16.5% increase to WBC councillor basic allowance Options

[blackdog]

Not just WBC.....

South Oxfordshire....

Massive hike percentagewise - but they are still getting less than WBC councillors got before this month's pay rise!

[Exhausted]

Massive hike percentagewise - but they are still getting less than WBC councillors got before this month's pay rise!

One of the reasons why South Oxford felt it was Ok to give the increase to their councillors was because they actually reduced the number of councillors prior to a potential amalgamation with another council.

Bear in mind that we haven't reduced our potentially bloated council even though there has been pressure to reduce the number of council officers. As blackdog says, there is a fairly large discrepancy between the two district councillors allowances.

WBC was £6149 and increased to £7,324

S. Oxf was £2909 and increased to £4575.

There are special allowances for portfolio holders in both councils but the disparity remains.
Of course, the two councils are dissimilar in budget and size. I haven't checked how far.

[user23]

Don't forget, in South Oxfordshire you also have Oxfordshire County Councillors too.

[Exhausted]

Don't forget, in South Oxfordshire you also have Oxfordshire County Councillors too.

You might have to explain that one to me. How can they serve on two councils?

[On the edge]

Don't forget, in South Oxfordshire you also have Oxfordshire County Councillors too.

Umm a bit like us then, WBC pretending to be a County Council and Newbury Town pretending to be a Borough. All part of our 'let's pretend' democracy.

[user23]

Umm a bit like us then, WBC pretending to be a County Council and Newbury Town pretending to be a Borough. All part of our 'let's pretend' democracy.

Not really, because there's also another level in Oxfordshire, for example Didcot Town Council which is equivalent to Newbury Town Council.

[On the edge]

Not really, because there's also another level in Oxfordshire, for example Didcot Town Council which is equivalent to Newbury Town Council.

Ah, but that pretends to be a residents association. Remember, we still have a 'ceremonial' Royal County of Berkshire (bet that doesn't come gratis!) so it ain't dead yet.

Berkshire Authorities Joint Planning Strategic Unit not closed down yet by any chance?

[user23]

Ah, but that pretends to be a residents association. Remember, we still have a 'ceremonial' Royal County of Berkshire (bet that doesn't come gratis!) so it ain't dead yet.

Yes, and there's a Lord Lieutenant of Oxfordshire too, similar to that in Berkshire.

There are no Berkshire County councillors similar to Oxfordshire though.

West Berkshire councillors perform the roles of both the separate District and County that they have north of the border.

Any comparison with a District, needs to consider the County too.

[On the edge]

Yes, and there's a Lord Lieutenant of Oxfordshire too, similar to that in Berkshire.

There are no Berkshire County councillors similar to Oxfordshire though.

West Berkshire councillors perform the roles of both the separate District and County that they have north of the border.

Any comparison with a District, needs to consider the County too.

If only they did! That's just the point, the former County functions are either still there as a joint operation (such as the Strategic Planning Unit) acting as a local quango, or dispensed stand alone agencies like the Fire and Rescue service. As for schools, most are now self managed.
Arguably, much the same has happened at the other levels - most of the functions hived off. So in effect, we are paying far more to Councillors who are doing far less.

[user23]

If only they did! That's just the point, the former County functions are either still there as a joint operation (such as the Strategic Planning Unit) acting as a local quango, or dispensed stand alone agencies like the Fire and Rescue service. As for schools, most are now self managed.
Arguably, much the same has happened at the other levels - most of the functions hived off. So in effect, we are paying far more to Councillors who are doing far less.

Great example. Most planning decisions in South Oxfordshire are made by South Oxfordshire District councillors, decisions on schools by Oxfordshire County councillors.

In West Berkshire, West Berkshire councillors do both. You can read more about how this works here.

Most schools in West Berkshire (around 90%) are still run by the council, by the way. Looking on the council website, the blue ones are academies.

[blackdog]

Great example. Most planning decisions in South Oxfordshire are made by South Oxfordshire District councillors, decisions on schools by Oxfordshire County councillors.

In West Berkshire, West Berkshire councillors do both. You can read more about how this works here.

Most schools in West Berkshire (around 90%) are still run by the council, by the way. Looking on the council website, the blue ones are academies.

In West Berkshire most planning decisions are made by council officers, most strategic decisions are rubber stamped by executive members - the majority of councillors have no more to do than a South Oxon councillor.

[Sherlock]

Well the good news is that, when (as per WBC's draft strategic plan) many services are handed over to volunteers/community organisations, outsourced to Capita and the like or to not-for-profits (like BBOWT managing Greenham Common), or simply cut. there just won't be the need for so many councillors. The government will also strongly encourage more schools to become academies (or, as of today's announcement, force them to do so in the case of failing schools), further reducing the load on our hard working representatives.

We can be confident that when WBC announces its new strategic plan it will include a large reduction in the number of councillors which will offset this huge increase in allowances. An administration whose overriding aims are to slash costs, reduce the role of the state, and to hollow-out local government, could hardly do otherwise.

[Exhausted]

I suspect the number of councillors is made up according to householders and perhaps area however,

Newbury has 14 councillors
Thatcham 8
Hungerford and Kintbury 4
Theale,Calcot, Burghfield and Sulhampstead 7
Birch Copse 3
Then, Lambourn Mortimer, Purley on Thames and Bucklebury have 2 each
Pangbourne, Aldermaston, Basildon, Chieveley, Downlands, Compton, Cold Ash and Westwood have 1 each.

Can you see any savings.

[On the edge]

I suspect the number of councillors is made up according to householders and perhaps area however,

Newbury has 14 councillors
Thatcham 8
Hungerford and Kintbury 4
Theale,Calcot, Burghfield and Sulhampstead 7
Birch Copse 3
Then, Lambourn Mortimer, Purley on Thames and Bucklebury have 2 each
Pangbourne, Aldermaston, Basildon, Chieveley, Downlands, Compton, Cold Ash and Westwood have 1 each.

Can you see any savings.

Yes, easily, simply have bigger constituencies.

The 'portfolio' system means that geographic considerations aren't taken into account anyway.

[MontyPython]

...
We can be confident that when WBC announces its new strategic plan it will include a large reduction in the number of councillors which will offset this huge increase in allowances. An administration whose overriding aims are to slash costs, reduce the role of the state, and to hollow-out local government, could hardly do otherwise.

......and hopefully a reduction in the management layer in Market Street.

[blackdog]

Increase the size of the wards to reduce the number of councillors to about 25. Select the executive and shadow executive from this plus chairs of main committees (finance, planning & scrutiny). Introduce a District Assembly made up of the district councillors plus one representative from each parish council (unpaid) to vote on the budget and major policy changes - meets quarterly. Parish council representatives can be co-opted sit on committees if necessary.

[Exhausted]

Yes, easily, simply have bigger constituencies.

Why I lumped together Newbury and the same for Thatcham. Then the Theale Calcot lot. Interesting that the western villages of Kintbury and Hungerford have 4 councillors.

Poor old Pangbourne Pam serves on her own. Shame.

[Simon Kirby]

Increase the size of the wards to reduce the number of councillors to about 25. Select the executive and shadow executive from this plus chairs of main committees (finance, planning & scrutiny). Introduce a District Assembly made up of the district councillors plus one representative from each parish council (unpaid) to vote on the budget and major policy changes - meets quarterly. Parish council representatives can be co-opted sit on committees if necessary.

Interesting idea.

[Simon Kirby]

An administration whose overriding aims are to slash costs, reduce the role of the state, and to hollow-out local government...

I dream of the day.

[Simon Kirby]

Can you see any savings.

There's practically no sense at all in having any democratic involvement in the majority of services delivered by WBC. Can you think of a single service which benefits from councillor involvement and which couldn't more effectively be delivered by a national executive agency?

Planning for example. Deciding whether any given application meets the required criteria is simply a technical assessment against objective standards and the decision should be made by professionals. There is obviously a need for local input into those objective standards, but I'd argue that this is the role of the parish council who should be writing the design standards in close consultation with their parishioners.

Strategic and town planning might well be a job for WBC, but again that's a technical job that can only be done by professionals, and again this would need to be informed by the parish design standards.

I can't think of much else that WBC does that benefits from any kind of input from councillors.