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> Cologne , Stuttgart , Hamburg, Sweden...?
On the edge
post Jan 11 2016, 08:55 AM
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I'll be accused of making assumptions, but nevertheless, I'd strongly suspect that most of the women who do or did post here are like the men; of a certain age. They are simply peddling old fashioned feminism; seeing discrimination at every turn. It's over, the war has been won, but as 'us men' know, some old fighters never let it drop; just like us mentioning 'the war' whenever we see Germans.


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On the edge
post Jan 11 2016, 09:09 AM
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It is fairly obvious that the 'migrants' as a group are likely to contain a majority of fit, street wise males. Those with little to loose but much to gain. That's been true since time immemorial - even the great migrations to the States in the eighteenth century followed that.

So, then, quite apart from any humanitarian aid receiving countries might provide and quite apart from any physical barriers that might be constructed, it would make sound sense to provide a good measure of real policing. Protecting them and us.

That doesn't mean 'manning the barricades' but actually getting into the mass and keeping the peace. Not an answer to the big issue for sure, but let's face it, until that big issue is solved, they aren't going home and are just getting hotter and hotter.


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Turin Machine
post Jan 11 2016, 11:31 AM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Jan 11 2016, 08:55 AM) *
I'll be accused of making assumptions, but nevertheless, I'd strongly suspect that most of the women who do or did post here are like the men; of a certain age. They are simply peddling old fashioned feminism; seeing discrimination at every turn. It's over, the war has been won, but as 'us men' know, some old fighters never let it drop; just like us mentioning 'the war' whenever we see Germans.

Don't forget '66! That makes it three times! tongue.gif
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On the edge
post Jan 11 2016, 11:41 AM
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QUOTE (Turin Machine @ Jan 11 2016, 11:31 AM) *
Don't forget '66! That makes it three times! tongue.gif



Ah, but David Cameron was only born in 1966, he hasn't got us out yet tongue.gif


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Rdg
post Jan 11 2016, 12:40 PM
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This is the latest from the BBC

The German official responsible for investigating the attacks on women in Cologne on New Year's Eve says the suspects were "almost exclusively" those with a migration background, mainly North African and Arab.
Ralf Jaeger accused Cologne police of making "serious mistakes".

More than 500 criminal complaints have been filed - 40% alleging sexual assault - relating to 31 December.

The Pope said Europe's "humanistic spirit" risked being undermined.
The "immense influx" of migrants was causing problems, he said, but the continent had the means to strike a balance between protecting its citizens and helping migrants.

Mr Jaeger, the state interior minister of North Rhine-Westphalia (NRW), says that recent arrivals in Germany are among the suspects.
Nineteen individuals are currently under investigation in connection with the attacks, NRW's interior ministry says in a report (in German), none of them German nationals. The 19 suspects include 14 men from Morocco and Algeria. Ten of the suspects are asylum seekers, nine of whom arrived in Germany after September 2015. The other nine are possibly in Germany illegally, the interior ministry says.
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On the edge
post Jan 11 2016, 01:29 PM
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Again, should we be surprised? Here is a population base that is predominantly young male with no outlet for repressed energy. Similarly, let's also look at the numbers. What constitutes a sexual assault? I'm not trying to minimise anything but as we've seen in the UK in Yewtree, that could mean anything from slightly less than rape to a lewd look or comment. Yes, many migrants come from parts of the World where the treatment of women is dreadful. Even more reason why we actually need to properly police the masses whilst they are present. Similarly, publishing raw and frankly ill defined numbers is doing no one any favours. Let's look at some comparators, what is the complaints level eminating from our own disaffected youth? Similarly, what level of similar complaint eminated from football hooligans abroad in the 1970s etc? We might then get a bit of balance. Nonetheless, in the meantime, some effective policing shouldn't be beyond us.


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Simon Kirby
post Jan 11 2016, 01:38 PM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Jan 11 2016, 09:09 AM) *
It is fairly obvious that the 'migrants' as a group are likely to contain a majority of fit, street wise males. Those with little to loose but much to gain. That's been true since time immemorial - even the great migrations to the States in the eighteenth century followed that.

So, then, quite apart from any humanitarian aid receiving countries might provide and quite apart from any physical barriers that might be constructed, it would make sound sense to provide a good measure of real policing. Protecting them and us.

That doesn't mean 'manning the barricades' but actually getting into the mass and keeping the peace. Not an answer to the big issue for sure, but let's face it, until that big issue is solved, they aren't going home and are just getting hotter and hotter.

And it would help refugees integrate if they were welcomed and provided with housing and allowed to support themselves. As a refugee fleeing tyranny and arriving in Blighty you are not allowed to work and have to support yourself on £5/day with nothing but the clothes you stand up in. I don't know what the situation is in Germany and I am aware that Germany has done so very much more than the UK to meet this humanitarian disaster, but the ultra-right haters staging demonstrations are hardly welcoming and no discussion of social inclusion is complete without considering this rise of fascism.


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je suis Charlie
post Jan 11 2016, 03:48 PM
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QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ Jan 11 2016, 01:38 PM) *
but the ultra-right haters staging demonstrations are hardly welcoming and no discussion of social inclusion is complete without considering this rise of fascism.

Like these?


Or these?
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Simon Kirby
post Jan 11 2016, 06:30 PM
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QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Jan 11 2016, 03:48 PM) *

Keine gewalt gegen frauen? You think this is directed at immigrants? It wasn't until 1997 that Germany outlawed marital rape - until that time it was not even a crime for a husband to rape his wife, and the law didn't even recognise that men could be raped at all.

Now obviously I'm happy to think that people are starting to assert the notion that the absence of violence towards women, or anybody else for that matter, is an essential element of a civilised society - I believe it passionately, but not everyone supports that idea.

Here are some of the 5,000 neo-nazis who rioted in Cologne in 2014 - it puts the New Years events into perspective, as does the lack of any real coverage - but then there's not a black face amongst them is there.



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On the edge
post Jan 11 2016, 06:33 PM
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Care to explain where they are from?


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spartacus
post Jan 11 2016, 11:55 PM
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QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ Jan 11 2016, 06:30 PM) *
Here are some of the 5,000 neo-nazis who rioted in Cologne in 2014 - it puts the New Years events into perspective, as does the lack of any real coverage - but then there's not a black face amongst them is there.


I fail to see the correlation... That photo (taken from either the Al Jazeera or Daily Sabah websites) is hardly the most frightening example of 'neo-nazis' in mid-riot.. very German too as if this is mid-riot it's very tidy and not even a broken glass or McD's wrapper on the floor... Go to any England football match and you'll see a hundred other ugly buggers wrapped in their national flag (St George optional) making faces at the camera....

Either way, if you want to 'compare and contrast' and 'put things into perspective' I think you'll find that whatever the neo-nazi thugs did is a whole mindset removed from the particular games being undertaken by the new wave of crimmigrants that Merkel has invited into her home. New Years Eve in Koln and in a number of other large german towns saw a wave of violent attacks against women in a specific 'mob activity' gaining momentum and now being given a name of Taharrush gamea in the German press. This is a cultural thing and is becoming endemic as white women as seen as fair game at night in a large crowd and the perpetrators see that they can get away with attacking women as there are just too many people pulling and groping and attacking the women for them to be prosecuted.



Video links are available but frankly they're NSFW.
QUOTE (Simon Kirby @ Jan 11 2016, 06:30 PM) *
but then there's not a black face amongst them is there.

Not many black faces in the 'Taharrush' thing.... it seems to be a particularly arab activity where women are no more deserving of respect than a donkey needing a kick..... If you dress 'respectably' and wear a hijab or go the whole hog and trundle around in a burqah you will be unharmed, but if you are in western dress then you are in for a rough time..... Coming to a square near you.....
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spartacus
post Jan 12 2016, 12:34 AM
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There are a lot of jangling nerves for the organisers of this year's Karneval, which is a major celebration in the Koln and Dusseldorf area of Germany. The new police chief will be keen to stay in his post, so policing will be 'robust' but at the same time they are trying to allow Germans and visitors to enjoy Fasching and get hammered.... getting the balance will be interesting to see and on 4 Feb (start of Karneval) I suspect there will be an ugly side and added tension this year which could start to see Mutti's Grand Plan of open-armed multi-culturalism unravel
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On the edge
post Jan 12 2016, 09:17 AM
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I see, in summary I think you are suggesting that the actions of disaffected young thugs in Germany or indeed here are in no way similar to the same sort of behaviours we see sometimes in disaffected immigrants? A stretch too far me thinks!

Frankly, it seems to me that it's a convenient political excuse to 'big up' what's happening with the immigrants because it covers a more dangerous and issue at home. Not the only place that's happening!

Just as an aside, on the subject of 'migrant labour'. I overheard a conversation which centred on the number of Indians seen in Newbury, who seem to be working close by. Someone then said it wasn't surprising really as big V had sold them the off shoot for whom they are working!

Now that's going to be interesting isn't it George, now you and your clever predecessors have flogged off British industry. It seems that the migrant worker tide isn't going to turn...


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James_Trinder
post Jan 12 2016, 12:02 PM
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QUOTE (spartacus @ Jan 11 2016, 11:55 PM) *
very German too as if this is mid-riot it's very tidy and not even a broken glass or McD's wrapper on the floor...


This reminds me of when I went to Bamberg (a Newbury sized town in Bavaria) with my parents when I was younger. We were walking past the central railway station when a car full of youths blaring out loud music came to a sudden stop near us. Unexpectedly one of the lads carefully deposited an empty can of beer into the bin before getting back into the car, which drove off at speed again.

I doubt that this would ever happen anywhere in the UK.
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The Hatter
post Jan 12 2016, 07:05 PM
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QUOTE (James_Trinder @ Jan 12 2016, 12:02 PM) *
This reminds me of when I went to Bamberg (a Newbury sized town in Bavaria) with my parents when I was younger. We were walking past the central railway station when a car full of youths blaring out loud music came to a sudden stop near us. Unexpectedly one of the lads carefully deposited an empty can of beer into the bin before getting back into the car, which drove off at speed again.

I doubt that this would ever happen anywhere in the UK.


Not on Turnpike where it looks as if the bin men deliver these days.
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On the edge
post Jan 13 2016, 03:22 PM
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We can shout and scream as much as we like, but still the masses will come. Sure, we can fence off and guard the tunnel and erect a fence along the French coast, they'll still come. If not Calais, then see what happens once they realise Rotterdam etc might be an easier path. I wonder how calm we'll be next summer when the real consequences of the Osbo economic wonder starts to take effect.

What is our plan for making the places they come from economically viable so 'migrants' actually don't want to leave?


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je suis Charlie
post Jan 13 2016, 06:38 PM
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Pill boxes, razor wire, attack dogs, lots of things we haven't tried yet.
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je suis Charlie
post Jan 13 2016, 06:42 PM
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Yet more consequences of the immigrant tide,
http://metro.co.uk/2016/01/13/jews-in-fran...r-days-5621427/
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On the edge
post Jan 13 2016, 09:23 PM
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Eek! Have the killer bees started to arrive yet? Apparently in the US, 'Corbyn' could be the CIA code word for an invasion from outer space. Makes you think doesn't it!

Don't panic Mr Mainwairing, they don't like it up 'em.


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x2lls
post Jan 14 2016, 12:19 AM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Jan 13 2016, 09:23 PM) *
Eek! Have the killer bees started to arrive yet? Apparently in the US, 'Corbyn' could be the CIA code word for an invasion from outer space. Makes you think doesn't it!

Don't panic Mr Mainwairing, they don't like it up 'em.



Glad to see someone is keeping the beer industry going. blink.gif


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