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> Crime Tsunami?
Guest_noobree_*
post Jul 16 2009, 11:55 AM
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I think I read in the NWN recently that crime rates in Newbury had increased by 30% in the last year.

I've never been one to argue that simply having more police presence is the solution because life's more complicated than that. It's impossible for the police to be everywhere and there are lots of arguments against the idea of having more coppers on the beat discourages criminals (e.g. they can see the boys and girls in uniform just as easily as we can and they just lie low until the area is clear).

However, the constant drip of burglaries seems to be worsening by the day. Maybe not a Tsunami yet (where we lived before we were burgalled 3 times and that was par for the course) but something bad is happening. And down here south of the river we rarely see either police on the beat.

My guess is that TVP concentrate their personpower in Reading and other hotspots and that leafy Newbury gets a bad deal.

Are there any pf the girls and boys in blue on here who could shed some anonymous light on the problem? Maybe the whole thing has been caused by Neigbourhood Action Groups - crime has certainly rocketed since they were established!!
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Iommi
post Jul 16 2009, 12:09 PM
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I understand that Reading gets the lion's share in police resources (in terms of police per square mile) and Newbury, by comparison, is quiet.
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GMR
post Jul 16 2009, 01:57 PM
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Whether one agrees that Newbury is a bad crime area or not it is starting to get a reputation. I was speaking to somebody who has never been to Newbury and they said "Oh, you live in Newbury.... I wouldn't like to live there with all that crime." sad.gif
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scott
post Jul 16 2009, 04:27 PM
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QUOTE (GMR @ Jul 16 2009, 02:57 PM) *
I was speaking to somebody who has never been to Newbury and they said "Oh, you live in Newbury.... I wouldn't like to live there with all that crime." sad.gif


LOL

where do they live? moss side? are our local small time crimes being reported nationally now? (lets be fair, burglary, fights, etc are pretty small time. touch wood, cant remember a murder etc for a long time)


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GMR
post Jul 16 2009, 06:22 PM
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QUOTE (scott @ Jul 16 2009, 05:27 PM) *
LOL

where do they live? moss side? are our local small time crimes being reported nationally now? (lets be fair, burglary, fights, etc are pretty small time. touch wood, cant remember a murder etc for a long time)



All I know is that they come from up North.

Usually if you mention Newbury they say "Where is that?" and then you have to explain Vodafone, Newbury Racecourse and near the Hungerford massacre before the penny drops.
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anon123
post Jul 16 2009, 06:37 PM
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Your opening post was spot on noobree. those that are left at Newbury are over worked, under manned and dispite what most might think, Work damm hard to look after the area and do the best job they can.

That said, I wouldnt live anywhere else, I love the town!
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JeffG
post Jul 16 2009, 07:20 PM
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Ooh! ph34r.gif (<-note the disguise)

Do I detect (pun!) an anonymous police presence? I look forward to seeing the other side of the argument put in other posts where the police are discussed. Can only be good for public relations.
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Biker1
post Jul 16 2009, 07:34 PM
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QUOTE (GMR @ Jul 16 2009, 07:22 PM) *
All I know is that they come from up North.

Usually if you mention Newbury they say "Where is that?" and then you have to explain Vodafone, Newbury Racecourse and near the Hungerford massacre before the penny drops.


I find that a mention of the by-pass and Greenham Common usually puts us on the map for them!
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anon123
post Jul 16 2009, 07:56 PM
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JeffG, your powers of detection can't be that great. Police employees have been posting on NWN for years. The problem is they are few and far between because:

1) Generally MOP's have made up their minds and are not interested in the otherside.
2) Someone usually see's it as an oppurtunity to have a go hidden behind the security of their computer screen. Why would one want to be verbally abused on a computer at home when they can spend 12hours a day at work getting it face to face.
3) Fear of detection by management.

A & B are observations of posters comments on this forum.

General concensus is that local police are useless, lazy and spend most of their time dealing with pointless things (just opinion formed from posters comments). Thats like me coming to your office with no idea what it is you do and accusing you of being rubbish at your job. But, they deal with the things that are reported, what's pointless to one is not so pointless to the person if effects!!

The best way to get the opinion of your local police is to go to the station and ask them. If you want to know about policing in your town, ask? Go to a Neighbourhood meeting, speak to the station boss.

I won't be entering into a full blown discussion about this issue and don't expect me to be posting my opinion on many police related topics. I like my job
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GMR
post Jul 16 2009, 07:59 PM
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QUOTE (Biker1 @ Jul 16 2009, 08:34 PM) *
I find that a mention of the by-pass and Greenham Common usually puts us on the map for them!



Yes, that as well. wink.gif
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GMR
post Jul 16 2009, 08:18 PM
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QUOTE
General concensus is that local police are useless, lazy and spend most of their time dealing with pointless things (just opinion formed from posters comments). Thats like me coming to your office with no idea what it is you do and accusing you of being rubbish at your job. But, they deal with the things that are reported, what's pointless to one is not so pointless to the person if effects!!


I wouldn’t say the police are lazy and I do agree that they work hard at what they do.

As for “pointless”; there are priorities and there are priorities. Yob crime, abuse, criminal damage are more in important than dealing with certain traffic offences and petty crimes (but you always see them quick to jump and score at low level crime). What annoys people is when the police concentrate on pointless crime while more serious crime gets overlooked; when reported. I’ve reported crimes that I had witnessed and there have been other cases where people have reported crimes and the perpetrator hasn’t been brought to book. This annoys people and that is when people start pointing the finger at the police. Now you can argue that that isn’t always their fault and I agree; but it is somebody’s fault and I do know that many police officers aren’t happy. Individually you can’t blame the police but don’t they have a collective responsibility? The police are quick to march the streets of London protesting about their pay, why can’t they do the same when certain convictions are turned down by a higher authority?

I talk to many police officers who are furious with higher authority but your unions aren’t doing anything to deal with their concerns. Also; you read in the papers that certain counties the police have a no tolerance policy but in other areas they don’t. So it is up to the individual police force then? Does one area regard their citizens a higher priority than others? All counties should have a no tolerance policy and courts should act accordingly.

People take their anger out at the police because they are the praetorian guard of the governments and courts, or seen as.
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Iommi
post Jul 16 2009, 11:24 PM
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QUOTE (anon123 @ Jul 16 2009, 08:56 PM) *
1) Generally MOP's have made up their minds and are not interested in the otherside.

I'm not not interested, I'm interested in what really goes on. What is a shame that the Police don't do more to engage the public. Take his forum for instance, it would be a good area for the Police to come and debate 'openly'.

QUOTE (anon123 @ Jul 16 2009, 08:56 PM) *
2) Someone usually see's it as an oppurtunity to have a go hidden behind the security of their computer screen. Why would one want to be verbally abused on a computer at home when they can spend 12hours a day at work getting it face to face.

I can understand that, it must be a thankless task.

QUOTE (anon123 @ Jul 16 2009, 08:56 PM) *
3) Fear of detection by management.

And this attitude by the management just makes them look like cowards and the public sense this - see first comment.

QUOTE (anon123 @ Jul 16 2009, 08:56 PM) *
A & B are observations of posters comments on this forum. General concensus is that local police are useless, lazy and spend most of their time dealing with pointless things (just opinion formed from posters comments). Thats like me coming to your office with no idea what it is you do and accusing you of being rubbish at your job. But, they deal with the things that are reported, what's pointless to one is not so pointless to the person if effects!!

That is true, but some people have lost faith in the police and don't see them as the guardians that they might have once been seen as. Youths don't seem to fear the police like they once might have.

QUOTE (anon123 @ Jul 16 2009, 08:56 PM) *
The best way to get the opinion of your local police is to go to the station and ask them. If you want to know about policing in your town, ask? Go to a Neighbourhood meeting, speak to the station boss.

I didn't know there were any there! tongue.gif

QUOTE (anon123 @ Jul 16 2009, 08:56 PM) *
I won't be entering into a full blown discussion about this issue and don't expect me to be posting my opinion on many police related topics. I like my job

Cushy little number, eh? tongue.gif
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GMR
post Jul 16 2009, 11:43 PM
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QUOTE
What is a shame that the Police don't do more to engage the public. Take his forum for instance, it would be a good area for the Police to come and debate 'openly'.


I agree totally with you on this. However, I was told that it is a policy of the police not to get into debates with the public; how do I know this? After witnessing a crime and getting no response I sent a couple of emails to a certain police officer (I am a member of a NAG committee). I didn’t get any response to my email other than we will look into your complaint (which they did). Nevertheless when I tried to engage them even more – being connected with the NAG committee - I was told – again - that they weren’t allowed to enter into debate with me because of policy. I was also told – as a member of NAG – that debating with the police the NAG wasn’t the time or place. When I asked “where was the right time or place?” I didn’t get a reply. When I asked what was the point of the NAG committees up and down the country I was told that they are PR exercises to show they were engaged in public discussion (a contradiction there me thinks). I was later told by a senior police officer a few years ago that they were a “necessary evil.” A government initiative.


It is a sad reflection on the police force when they don't/ can't get into debate with the people who pay their wages.
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Iommi
post Jul 16 2009, 11:54 PM
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I agree and this 'technique' is used all over the civil services, NHS for instance, they hide behind patient confidentiality, etc. I can understand that they cannot be too candid, but they would help themselves if they were more visible and approachable. Other than I have two friends who are police officers and I work with a part time officer, I don't know of any other policeman. Which probably isn't a bad thing! tongue.gif
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Bloggo
post Jul 17 2009, 08:41 AM
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QUOTE (anon123 @ Jul 16 2009, 08:56 PM) *
JeffG, your powers of detection can't be that great. Police employees have been posting on NWN for years. The problem is they are few and far between because:

1) Generally MOP's have made up their minds and are not interested in the otherside.
2) Someone usually see's it as an oppurtunity to have a go hidden behind the security of their computer screen. Why would one want to be verbally abused on a computer at home when they can spend 12hours a day at work getting it face to face.
3) Fear of detection by management.

A & B are observations of posters comments on this forum.

General concensus is that local police are useless, lazy and spend most of their time dealing with pointless things (just opinion formed from posters comments). Thats like me coming to your office with no idea what it is you do and accusing you of being rubbish at your job. But, they deal with the things that are reported, what's pointless to one is not so pointless to the person if effects!!

The best way to get the opinion of your local police is to go to the station and ask them. If you want to know about policing in your town, ask? Go to a Neighbourhood meeting, speak to the station boss.

I won't be entering into a full blown discussion about this issue and don't expect me to be posting my opinion on many police related topics. I like my job

I don't expect you to answer this as I know it is difficult.
I've no doubt that you as individuals are doing the best job you can however I think that your bosses don't have the political will to tackle low level crime head on and low level crime leads to high level crime. We need a zero tolerance policy to make any difference.
You say yourself that you are subject to abuse on a daily basis from the low-life that you come into content with. Not so long ago the police were respected and would not tolerate such abuse or disrespect. This can't be acceptable to either the Force or the public.
My perception of Newbury is the same as Noobree and GMR in that standards are slipping, crime is rising and in my opinion the police are not responding to this in a way that I would wish.
I'm just so disappointed that I don't see it improving.


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Bloggo
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TallDarkAndHands...
post Jul 17 2009, 09:10 AM
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QUOTE (Bloggo @ Jul 17 2009, 09:41 AM) *
I don't expect you to answer this as I know it is difficult.
I've no doubt that you as individuals are doing the best job you can however I think that your bosses don't have the political will to tackle low level crime head on and low level crime leads to high level crime. We need a zero tolerance policy to make any difference.
You say yourself that you are subject to abuse on a daily basis from the low-life that you come into content with. Not so long ago the police were respected and would not tolerate such abuse or disrespect. This can't be acceptable to either the Force or the public.
My perception of Newbury is the same as Noobree and GMR in that standards are slipping, crime is rising and in my opinion the police are not responding to this in a way that I would wish.
I'm just so disappointed that I don't see it improving.



Bloggo - Saw a guy on a bike drinking a can of Special Brew cycling past a PC the other day. He was innebriated and a danger to both himself and the Public. I KNOW the PC saw him slugging out of his can but he did nothing. Yet if this guy got injured we would have to pay for his medical bills, his benefits etc etc. As its Ok to now drink and cycle I presume that we'll soon all be able to get in our cars after 6 or 7 pints down the local.
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Bloggo
post Jul 17 2009, 09:18 AM
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QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Jul 17 2009, 10:10 AM) *
Bloggo - Saw a guy on a bike drinking a can of Special Brew cycling past a PC the other day. He was innebriated and a danger to both himself and the Public. I KNOW the PC saw him slugging out of his can but he did nothing. Yet if this guy got injured we would have to pay for his medical bills, his benefits etc etc. As its Ok to now drink and cycle I presume that we'll soon all be able to get in our cars after 6 or 7 pints down the local.

Yep, unbelievable what the police turn a blind eye to and the morons can get away with.
You have to ask why wasn't he at least stopped and advised of his foolish, ant-social and down right stupid behaviour.
You're right if this behaviour is seen as acceptable then it can only get worse.


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GMR
post Jul 17 2009, 09:42 AM
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QUOTE (Iommi @ Jul 17 2009, 12:54 AM) *
I agree and this 'technique' is used all over the civil services, NHS for instance, they hide behind patient confidentiality, etc. I can understand that they cannot be too candid, but they would help themselves if they were more visible and approachable. Other than I have two friends who are police officers and I work with a part time officer, I don't know of any other policeman. Which probably isn't a bad thing! tongue.gif



My daughter is going out with a police officer and all the police officers I know are very kind and friendly. But, yes they should engage more with the public. There seems a them and us atmosphere and the only people who can change it are the police.
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anon123
post Jul 17 2009, 11:22 AM
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Bloggo lack of respect by "low life" and their verbal abuse is nothing new it is why they are low life. No amount of improvement in policing will ever change that.

As for community engagement, it works both ways. I have lost count of the times I have stopped to buy some lunch (contrary to popular believe were human and do need some fuel occasionally)! and been verbally abused by someone who think's they don't pay my wages for me to stop and eat! Or for not being busy because I have time to eat.... you get the picture!
I get dirty looks from people for filling up my police car at the petrol station! I always try to be polite to people but very rarely get it back. Im sure if you spent all day trying to be nice to people and only got grief back you'd sometimes wonder why you bothered and stop bothering. That's a basic standard of the human race.
Yes there are some officers who are damm right arrogant, lazy and rude but, the majority are not!

The overall workings of the police are decided way higher up than the PC on the street, but he/she is always the one that gets the grief. Give them a break and direct your anger and frustration to the people that do have the power to change things.
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Iommi
post Jul 17 2009, 11:34 AM
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Yes, my feelings are, as above, the police are a 'political football' and I also feel that the senior ranks are letting the junior one's down. I can't remember a police officer that has treated me badly. They have usually treated my with courtesy. We had an officer that was assigned to our area and he was great, sadly, his abilities were recognised and he moved on. This another thing that happens, it seems, that large cities and towns get the pick of the ambitious ones due to improved wage deals.
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