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Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Jun 22 2012, 11:14 AM

I mean if its good enough for the Super Rich.... Now where is that off-shore tax haven?

Posted by: Biker1 Jun 22 2012, 11:16 AM

You have to be self employed and super rich to qualify.
Us poor old employees have to cough up to support the 1% people as it's taken away from us before we even see it.
PAYE eh? Propping up the nation (just?).

Posted by: Bloggo Jun 22 2012, 11:31 AM

Tax avoidance and tax evasion were two of the reasons that Greece's economy has collapsed.
Could the same happen to the UK?

Posted by: andy1979uk Jun 22 2012, 11:39 AM

Tax is paid so that people can claim benefits.

Posted by: Bloggo Jun 22 2012, 11:50 AM

Well, not exclusively

Posted by: andy1979uk Jun 22 2012, 11:55 AM

One third of all the tax revenue goes on welfare

Posted by: Bloggo Jun 22 2012, 12:03 PM

That may be so but what has it to do with some, the richer of us, paying less tax on their income than those paying PAYE?

Posted by: Andy Capp Jun 22 2012, 12:09 PM

And 100% of welfare is not benefits.

Posted by: Andy Capp Jun 22 2012, 12:10 PM

Nothing; andy is just doing what he enjoys most: stirring it up.

Posted by: Bloggo Jun 22 2012, 12:20 PM

How odd. No accounting for some people eh?

Posted by: andy1979uk Jun 22 2012, 12:28 PM

Welfare is a joke, costs us billins and alot is wasted.

Posted by: Andy Capp Jun 22 2012, 12:33 PM

See what I mean?

Posted by: lordtup Jun 22 2012, 01:14 PM

If , and it's a big if , the loopholes were closed and everyone paid the same rate of tax then there would be no need for accountants ( higher unemployment ) no incentive to work harder or desire to be altruistic.

I bet there is not a single one of us who would not jump at the chance of paying less tax if we could get away with it especially when we witness how it is wasted but that's human nature I'm afraid .

Personally I think there are a lot more pressing matters than a few bob missing from the fiscal coffers .

Posted by: TallDarkAndHandsome Jun 22 2012, 01:56 PM

My point is that IF PAYE earners had the opportunity to not pay as much tax they would. Thats human nature. So why not bring in a law that any income generated by individuals must be paid into a payroll company and they subject such individuals to PAYE type taxation. Also make it an imprisonable offence to work for 'cash in the hand'. Why should PAYE earners pay for the good life of others? I know this would be very difficult to enforce but turning a blind eye to such matters is costing the country billions. And billions is what we need.

Posted by: JeffG Jun 22 2012, 02:27 PM

No you don't and no you don't.

Posted by: Squelchy Jun 22 2012, 02:37 PM

http://citywire.co.uk/money/chart-of-the-day-how-the-government-spends-your-money/a576015

Admin? Sorry for the off-site link, but it's informative and easy to read in an 'at-a-glance' sort of way.

Posted by: Jayjay Jun 22 2012, 06:13 PM

"For example, according to HMRC £1,900.71 of Mr Smith's tax bill is spent on Welfare. Of this £800 goes on old age, £346.10 on sickness and disability, £238.30 on family and children, £198.58 on housing and £56.74 on umemployment."

Out of the 1,900 spent on welfare, only a small proportion is spent on what most of us would consider welfare (unemployment £56).

Posted by: Timbo Jun 22 2012, 06:24 PM

Questioning why the old age get 40% of the budget.... I think that is quite unfair.

Posted by: Andy Capp Jun 22 2012, 06:58 PM

Perhaps you would explain why you think it is unfair?

Posted by: GMR Jun 22 2012, 07:47 PM

Because they've got the money, you haven't. Money opens doors and tickles the odd maiden... the poor or middle classes are just sheep, ready to follow when the government click their fingers. That is life Jim, but not as the rich know it.

Posted by: On the edge Jun 22 2012, 08:28 PM

Can't quite understand why the IR35(?) rules for contractors tax aren't applied. After all the 'performers' are just contracting with a broadcaster or such like. So is the BBC complicit?

Posted by: dannyboy Jun 22 2012, 08:41 PM

Carr earns at least £3.3 million a year. On that 3.3 million he paid 1% tax, or £33000.00

That is more than I earn in a year....

Posted by: Simon Kirby Jun 22 2012, 08:47 PM

I have absolutely no idea if this is right, but my gut feeling is that tax law has become so hopelessly complex that if you can afford a good accountant you can always find a way around paying. The government call them "loopholes", but that's just spin to cover their embarrassment that they're not able to collect the tax they'd like to. The government are to introduce a new law to close some of these loopholes which basically allows the government to interpret the words of any piece of tax legislation in whatever way is most convenient for them - and this is an appallingly dangerous lurch away from the rule of law - isn't this what Magna Carta was about?

Posted by: Andy Capp Jun 22 2012, 09:09 PM

Of course, the subtext to all this, is because of Carr's lawyers, governments are going to be less inclined to invest in similar projects again. So the entertainment industry loses out as well.

Posted by: JeffG Jun 23 2012, 11:43 AM

I would imagine that IR35 would only apply if the BBC supplied him with a script and told him to read it. IR35 only applies if the contractor is given specific tasks to do, in the same way as an employee would be.

Posted by: lordtup Jun 23 2012, 11:54 AM

Just for the record sheep are pretty intelligent animals compared to some of their mammalian contemporaries , after all when did you last here of one paying tax or being exposed in the tabloid press for nefarious activities.

Posted by: Andy Capp Jun 23 2012, 11:56 AM

That doesn't make sense to me. When would someone not be give specific tasks to do? I thought IR35 applied where you worked exclusively for an organisation.

Posted by: On the edge Jun 23 2012, 02:58 PM

Suspect he just gets, whilst you really do earn!

Is he really that good? Will he be hosting shows into his 80's? The answer to his problem is in our hands.

Posted by: On the edge Jun 23 2012, 03:04 PM

Interesting take. Have employed several IT contractors over the years, often where they work for me on a say two or three day week basis oiver a period. IR35 always applies. I tell them what I want - but certainly can't tell them how to do it! So, unless they have the certificates - tax is taken.

Posted by: Cognosco Jun 23 2012, 03:08 PM

The government know the loopholes are there of course, but only for some to use....why do you think they were left there for?

Posted by: On the edge Jun 23 2012, 03:10 PM

Fcinating point! Suggest worthy of a thread on its own. You are probably quite right, however - the entertainment industry is an oligopoly at best in the UK, in my view fuelled by the size and influence of the public service broadcaster. We have dozens of 'performing arts colleges'and such like, but how often do we see really new and different talent? Of course, they are onlty delivering what we the publoic want....!

Posted by: Andy Capp Jun 23 2012, 04:00 PM

The merits of this particular enterprise is debatable, but in this case, the tax 'cheats' could be seen as sh!ting in their own nest.

Posted by: On the edge Jun 23 2012, 04:02 PM

Very true!!

Posted by: JeffG Jun 23 2012, 04:14 PM

Discussion about IR35 rules http://www.contractorcalculator.co.uk/how_determine_your_contract_passes_ir35.aspx. Points 4, 5 and 6 are particularly interesting. Thank goodness I don't have to bother with that sort of stuff any more! The revenue want to treat (and tax) contractors as employees, but conveniently ignore the fact that they don't get paid holidays or sickness, and have to pay both employer's and employee's NI contributions.

Posted by: Biker1 Jun 24 2012, 08:37 AM

Explain please.
How do I get off PAYE?

Posted by: JeffG Jun 24 2012, 09:04 AM

Either work for yourself, or retire! . Seriously, mitigating tax liability is not a crime - it's only the excessive amount that was avoided in this case that's caused all the fuss. Perhaps there will be another knee-jerk reaction by the government akin to the http://dangerousdogsact.com that affects more moderate schemes.

Posted by: Biker1 Jun 24 2012, 09:10 AM

Which is what I said and you refuted???

Posted by: Jayjay Jun 24 2012, 09:51 AM

Why would you be able to get off paying PAYE if you retire?

Posted by: Andy Capp Jun 24 2012, 09:56 AM

Because you wouldn't be working!

Posted by: Biker1 Jun 24 2012, 10:02 AM

Don't you pay it on a pension?

Posted by: Andy Capp Jun 24 2012, 10:03 AM

Yes if it is a private pension, provided it is above a certain amount. If it is only a state pension, then it is done by self assessment.

Posted by: JeffG Jun 24 2012, 10:23 AM

Yes of course, my sloppy reply. My real point being it doesn't stop someone from mitigating tax liability on any savings (inheritance tax for instance).

Posted by: Jayjay Jun 24 2012, 11:41 AM

Vodafone’s tax bill fell from £140 million in 2010 to zero in 2011. Profits rose by 16% over the same period to £402 million. This is on top of the £6billion tax bill the taxman let them off the year before.