mush less a federal Europe, and I would sooner Blighty was a sovereign state with a small government and that British companies were free to buy and sell stuff with whoever they liked. I don't like the degree to which the state - both European and domestic, has insinuated itself into every aspect of our lives when the role of the state should be nothing more than to provide for the peace and protection. It's not just Europe, but government at every level is self-serving and self-absorbed. However, I'm inclined to vote in because I really don't like the motivation behind some of the outers.

In that case, Comrade Corbyn wants in so we have to vote out. Same rationale.
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user23
post Feb 21 2016, 08:47 PM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Feb 21 2016, 07:56 PM) *
Throughout political history the big intellects in each party have never been popular;zi suppose because they don't court the cause of the moment. What is interesting is that these big thinkers are in the out camp. Ironically, they are also old liberals - small government, so would necessarily upset people who believe in a collective centrist approach to all things.

The concept of a common market (and if you think about it, that inevitably means eventual integration) is great in theory but experience demonstrates it simply doesn't work in practice.
Do you consider George Galloway and Nigel Farage "big intellects"?

Here's the former interviewing the latter on his Russia Today TV show.
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TallDarkAndHands...
post Feb 21 2016, 08:48 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Feb 21 2016, 08:40 PM) *
I think I might need to define both "Eccentric" and "Bigot" to you, before you throw around any more insults at people who don't agree with you.


laugh.gif
laugh.gif

Please do.
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je suis Charlie
post Feb 21 2016, 08:48 PM
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1st minister wants out of GT Britain but wants to stay in EU? How does that work?
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je suis Charlie
post Feb 21 2016, 08:50 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Feb 21 2016, 08:47 PM) *
Do you consider George Galloway and Nigel Farage "big intellects"?

Here's the former interviewing the latter on his Russia Today TV show.

Ah, yes, but, if we vote out what will UKIP have left in the toybox?
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TallDarkAndHands...
post Feb 21 2016, 08:51 PM
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QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 21 2016, 08:48 PM) *
1st minister wants out of GT Britain but wants to stay in EU? How does that work?


This could be a great thing. We vote out. Scots vote in. Scots get a new referendum. This time they grasp the thistle and leave.

If they do we'll have to put some border controls in to stop them from leaving and coming down south when they realise that they are bankrupt.

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je suis Charlie
post Feb 21 2016, 08:54 PM
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QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 21 2016, 08:51 PM) *
This could be a great thing. We vote out. Scots vote in. Scots get a new referendum. This time they grasp the thistle and leave.

If they do we'll have to put some border controls in to stop them from leaving and coming down south when they realise that they are bankrupt.

I giggle every time I look at the price of Brent crude!
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user23
post Feb 21 2016, 08:56 PM
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QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 21 2016, 08:50 PM) *
Ah, yes, but, if we vote out what will UKIP have left in the toybox?
One thing's for sure, they'll lose their EU funding.
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