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> Royal Mail - time for a re think!
On the edge
post Aug 21 2011, 07:47 AM
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Yesterday mid morning (during the restricted hours) I saw a mail van edge its way through the many pedestrians down Northbrook Street and carefully wind its way through the crowd on the bridge. It stopped by the town hall and the driver got out and emptied the mail box. It then drove on to the sorting office.

Yes, I accept it might have been part of a longer round - but the fact remains that this was an unnecessary trip. No commercial organisation is able to do anything like this at this time of day. Equally, given the proximity of the sorting office, it would have been far quicker to walk.

The mail people seemed to have gulled our Councillors into thinking there is something really special about them making them exempt from normal regulations.

Quite apart from the obvious safety considerations, this is hardly sustainable - using a heavy van to empty town centre boxes. Equally, in process terms, its not exactly commercially viable.

Little wonder the mail service in UK is in such a mess when they consider this acceptable


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Biker1
post Aug 21 2011, 08:16 AM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 21 2011, 08:47 AM) *
Yesterday mid morning (during the restricted hours) I saw a mail van edge its way through the many pedestrians down Northbrook Street and carefully wind its way through the crowd on the bridge. It stopped by the town hall and the driver got out and emptied the mail box. It then drove on to the sorting office.

Yes, I accept it might have been part of a longer round - but the fact remains that this was an unnecessary trip. No commercial organisation is able to do anything like this at this time of day. Equally, given the proximity of the sorting office, it would have been far quicker to walk.

The mail people seemed to have gulled our Councillors into thinking there is something really special about them making them exempt from normal regulations.

Quite apart from the obvious safety considerations, this is hardly sustainable - using a heavy van to empty town centre boxes. Equally, in process terms, its not exactly commercially viable.

Little wonder the mail service in UK is in such a mess when they consider this acceptable

I see all sorts of commercial vans in the "pedestrian area" during restricted hours.
They just seem to ignore the bollards by West Street.
I think entry bollards are needed here also to make it impossible for entry by going round the traffic island.
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Andy Capp
post Aug 21 2011, 09:00 AM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 21 2011, 08:47 AM) *
Yesterday mid morning (during the restricted hours) I saw a mail van edge its way through the many pedestrians down Northbrook Street and carefully wind its way through the crowd on the bridge. It stopped by the town hall and the driver got out and emptied the mail box. It then drove on to the sorting office.

Yes, I accept it might have been part of a longer round - but the fact remains that this was an unnecessary trip. No commercial organisation is able to do anything like this at this time of day. Equally, given the proximity of the sorting office, it would have been far quicker to walk.

The mail people seemed to have gulled our Councillors into thinking there is something really special about them making them exempt from normal regulations.

Quite apart from the obvious safety considerations, this is hardly sustainable - using a heavy van to empty town centre boxes. Equally, in process terms, its not exactly commercially viable.

Little wonder the mail service in UK is in such a mess when they consider this acceptable

I think you are making assumptions and contriving to make a complaint.
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user23
post Aug 21 2011, 09:47 AM
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QUOTE (Biker1 @ Aug 21 2011, 09:16 AM) *
I see all sorts of commercial vans in the "pedestrian area" during restricted hours.
They just seem to ignore the bollards by West Street.
I think entry bollards are needed here also to make it impossible for entry by going round the traffic island.
I've seen cars do this on more than one occasion, perhaps you're right.
QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Aug 21 2011, 10:00 AM) *
I think you are making assumptions and contriving to make a complaint.
Me too, and the suggestion that the van should be dropped off at the depot and the round then continued on foot when the van was probably driven past the postbox on it's way to the depot seems a bit strange.
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dannyboy
post Aug 21 2011, 09:58 AM
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Little wonder the mail service in UK is in such a mess when they consider this acceptable


When RM is flogged off to TNT/DHL and a first class letter costs a couple of quid to send, you'll be harking back to the 'good old days' of the Royal Mail & postie.
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JeffG
post Aug 21 2011, 10:26 AM
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QUOTE (Biker1 @ Aug 21 2011, 09:16 AM) *
They just seem to ignore the bollards by West Street.

There are none at the moment, in case you haven't noticed. smile.gif

That bit is encased in boarded-up road works and all traffic has to go through the open bit, controlled by lights, so no physical indication that entry is restricted.
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dannyboy
post Aug 21 2011, 10:29 AM
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QUOTE (JeffG @ Aug 21 2011, 11:26 AM) *
There are none at the moment, in case you haven't noticed. smile.gif

That bit is encased in boarded-up road works and all traffic has to go through the open bit, controlled by lights, so no physical indication that entry is restricted.

Car drivers seem to get upset why you don't move out of the way for them.
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On the edge
post Aug 21 2011, 02:54 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Aug 21 2011, 10:00 AM) *
I think you are making assumptions and contriving to make a complaint.


And you've done exactly the same! The facts are I am not permitted to do what the mail service does for my several customers in the town centre. Yes I have made a formal request. Our business actually makes a profit but then we do look very closely at process - time is money. So, then; Fact - mail service are given special treatment, Fact - mail service operates at a substantial loss, Fact - along with many other businesses, we can still manage to service customers during the restricted hours, Fact - we make a profit. Sorry - who ever made the decision to permit mail vans was gulled.


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On the edge
post Aug 21 2011, 02:57 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Aug 21 2011, 10:47 AM) *
I've seen cars do this on more than one occasion, perhaps you're right.
Me too, and the suggestion that the van should be dropped off at the depot and the round then continued on foot when the van was probably driven past the postbox on it's way to the depot seems a bit strange.


Strange to those who don't have to think about cost and effect yes. This is a classic case of a monopoly service ignoring the rules. Why? WBC rightly stop commercial traffic what are they so scared of when it comes to the mail service?


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On the edge
post Aug 21 2011, 03:01 PM
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QUOTE (dannyboy @ Aug 21 2011, 10:58 AM) *
Little wonder the mail service in UK is in such a mess when they consider this acceptable


When RM is flogged off to TNT/DHL and a first class letter costs a couple of quid to send, you'll be harking back to the 'good old days' of the Royal Mail & postie.


Well I won't for one - BUT only if its done properly. Vis don't copy railways. By the way, I'm one of those dratted modernists who can't see anything wrong with a daily delivery - at any time. Not trying to keep to the Victorian tradition of ensuring you can read your latest electricity bill with your breakfast egg.


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Biker1
post Aug 21 2011, 06:17 PM
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QUOTE (JeffG @ Aug 21 2011, 11:26 AM) *
There are none at the moment, in case you haven't noticed. smile.gif

That bit is encased in boarded-up road works and all traffic has to go through the open bit, controlled by lights, so no physical indication that entry is restricted.

OK, But they still do it when the bollards are working.
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Andy Capp
post Aug 21 2011, 06:21 PM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 21 2011, 03:54 PM) *
And you've done exactly the same! The facts are I am not permitted to do what the mail service does for my several customers in the town centre. Yes I have made a formal request. Our business actually makes a profit but then we do look very closely at process - time is money. So, then; Fact - mail service are given special treatment, Fact - mail service operates at a substantial loss, Fact - along with many other businesses, we can still manage to service customers during the restricted hours, Fact - we make a profit. Sorry - who ever made the decision to permit mail vans was gulled.

The RM makes a loss for political reasons. It need not but it is ham strung. Just like the rape of its profits in the past by governments that prevented the RM from investing in its future. Personally I cannot see the problem with a public entity being permitted a delivery in the pedestrian zone.

I have to say: so what?
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On the edge
post Aug 21 2011, 07:03 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Aug 21 2011, 07:21 PM) *
The RM makes a loss for political reasons. It need not but it is ham strung. Just like the rape of its profits in the past by governments that prevented the RM from investing in its future. Personally I cannot see the problem with a public entity being permitted a delivery in the pedestrian zone.

I have to say: so what?


So in effect you are saying the present prices are far too low and past lack of investment has caused the problem. You've just made the case for privatisation and justified the price increase some people are worried about. That's something we can agree on then. You can't see a problem with a public entity being permitted to break the rules? Oh dear!


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Darren
post Aug 21 2011, 07:08 PM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 21 2011, 08:03 PM) *
You can't see a problem with a public entity being permitted to break the rules? Oh dear!


Same argument could be used for emergency services.

They're not breaking the rules as the rules include them.
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Andy Capp
post Aug 21 2011, 07:12 PM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 21 2011, 08:03 PM) *
So in effect you are saying the present prices are far too low and past lack of investment has caused the problem.

No. In the past the RM made a fortune, but governments fleeced the RM and didn't use it to modernise.

QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 21 2011, 08:03 PM) *
You've just made the case for privatisation and justified the price increase some people are worried about.

If the RM have to tramps about a pedestrian zone because of people moaning about them driving, perhaps a price rise might be inevitable?

QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 21 2011, 08:03 PM) *
That's something we can agree on then. You can't see a problem with a public entity being permitted to break the rules? Oh dear!

Are they 'breaking the rules'?
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On the edge
post Aug 21 2011, 07:27 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Aug 21 2011, 08:12 PM) *
No. In the past the RM made a fortune, but governments fleeced the RM and didn't use it to modernise.


If the RM have to tramps about a pedestrian zone because of people moaning about them driving, perhaps a prise rise might be inevitable?



Are they 'breaking the rules'?


Haven't you noticed they actually deliver mail round the town in a handcart every day?

As I mentioned, our firm and several others manage to service our customers in the town centre without upping prices. We practice an art called commercial management.

Again, no other commercial organisation can do this so even though they have an exemption are still technically breaking the rules. Same as if a Police car decides to jump the lights. Legally known as an indulgence.

Where do you draw the line? So take my first observation; getting an exemption and using vans to empty is sticking two fingers up!


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user23
post Aug 21 2011, 07:44 PM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 21 2011, 03:57 PM) *
Strange to those who don't have to think about cost and effect yes. This is a classic case of a monopoly service ignoring the rules. Why? WBC rightly stop commercial traffic what are they so scared of when it comes to the mail service?
They let other commercial traffic such as Group 4 through too.
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On the edge
post Aug 21 2011, 07:51 PM
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QUOTE (user23 @ Aug 21 2011, 08:44 PM) *
They let other commercial traffic such as Group 4 through too.


Incredible! I'll get my firm to try again then; thanks for letting me know.


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Berkshirelad
post Aug 21 2011, 08:41 PM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 21 2011, 08:47 AM) *
Yesterday mid morning (during the restricted hours) I saw a mail van edge its way through the many pedestrians down Northbrook Street and carefully wind its way through the crowd on the bridge. It stopped by the town hall and the driver got out and emptied the mail box. It then drove on to the sorting office.

Yes, I accept it might have been part of a longer round - but the fact remains that this was an unnecessary trip. No commercial organisation is able to do anything like this at this time of day. Equally, given the proximity of the sorting office, it would have been far quicker to walk.

The mail people seemed to have gulled our Councillors into thinking there is something really special about them making them exempt from normal regulations.

Quite apart from the obvious safety considerations, this is hardly sustainable - using a heavy van to empty town centre boxes. Equally, in process terms, its not exactly commercially viable.

Little wonder the mail service in UK is in such a mess when they consider this acceptable



The Royal Mail are permitted vehicles. It takes more than a traffic order - Her Majesty's mail has priority.
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Berkshirelad
post Aug 21 2011, 08:44 PM
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QUOTE (On the edge @ Aug 21 2011, 08:27 PM) *
Again, no other commercial organisation can do this so even though they have an exemption are still technically breaking the rules. Same as if a Police car decides to jump the lights. Legally known as an indulgence.


Emergency service vehicles usually have a specific exemption built in to traffic regulation orders ( ie the order does not apply to them). So they are not breaking the rules, technically or otherwise.

Have a look next time one is published in the NWN
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