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> Halal, why should we put up with this?, If fox hunting with dogs is outlawed, why not Halal?
je suis Charlie
post Feb 21 2018, 09:21 AM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Feb 21 2018, 09:14 AM) *
Nah, I was watching an interesting documentary on an investigation into the possible reasons one of your Fatherland’s most infamous airships exploded.

Didn't know Wales built airships, but then AC, always the fantacist aren't you.
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je suis Charlie
post Feb 21 2018, 09:23 AM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Feb 21 2018, 09:11 AM) *
I’d have expected an IT specialst to understand the potential for misleading information on the Internet.

There's non so blind, as an out and out fantacist! laugh.gif
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Andy Capp
post Feb 21 2018, 09:47 AM
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QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 21 2018, 09:23 AM) *
There's non so blind, as an out and out fantacist! laugh.gif

A rare moment of agreement.
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Berkshirelad
post Feb 21 2018, 04:17 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Feb 21 2018, 09:14 AM) *
Nah, I was watching an interesting documentary on an investigation into the possible reasons one of your Fatherland’s most infamous airships exploded.


The Aluminium Oxide coating wasn't it, rather than Hydrogen.

Contemporary pictures show it with burning flames and Hydrogen does not produce visible flames
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Berkshirelad
post Feb 21 2018, 04:18 PM
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QUOTE (je suis Charlie @ Feb 21 2018, 09:21 AM) *
Didn't know Wales built airships, but then AC, always the fantacist aren't you.


Plenty of windbags but not airships biggrin.gif
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x2lls
post Feb 21 2018, 06:30 PM
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The fight against non stun is growing. This time, those that supply are getting on board. I would have no problem with donating via crowd funding to compensate the loss of business, if any.
I firmly believe the British public would support them wholesale(!).

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/halal-an...rmers-3hrjrkt36


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TallDarkAndHands...
post Feb 21 2018, 07:42 PM
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QUOTE (x2lls @ Feb 21 2018, 06:30 PM) *
The fight against non stun is growing. This time, those that supply are getting on board. I would have no problem with donating via crowd funding to compensate the loss of business, if any.
I firmly believe the British public would support them wholesale(!).

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/halal-an...rmers-3hrjrkt36


And UNUSUALLY forum members of all poiltical persuasions agree on this. A sign indeed that it should be on the statute book.
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Andy Capp
post Feb 21 2018, 08:43 PM
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I don’t believe religion should come before animal welfare. We should only trade stunned animals. That’ll keep trawlermen busy.
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TallDarkAndHands...
post Feb 21 2018, 09:42 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Feb 21 2018, 08:43 PM) *
I don’t believe religion should come before animal welfare. We should only trade stunned animals. That’ll keep trawlermen busy.

You joke but I would also like to see the end of boiling lobsters alive. Its not necessary. And yes religion should not be part of this.
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x2lls
post Feb 22 2018, 12:06 AM
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I was right. The cause against the barbarity IS growing.



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SirWilliam
post Feb 22 2018, 09:21 AM
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QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Feb 21 2018, 09:42 PM) *
You joke but I would also like to see the end of boiling lobsters alive. Its not necessary. And yes religion should not be part of this.


Full agreement there TDH. No matter how nice crustaceans taste there is no excuse for boiling them alive. Even "humane" dispatching is questionable and I do find it nauseating that "celeb" types wax lyrical over their lobster thermidor with complete indifference to how it arrived on the plate.


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Andy Capp
post Feb 22 2018, 01:30 PM
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QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Feb 22 2018, 09:21 AM) *
Full agreement there TDH. No matter how nice crustaceans taste there is no excuse for boiling them alive. Even "humane" dispatching is questionable and I do find it nauseating that "celeb" types wax lyrical over their lobster thermidor with complete indifference to how it arrived on the plate.

Over time the logical conclusion would be that we shouldn’t be killing healthy creatures who pose no threat to us.
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SirWilliam
post Feb 22 2018, 04:10 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Feb 22 2018, 01:30 PM) *
Over time the login conclusion would be that we shouldn’t be killing healthy creatures who pose no threat to us.


This is the difference between farmed meat and that obtained from a wild source. As previously stated we are not all going to become vegetarian overnight but we can ensure that the meat reared for purpose is treated with the same respect as one's family dog. There is absolutely no reason why we should be taking anything from the wild in this day and age.
What the natural world' view on the eating or being eaten aspect is irrelevant to our position as, hopefully, we are sufficiently civilised to take an objective view.


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Andy Capp
post Feb 22 2018, 06:08 PM
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QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Feb 22 2018, 04:10 PM) *
This is the difference between farmed meat and that obtained from a wild source. As previously stated we are not all going to become vegetarian overnight but we can ensure that the meat reared for purpose is treated with the same respect as one's family dog. There is absolutely no reason why we should be taking anything from the wild in this day and age.
What the natural world' view on the eating or being eaten aspect is irrelevant to our position as, hopefully, we are sufficiently civilised to take an objective view.

Perhaps farming is inherently cruel. Perhaps we should only take from the wild.
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je suis Charlie
post Feb 22 2018, 07:13 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Feb 22 2018, 06:08 PM) *
Perhaps farming is inherently cruel. Perhaps we should only take from the wild.

AC, Newbury prepper! laugh.gif
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x2lls
post Feb 22 2018, 07:56 PM
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QUOTE (SirWilliam @ Feb 22 2018, 04:10 PM) *
This is the difference between farmed meat and that obtained from a wild source. As previously stated we are not all going to become vegetarian overnight but we can ensure that the meat reared for purpose is treated with the same respect as one's family dog. There is absolutely no reason why we should be taking anything from the wild in this day and age.
What the natural world' view on the eating or being eaten aspect is irrelevant to our position as, hopefully, we are sufficiently civilised to take an objective view.



I would say there are exceptions. For example, I know a farmer who raises sheep organically. He has a serious problem whereby rabbits are eating into his main food source for his sheep.
The rabbits MUST be removed, because if not, they will simply increase in number and become a plague. Given that, how would be best to remove them? Shooting and sending into the food chain or throw them away or poison? At some point, culling HAS to be considered.

How would members here deal with a rat infestation? Poison, shooting or trapping (Snap or humane capture), then what?


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SirWilliam
post Feb 22 2018, 08:18 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Feb 22 2018, 06:08 PM) *
Perhaps farming is inherently cruel. Perhaps we should only take from the wild.


An awful lot of people would go hungry if that plan was adopted. Apart for the ubiquitous rat, the wildlife population is in freefall and that's not down to the new found hui cuisine of the working class.
The whole reason we farm is to feed the population. Sort of quid pro quo arrangement; the great unwashed work in the local factory to earn money to give to the farmer in exchange for food, the farmer in turn works his b******s off in all weather because he is too proud to admit that had he been a little more astute he could have had a comfy career sat in front of a computer.
Don't underestimate the logistics involved with stocking the supermarket shelf , though I don't think the brexit bunch have given it any thought either. I said at the time that history will show that the biggest mistake the Blair regime committed was ripping the British farming industry apart and now we will soon be losing, (short term), the constant supply of cheap food and your average voter ain't gonna take to kindly to those in power at the time which doesn't bode well for the subject of this debate.


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Andy Capp
post Feb 22 2018, 08:49 PM
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So, if we want to eat... and have other nice things, we have to be ‘cruel’ to animals?
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Turin Machine
post Feb 22 2018, 09:38 PM
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QUOTE (x2lls @ Feb 22 2018, 07:56 PM) *
I would say there are exceptions. For example, I know a farmer who raises sheep organically. He has a serious problem whereby rabbits are eating into his main food source for his sheep.
The rabbits MUST be removed, because if not, they will simply increase in number and become a plague. Given that, how would be best to remove them? Shooting and sending into the food chain or throw them away or poison? At some point, culling HAS to be considered.

How would members here deal with a rat infestation? Poison, shooting or trapping (Snap or humane capture), then what?

Rabbits, .22 rifle with a good marksman. Simple, quick, humane. Alternatively, if you can find the burrows then ferrets do a good job.

Hares, best walked up with a 12 bore.

Rats, a good air rifle, again using a marksman, for the above reasons.

Deer, again, rifle.


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Turin Machine
post Feb 22 2018, 09:40 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Feb 22 2018, 08:49 PM) *
So, if we want to eat... and have other nice things, we have to be ‘cruel’ to animals?

There are arguably degrees of cruelty involved, give the animals a good life and a compassionate death. Bring back local slaughter houses.


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