Calls to reduce the A34 to a 50mph limit, Yet more namby pamby nonsense Options

[NWNREADER]

So how can a speed limit be proposed as supporting the reduction in incidence?

Being a serious issue - which I happen to have some knowledge of - I realise bandwagons and jerked knees have no place in the debate

[Adrian Hollister]

If you've read my blog, I've been on this issue for a long time. If your aware of the issue you know that there is a standard pattern, usually involving slow traffic, panic breaking from high speed and the ripple effect back around the bends. No rocket science here, just common sense.

As demonstrated earlier speed is a key factor in accidents and a reduction in speed dramatically reduces the accident rates and severity of the accidents.

Simple key points here are:

-HA know this is a speed differential issue and put a unenforced time trial in place
-Reducing speed, reduces both the accident rates and the severity of the accidents (see previous links)
-An enforced dynamic variable speed limit to average the traffic speeds could solve the problem (though a blanket 50mph will be a lot cheaper)

Blindly suggesting speed is not an issue is just not true. Deny the truth as much as you like, it's still the truth.

[Penelope]

"Blindly suggesting speed is the only issue is just not true. Deny the truth as much as you like, it's still the truth."

[Adrian Hollister]

"Blindly suggesting speed is the only issue is just not true. Deny the truth as much as you like, it's still the truth."

Penny dropping for Penelope? or is your world still flat?

[Berkshirelad]

If you've read my blog, I've been on this issue for a long time. If your aware of the issue you know that there is a standard pattern, usually involving slow traffic, panic breaking from high speed and the ripple effect back around the bends. No rocket science here, just common sense.

What's breaking?? Or do you mean braking (as in applying of brakes)?

Blindly suggesting speed is not an issue is just not true. Deny the truth as much as you like, it's still the truth.

So in your perfect world, reduction of the speed limit to, say, 4 mph would prevent all road fatalities (we could reduce unemployment overnight too by requiring a man with a red flag to walk in front of every vehicle)

Speed alone is very rarely the primary cause of accidents.

[Berkshirelad]

If you've read my blog, I've been on this issue for a long time. If your aware of the issue you know that there is a standard pattern, usually involving slow traffic, panic breaking from high speed and the ripple effect back around the bends. No rocket science here, just common sense.

What's breaking?? Or do you mean braking (as in applying of brakes)?

Blindly suggesting speed is not an issue is just not true. Deny the truth as much as you like, it's still the truth.

So in your perfect world, reduction of the speed limit to, say, 4 mph would prevent all road fatalities (we could reduce unemployment overnight too by requiring a man with a red flag to walk in front of every vehicle)

Speed alone is very rarely the primary cause of accidents.

[Berkshirelad]

If you've read my blog, I've been on this issue for a long time. If your aware of the issue you know that there is a standard pattern, usually involving slow traffic, panic breaking from high speed and the ripple effect back around the bends. No rocket science here, just common sense.

What's breaking?? Or do you mean braking (as in applying of brakes)?

Blindly suggesting speed is not an issue is just not true. Deny the truth as much as you like, it's still the truth.

So in your perfect world, reduction of the speed limit to, say, 4 mph would prevent all road fatalities (we could reduce unemployment overnight too by requiring a man with a red flag to walk in front of every vehicle)

Speed alone is very rarely the primary cause of accidents.

[Adrian Hollister]

Ignore typo/autocorrect.

So in your perfect world, reduction of the speed limit to, say, 4 mph would prevent all road fatalities (we could reduce unemployment overnight too by requiring a man with a red flag to walk in front of every vehicle)

See previous links to published works on speed issue.

Speed alone is very rarely the primary cause of accidents.

Agree totally. Here it's big hills with slow traffic, winding bends, not the best road surface or markings etc... all of which can be mitigated by the variable speed limit.

[user23]

...and I don't see a mention of the cause do you?

Then why do you seem to be attributing the cause of the accident to the speed the vehicles were traveling?

[Adrian Hollister]

Then why do you seem to be attributing the cause of the accident to the speed the vehicles were traveling?

You were referring to the statement as follows:

"So if professional drivers like these pair of lorry drivers get caught out, is there a chance that the perfect driving skills of those self proclaimed better than average drivers on the forum could also be tested by this stretch of road?"

I'm missing the association to speed here?

[NWNREADER]

You were referring to the statement as follows:

"So if professional drivers like these pair of lorry drivers get caught out, is there a chance that the perfect driving skills of those self proclaimed better than average drivers on the forum could also be tested by this stretch of road?"

I'm missing the association to speed here?

No, you are blindly creating it.

Injuries are not caused by speed, they are caused by deceleration forces. An impact speed of 30mph can be fatal, lower when the victim is 'unlucky'. A friend of mine died at an impact of 10mph, and the people run over by buses in town centres are often involved in impacts of around 4mph.
Plus, speed limits are mostly observed and appropriate speeds within those limits are mostly managed by road users. Too often crashes involve a driver/rider having no regard for the environment they are travelling in; the speed limit is not relevant to their conduct.

[Adrian Hollister]

Injuries are not caused by speed, they are caused by deceleration forces. An impact speed of 30mph can be fatal, lower when the victim is 'unlucky'. A friend of mine died at an impact of 10mph, and the people run over by buses in town centres are often involved in impacts of around 4mph.

...and now we talk about injuries? I wasn't talking about that either

Is it that you don't think there are accidents on the A34 around Ilsley?

Too often crashes involve a driver/rider having no regard for the environment they are travelling in

Good to see you agree with me.

the speed limit is not relevant to their conduct.

We've done this one already here before, but lets just go through that logic...

Lorry at 30mph up hill is caught up by car at 80mph, with a 50mph closing speed. If the closing speed was less, they would have more time to react to the problem, and the people around them would have enough time to react as well.

So for those that can see around bends and through the hills they would know there is a problem and slow down. For those that don't have that ability we could use variable speed signs to make people aware of the problem.

[NWNREADER]

Why would a driver ignoring a 70 limit obey a 50 one?

Note the speed of the car and the limit……

The people you seek to target too often are not the ones who pay the attention you surmise

[Penelope]

By your logic a broken down lorry travelling at 0 mph and a car travelling at the new AH approved speed of 50mph would still cause an accident ? No, don't see it somehow.

[Adrian Hollister]

Why would a driver ignoring a 70 limit obey a 50 one?

The people you seek to target too often are not the ones who pay the attention you surmise

Agreed, that's why it needs to be a controlled zone.

[Adrian Hollister]

By your logic a broken down lorry travelling at 0 mph and a car travelling at the new AH approved speed of 50mph would still cause an accident ? No, don't see it somehow.

I think I've asked this before, but what's your idea here?

[NWNREADER]

Agreed, that's why it needs to be a controlled zone.

Now you have lost me. What control method do you have in mind?

[Adrian Hollister]

Now you have lost me. What control method do you have in mind?

Average speed was mentioned before. Open to other opinions though.

[NWNREADER]

Average speed was mentioned before. Open to other opinions though.

How does that 'control'?

[blackdog]

Speed alone is very rarely the primary cause of accidents.

Bad driving is the cause of most accidents, but speed is a significant factor in all motor accidents.

Obviously there are very few accidents between stationary vehicles.

The higher the speed the less opportunity there is for the driver(s) involved to avoid the accident.

The higher the speed to more damage is done - to vehicles and to people.

If there is a portion of road where there are a lot of accidents then slowing traffic down is a cheap alternative to major road enhancements and would mitigate against accidents.

The A34 needs another lane from the M3 to the M40 - a hard shoulder and much better slip roads would also be good news. Until the M34 arrives a 50mph limit around the Ilsleys does't seem too bad an idea.