Bullying , at school and on line . Options

[lordtup]

On this morning's BBC news , there was an extremely thought provoking piece on teenage bullying .
It centred around the tragic case of a girl who took her own life because of the despicable behaviour of some of her contemporaries ,both at school and on line .
The ins and outs of the case are not relevant , what is is the fact that a young person who should never have been subjected to this sort of treatment , but was , and found she couldn't take any more , took the only path available to end the torment .

I know very little of on line networking ,but I vividly remember in my day a school bully being thrashed ( and I mean thrashed ) by the head in front of the whole school .
This had two effects , firstly the bully bullied no more and secondly no other boy saw fit to take his place .
Maybe we have no real desire to return to the day's of head masters strutting round with cane in hand administering ad hoc punishment , but I don't recall anyone being driven to suicide by the mindless antics of the few .

The school may well argue that what happens outside their premises is not their concern ; I beg to differ . The welfare of our children is a joint responsibility between parent and state . We entrust the education to persons who are trained to do so . The fact that a percentage of children are leaving the system without the social skills ( 3 Rs) required , indicates that some of these are failing in their obligation .

The most galling thing about this ,and similar cases , is that nothing concrete is ever done to solve the problem , just more meaningless rhetorical bandying of statistics .All political sides seem unable or unwilling to grab this particular nettle , I just hope no one else has their life blighted while they dither some more .

[Guest_Bill1_*]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/edinbu...ast/8362127.stm


Words fail me!

[Biker1]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/edinbu...ast/8362127.stm


Words fail me!

It gets worse doesn't it?

Where will it all end?

Or as the saying goes - If you tolerate this........................

[On the edge]

"a chaotic, abusive and violent home background" characterised by parental neglect and the absence of appropriate guidelines; active involvement in Edinburgh's youth gang culture; underage drinking; and "disengagement from education"

I wonder if this is sufficient for a full formal enquiry. There seem to be quite a few others culpable here - who should also be properly punished. Rather too much 'passing on the other side'. Having been through the mill when I was young, I watched my own carefully. Not too many years back, a 'wonderful' Newbury Primary Teacher told my son 'Big boys don't cry'. This has to stop.

[Bloggo]

These tragic events are the direct result of a government that has lost control because of it's fear of upsetting the rest of the EU by abandoning the "human rights" culture that protects all but the innocent it would appear.
When will there be some justice established to protect the ordinary hard working people of this country?
What a gutless bunch we have as leaders.

[Andy1]

These tragic events are the direct result of a government that has lost control because of it's fear of upsetting the rest of the EU by abandoning the "human rights" culture that protects all but the innocent it would appear.
When will there be some justice established to protect the ordinary hard working people of this country?
What a gutless bunch we have as leaders.

That would be the gutless bunch we voted in.

[Roost]

"a chaotic, abusive and violent home background" characterised by parental neglect and the absence of appropriate guidelines; active involvement in Edinburgh's youth gang culture; underage drinking; and "disengagement from education"

I wonder if this is sufficient for a full formal enquiry. There seem to be quite a few others culpable here - who should also be properly punished. Rather too much 'passing on the other side'. Having been through the mill when I was young, I watched my own carefully. Not too many years back, a 'wonderful' Newbury Primary Teacher told my son 'Big boys don't cry'. This has to stop.

Yep. The blame culture. That's the answer.

[Guest_Bill1_*]

My lad is having trouble with a few boys pushing him over (cuts and bruises) at playtimes at present, he's only just turned 7!

The school is aware and are "keeping an eye on it".

They'd better do!

His Mum and I have stressed that he should not retaliate, but simply report any unseen incidents to a member of staff, he's such a friendly boy and doesn't understand why this is happening to him.

Nor do I.

Watch this space..........

[lordtup]

Now I am the last person on this planet to have sympathy for our political masters , who they may well have rubber stamped our social direction , but we are ultimately responsible for our actions and therefore we should be the ones to change it if we so wish .

It is to easy , as previously stated , to blame those who reside in the ivory castles of privilege land . We are well aware that they are out of touch with reality , we are equally aware that they are by and large pretty damned incompetent at their job , but we voted for them in a democratic format and will continue to do so because the alternative is a non starter .

This is a side issue to the main topic in that in order to stop this behaviour in it's tracks will require the people of this country to except a radical change of direction . This may well manifest itself by such things as troops on the street to combat hooliganism , enforced restrictions on bad parents and compulsory education to an agreed standard before leaving school .

This may well be seen as somewhat draconian ,but we have opened the Pandora's box of liberalism and in order to close it we may have to pay an unacceptable price .The weak , the innocent , the old and the young are entitled to protection from all ills , whether medical ,physical or social , and it's our collective responsibility to ensure this happens .

Law and order will feature prominently in the electoral hustings next year , just be wary of those who promise a change for they may have trouble in delivery .

[Iommi]

A problem we have, of course, is this Labour government has sent us to near bankruptcy (I'm not convinced we would be any better off with the other lot, by-the-way), again, so there is little money to sponsor any radical changes.

[Rachel]

My lad is having trouble with a few boys pushing him over (cuts and bruises) at playtimes at present, he's only just turned 7!

The school is aware and are "keeping an eye on it".

They'd better do!

His Mum and I have stressed that he should not retaliate, but simply report any unseen incidents to a member of staff, he's such a friendly boy and doesn't understand why this is happening to him.

Nor do I.

Watch this space..........

Have just read this thread & am waiting & hoping to hear good news from you soon. I know only too well how horrid this situation is....my son suffered months of verbal & physical bullying (I'm glad to say that with school, parent & child involvement, eventually, I think it's improved now) & if people say words can't hurt, they just don't know. My 9 year old has been forced to question his sexuality (the name calling consisted largely of the words "Gay" & "B****"), has suffered bruises, strangle marks & pinches. Even if he's not scarred physically, he has expressed a desire to die....pretty upsetting, isn't it?
I won't go into the ins & outs, but I urge you from experience. Make sure that this is not allowed to continue. If the habit is allowed to form in just 1 child, it will spread & other children will see it as acceptable behaviour. As a parent I have seen the damage that can be done to the individual, the self destruction it can cause in the bully & the disruption it can cause in a school. Bullying is harmful to everyone; the victim, the bully, the families, the school & the community. It seems impossible to understand...the systematic & targeted use of hurtful actions, directed at smart/artistic/tall/short/kind/sensitive/different/sporty/quiet/loud -whatever you can think of- children (for mostly there is no logic behind the choosing of the victim). Time is of the essence, nip this one in the bud, my friend. I wish you well & hope to hear happy news very soon.

[On the edge]

Yep. The blame culture. That's the answer.

This isn't about blame - more trying to stop this happening again. As this is not the first incident of this type and evidence suggests the situation is getting worse - in my mind at least, it signs up there is a massive problem with our social services and criminal justice processes. Simply coming up with tired old clichés whenever anyone suggests there is something wrong isn’t the answer either.

[Guest_Bill1_*]

Have just read this thread & am waiting & hoping to hear good news from you soon. I know only too well how horrid this situation is....my son suffered months of verbal & physical bullying (I'm glad to say that with school, parent & child involvement, eventually, I think it's improved now) & if people say words can't hurt, they just don't know. My 9 year old has been forced to question his sexuality (the name calling consisted largely of the words "Gay" & "B****"), has suffered bruises, strangle marks & pinches. Even if he's not scarred physically, he has expressed a desire to die....pretty upsetting, isn't it?
I won't go into the ins & outs, but I urge you from experience. Make sure that this is not allowed to continue. If the habit is allowed to form in just 1 child, it will spread & other children will see it as acceptable behaviour. As a parent I have seen the damage that can be done to the individual, the self destruction it can cause in the bully & the disruption it can cause in a school. Bullying is harmful to everyone; the victim, the bully, the families, the school & the community. It seems impossible to understand...the systematic & targeted use of hurtful actions, directed at smart/artistic/tall/short/kind/sensitive/different/sporty/quiet/loud -whatever you can think of- children (for mostly there is no logic behind the choosing of the victim). Time is of the essence, nip this one in the bud, my friend. I wish you well & hope to hear happy news very soon.

Thanks Rachel

I hope your lad is ok.

My boy was nervous of going into the playground on Wednesday, but I'd had a word with his teacer in the morning and she persuaded him to go out and promised to keep her eye on him.

Within minutes 5 of the little horrors were sneaking up on him and the teacher stopped them as they were about to carry out whatever nastiness they had in mind. She told them it was wrong and that she knew it had been going on for some time ( I didn't!). They were made to appologise to him and promise to pack it in, with the threat of their parents being told if they didn't.

Things were ok yesterday so hopefully that's the end of it, fingers crossed.

[Roost]

This isn't about blame - more trying to stop this happening again. As this is not the first incident of this type and evidence suggests the situation is getting worse - in my mind at least, it signs up there is a massive problem with our social services and criminal justice processes. Simply coming up with tired old clichés whenever anyone suggests there is something wrong isn’t the answer either.

You're absolutely right but it's far too easy for people to fall into the ideas of "We MUST have someone to blame" and it regularly seems to be the criminal justice system / social services etc when the only people who can truely be blamed are the individuals themselves.

Suggesting otherwise is just pandering to the ideal that the Labour government has engendered, that 'nanny' state is omnipotent and omniscient and it has allowed this blame culture to prolifigate.

As to the massive problems with social services and the criminal justice system, again I agree and would suggest that they fall within the following categories:-
1) Too many chiefs, not enough indians. They both have far too many 'middle' managers who know little or nothing about the job that their troops do on the front line but have too much say in how such jobs are meant to be done and where money is to be allocated.
2) Far too much paperwork / redtape / bureaucracy which restricts resources going to the areas that they actually need to go to.
3) Lack of local accountability. If both areas were subject to such they would perhaps begin dealing with the problems that affect the local areas and not pandering to what the government targets.
4) A bad press. Both suffer incredibly from a hugely bad press.

Just suggestions, mind you.

Anyway, how does something become a cliche in the first place?

[lordtup]

When this topic was initiated , it concerned a family that lived close to a large urban sprawl were this sort of insidious behavior seems rife .

Now we discover it in our own back yard and that tends to bring it home a little more sharply . Anyone who has experienced school bullying first hand will tell you that they want it to stop without the resorting to help from others ,this not only reinforces their low esteem brought about by not being able to stand up to the problem , but also draws attention to their impotence in front of their contemporaries . The fact that most parents are quite prepared to swing in order to protect their loved ones is scant consolation to the child that has to attend school day in day out .

I suppose the real problem is that class sizes are just to large for teachers to identify prospective trouble makers , resulting in the matter getting out of hand before something is done .

My heart goes out to parents who find themselves facing this evil ( because that's what it is ) and not being quite sure what to do . All I can say is go to the school , tell them your concerns , and demand they do something or you will have the police involved , which you are perfectly entitled to do bearing in mind that we are talking about physical abuse here which is illegal .

[On the edge]

You're absolutely right but it's far too easy for people to fall into the ideas of "We MUST have someone to blame" and it regularly seems to be the criminal justice system / social services etc when the only people who can truely be blamed are the individuals themselves.

Suggesting otherwise is just pandering to the ideal that the Labour government has engendered, that 'nanny' state is omnipotent and omniscient and it has allowed this blame culture to prolifigate.

As to the massive problems with social services and the criminal justice system, again I agree and would suggest that they fall within the following categories:-
1) Too many chiefs, not enough indians. They both have far too many 'middle' managers who know little or nothing about the job that their troops do on the front line but have too much say in how such jobs are meant to be done and where money is to be allocated.
2) Far too much paperwork / redtape / bureaucracy which restricts resources going to the areas that they actually need to go to.
3) Lack of local accountability. If both areas were subject to such they would perhaps begin dealing with the problems that affect the local areas and not pandering to what the government targets.
4) A bad press. Both suffer incredibly from a hugely bad press.

Just suggestions, mind you.

Anyway, how does something become a cliche in the first place?

Certainly subscribe to that diagnoisis. We have to get away from the centralisng tendancies of the last fifty years, which seems to have speeded up of late. Making individuals 'on the ground' responsible and accountable would be a massive way foward. With the money we'd save by cutting the bureacracy we whould be able to pay them properly as well. As to a bad press - the answer is probably in the question 'bad press' our media in UK isn't good generally, even our public service broadcaster is badly tarnished. Perhaps it is time for words like morals, probity, honour and responsibilty made a come back.