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River Lambourn, trespassing on private property |
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Aug 2 2013, 03:01 PM
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QUOTE (motormad @ Aug 2 2013, 03:58 PM) The kid's 12. Give him a break.
Tresspass is technically a civil matter and as long as they do not damage anything and, once asked to leave, do - they are not breaking any laws. Infact you have "intended right of passage" when you have anything like a path - it doesn't matter if it's near a bridge or anything.
I can understand your peril but if people want to sit there and fish why not talk to them and maybe offer them a cup of tea. Maybe they will give you a fish.
You know what they say.
If you give a man a fish he will eat for a day. If you give a fish a man he will eat for the rest of his life. You are kidding right?
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Aug 2 2013, 03:33 PM
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motormad
i) first, the kid, 12 or otherwise, is not the only person who trespasses in our garden to fish illegally, which by the way is private property; ii) there is no 'intended right of passage' because there is no path or indeed anything else that could pass for a right of way, the only access to our garden for those who do not live here is to climb over the bridge or break through a locked garden gate; iii) children and indeed anyone else should respect other people's property and not trespass on it; iv) if you have a garden and you wish to let people wander into it and use it as their own while you have a chat with them you are welcome to do so; v) there are no free fishing rights on this part of the river (in fact the rights belong to others and not to us); vi) you do not appear to know the law relating to trespass: It is against the law to trespass on any land (and inland that includes land covered by water such as rivers or lakes) or in any building. Ignorance of that fact is no defence under this law. The word trespass covers much more than people usually realise. All land in this country belongs to someone. If you go on to land without the owner's permission, you are trespassing unless there is some right of access for the public, or for you specifically (for example if you have acquired a right to pass over the land to reach some land of your own). The fact that there is no fence or no sign saying that the land is private does not mean that people can go there. Wandering on to farmers' fields or other places which are obviously private is clearly trespassing, but so is wandering over land which may not be so clearly private, if the public has no right of access.
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Aug 3 2013, 07:38 AM
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Nothing much - I'm not sure where you're streetmapping but I can assure you there is no inviting path, public or private, here. The only way you can gain access to our garden other than through the house is to climb over the bridge, landing in the river and climbing the garden wall, or across part of another neighbour's garden, or to break through a padlocked garden side gate. Not that any of these obstacles prevented the lead thieves last year stripping both ours and our neighbour's roofs and windows.
We have a very small garden, the width from the house to the river is only about 25 feet, so there is no way we could put up high security fencing even if we wanted to without completely destroying the whole point of having a riverside garden and would feel like a prison.
The 12 year old yesterday was just one example, there have been much older and much larger adolescents and young men who have trespassed and who even if they were the biggest dimwit in the world could not fail to see they were in someone's garden. There is what we laughingly call a lawn, patio, garden furniture, potted plants, etc., it is clearly a private garden.
We are not interested in suing anyone or having someone arrested we just want them to stay out of our garden. It is very intimidating to suddenly find a stranger standing just feet away from your back door.
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Aug 3 2013, 10:26 AM
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QUOTE (Nothing Much @ Aug 3 2013, 11:18 AM) Oh well Jay Sands. I enjoyed my little ramble around Shaw. The spot I concentrated on was on the opposite side of the river to a Mill House and nearby was a **** Tavern. Nice little river. I tried to work out the age and architectural style of the building.
It does seem as if you have more than a case of mistaken entry, losing the lead sounds pretty catastrophic ,with the weather 'n all. Simon Kirby is right in saying that the police or local community should be told of the problem. Maybe the fishing rights administrators. A flock of angry geese would do the trick, bit messy though. No toilet training, like the 12 year old!.
Streetview is good fun and I hope you don't think I was prying. I am featured entering my front door as the camera car went east to west but I have disappeared on a return drive by. I am pleased to say I have lost a little weight since the photo was taken! ce. "...I hope you don't think I was prying" - not at all, I often look at the 'birds eye view' on Bing maps, the only thing about them is you don't know how old the images are. I remember reading somewhere that the Google map satellite views were often over a year old so if anything's changed in that time it won't show up.
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Aug 3 2013, 01:46 PM
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QUOTE (Jay Sands @ Aug 3 2013, 11:26 AM) ...... not at all, I often look at the 'birds eye view' on Bing maps, the only thing about them is you don't know how old the images are. I remember reading somewhere that the Google map satellite views were often over a year old so if anything's changed in that time it won't show up. I think you will find that some of the views, particularly in the smaller towns (like Newbury) can be two or three years out of date.
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Aug 3 2013, 04:35 PM
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QUOTE (Exhausted @ Aug 3 2013, 02:46 PM) I think you will find that some of the views, particularly in the smaller towns (like Newbury) can be two or three years out of date. Are you saying that the views of Newbrarians are behind the times? A mans ( womans ) home is his ( her ) Castle!
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Aug 5 2013, 04:00 PM
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QUOTE (Jay Sands @ Aug 2 2013, 04:33 PM) motormad
i) first, the kid, 12 or otherwise, is not the only person who trespasses in our garden to fish illegally, which by the way is private property; ii) there is no 'intended right of passage' because there is no path or indeed anything else that could pass for a right of way, the only access to our garden for those who do not live here is to climb over the bridge or break through a locked garden gate; iii) children and indeed anyone else should respect other people's property and not trespass on it; iv) if you have a garden and you wish to let people wander into it and use it as their own while you have a chat with them you are welcome to do so; v) there are no free fishing rights on this part of the river (in fact the rights belong to others and not to us); vi) you do not appear to know the law relating to trespass: It is against the law to trespass on any land (and inland that includes land covered by water such as rivers or lakes) or in any building. Ignorance of that fact is no defence under this law. The word trespass covers much more than people usually realise. All land in this country belongs to someone. If you go on to land without the owner's permission, you are trespassing unless there is some right of access for the public, or for you specifically (for example if you have acquired a right to pass over the land to reach some land of your own). The fact that there is no fence or no sign saying that the land is private does not mean that people can go there. Wandering on to farmers' fields or other places which are obviously private is clearly trespassing, but so is wandering over land which may not be so clearly private, if the public has no right of access. Hi Jay Sahara. The 12 year old was the only one mentioned. Climbing over the bridge sounds a bit risky but I am not sure on the legality. Perhaps a crime of death by dangerous climbing could be applied. Imagine that on the 11 o clock news. I mean, after all, it all boils down to this one question. Who does own all of the swans in England? I don't think it's the Queen. Or what about the Gobi? Luckily, I do not choose to live next to a river as I get sea-sick. Although I wonder if you were sick on a river, it would be called "river-sick". It's not a phrase I've heard before. My garden is surrounded by high fences and I have a gate which is surrounded by walls (which often close in if you stand there long enough). I am into my URBEX (google it) and know plenty about the rules of tresspass. As most of the sites I go to are marked as "private" or belong to government agencies who have long since forgotten about them. The most they can do, if you do not break or steal anything, is ask you to leave. If you do not leave by the most direct safe route then things change. Infact at a site three weeks ago, I offered a bottle of Liptons Ice-Tea to a security guard in exchange for him to "investigate that noise over there" (conveniently in the opposite end of the building that I was in) to leave me to explore and investigate the pass. Tresspass is a civil issue - hence why police are never involved and if they are, they will tell you do do one. Rather than angrily type on a web-forum full of middle aged people (I've met most of them I'm allowed to say ) why don't you do something about it? Push them in the river, see where that gets you. That would be intended right to manslaughter I regularly have tea-parties for stranges. Infact it was only the other day that I invited Leonardo the Turtle, to dinner and we sat down with Steven the Hedgehog as well, we shared tea and talked about the war. Thank you Mr Atacama
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:p Grammar: the difference between knowing your poop and knowing you're poop.
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Aug 5 2013, 08:59 PM
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QUOTE (motormad @ Aug 5 2013, 05:00 PM) Hi Jay Sahara. The 12 year old was the only one mentioned. Climbing over the bridge sounds a bit risky but I am not sure on the legality. Perhaps a crime of death by dangerous climbing could be applied. Imagine that on the 11 o clock news. I mean, after all, it all boils down to this one question. Who does own all of the swans in England? I don't think it's the Queen. Or what about the Gobi? Luckily, I do not choose to live next to a river as I get sea-sick. Although I wonder if you were sick on a river, it would be called "river-sick". It's not a phrase I've heard before. My garden is surrounded by high fences and I have a gate which is surrounded by walls (which often close in if you stand there long enough). I am into my URBEX (google it) and know plenty about the rules of tresspass. As most of the sites I go to are marked as "private" or belong to government agencies who have long since forgotten about them. The most they can do, if you do not break or steal anything, is ask you to leave. If you do not leave by the most direct safe route then things change. Infact at a site three weeks ago, I offered a bottle of Liptons Ice-Tea to a security guard in exchange for him to "investigate that noise over there" (conveniently in the opposite end of the building that I was in) to leave me to explore and investigate the pass. Tresspass is a civil issue - hence why police are never involved and if they are, they will tell you do do one. Rather than angrily type on a web-forum full of middle aged people (I've met most of them I'm allowed to say ) why don't you do something about it? Push them in the river, see where that gets you. That would be intended right to manslaughter I regularly have tea-parties for stranges. Infact it was only the other day that I invited Leonardo the Turtle, to dinner and we sat down with Steven the Hedgehog as well, we shared tea and talked about the war. Thank you Mr Atacama How clever. Ouch, there goes another rib.
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There their, loose loser!
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Aug 6 2013, 07:48 AM
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QUOTE (motormad @ Aug 5 2013, 05:00 PM) "Tresspass (sic) is a civil issue - hence why police are never involved and if they are, they will tell you do do one." Not always, it depends on the location and intent. Trespass can be criminal.
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Aug 6 2013, 08:26 AM
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QUOTE (motormad @ Aug 2 2013, 03:58 PM) Tresspass is technically a civil matter and as long as they do not damage anything and, once asked to leave, do - they are not breaking any laws. QUOTE (motormad @ Aug 2 2013, 03:58 PM) Tresspass is a civil issue - hence why police are never involved and if they are, they will tell you do do one Unless it is on the railway! Link.
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