Council tax only frozen for a year, who will pay next year??? Options

[Richard Garvie]

So Alan Law says the Conservertive administration should be congratulated for being able to "freeze" council tax for the coming year. Isn't it true that this has nothing to do with the local council, who have actually raised council tax by 2.5%??? It's only a grant from the Government that is freezing council tax for a year, but who will pay the extra 2.5% per tax payer next year?

That means that we face a council tax rise of at least 2.5% next year, so realistically it could be 3, 4 or even 5%??? Hardly the picture perfect image you present via the NWN then Cllr law!!!

[user23]

That means that we face a council tax rise of at least 2.5% next year, so realistically it could be 3, 4 or even 5%??? Hardly the picture perfect image you present via the NWN then Cllr law!!!

Why does it have to be at least 2.5% next year, if it's 2.5% this year?

I don't follow.

[Simon Kirby]

Why does it have to be at least 2.5% next year, if it's 2.5% this year?

I don't follow.

I guess the arithmatic is that the 2.5% government grant disappears and that creates a 2.5% deficit that needs to be filled.

Weren't we meant to be getting a 20% cut in council tax? Or am I getting confused? Was that a 20% cut in the grant which was meant to be covered by cuts?

[Richard Garvie]

I guess the arithmatic is that the 2.5% government grant disappears and that creates a 2.5% deficit that needs to be filled.

Weren't we meant to be getting a 20% cut in council tax? Or am I getting confused? Was that a 20% cut in the grant which was meant to be covered by cuts?

The grant from Central Government to West Berks is being cut by 28% over four years, so that money has to be found through savings and taxation.

As for point scoring, I was just highlighting that Alan Law claims that we should be praising the council for freezing council tax. Every council in the UK who raises council tax upto 2.5% will get a grant to cover it. The onlt thing is, with no grant next year, we will have to pay the difference. Unless of course the ruling administration cuts even further to ensure council tax in real terms falls by 2.5% from the coming year.

Either way, this council tax thing is happening because it is an election year. Has nothing to do with our local council in reality, and Alan Law is misleading people by claiming it's down to Graham Jones and Co.

[user23]

The grant from Central Government to West Berks is being cut by 28% over four years, so that money has to be found through savings and taxation.

As for point scoring, I was just highlighting that Alan Law claims that we should be praising the council for freezing council tax. Every council in the UK who raises council tax upto 2.5% will get a grant to cover it. The onlt thing is, with no grant next year, we will have to pay the difference. Unless of course the ruling administration cuts even further to ensure council tax in real terms falls by 2.5% from the coming year.

Either way, this council tax thing is happening because it is an election year. Has nothing to do with our local council in reality, and Alan Law is misleading people by claiming it's down to Graham Jones and Co.

What do you mean "it is an election year"?

Last year was an election year too.

[Richard Garvie]

What do you mean "it is an election year"?

Last year was an election year too.

Yeah, and what was the average council tax rise in the UK last year?

[dannyboy]

Yeah, and what was the average council tax rise in the UK last year?

I think it was under 2% - lowest increase since '93.

[Richard Garvie]

I think it was under 2% - lowest increase since '93.

Forget this year because of the locals, but what do you think the average increase will be next year if there isn't a general election?

[dannyboy]

Forget this year because of the locals, but what do you think the average increase will be next year if there isn't a general election?

Forget this year ? You asked the bloody question about last year! Under 2% was for 2009/2010.

Next year - no idea. an impossible question to ask. IF I was being paid a nice lump sum to come up with some economic forecasts I'd have to do some research & then I might be able to make an estimate.

But with the price of Brent Crude on the up & up ( 3 year high today ) purely on the possibility Libya's oil might stop flowing, who can tell?

[Richard Garvie]

Forget this year ? You asked the bloody question about last year! Under 2% was for 2009/2010.

Next year - no idea. an impossible question to ask. IF I was being paid a nice lump sum to come up with some economic forecasts I'd have to do some research & then I might be able to make an estimate.

But with the price of Brent Crude on the up & up ( 3 year high today ) purely on the possibility Libya's oil might stop flowing, who can tell?

What I meant was, it was under 2% last year as an election year. This year is 2.5% in West Berks but the UK average isn't important as we've established that a government grant is paying for any increase upto 2.5% so would be hard to establish the UK average at present until all councils have published budgets etc. Next year is a non election year, I would suspect there will be a much higher average next year.

[user23]

What I meant was, it was under 2% last year as an election year. This year is 2.5% in West Berks but the UK average isn't important as we've established that a government grant is paying for any increase upto 2.5% so would be hard to establish the UK average at present until all councils have published budgets etc. Next year is a non election year, I would suspect there will be a much higher average next year.

Next year is an election year too. The next year with no scheduled elections is 2013.

[Richard Garvie]

Next year is an election year too. The next year with no scheduled elections is 2013.

Here in West Berks, we don't have any locals or general elections though, do we?

[user23]

Here in West Berks, we don't have any locals or general elections though, do we?

No, but you were saying that "Every council in the UK who raises council tax up to 2.5% will get a grant to cover it." because this year was an election year.

I was pointing out, so is next year too.

[Richard Garvie]

No, but you were saying that "Every council in the UK who raises council tax up to 2.5% will get a grant to cover it." because this year was an election year.

I was pointing out, so is next year too.

My point still stands.

[user23]

My point still stands.

You said "Every council in the UK who raises council tax up to 2.5% will get a grant to cover it." and inferred that this wouldn't be the case next year because you thought there weren't any elections planned.

This of course isn't true, there are local elections next year.

[Richard Garvie]

You said "Every council in the UK who raises council tax up to 2.5% will get a grant to cover it." and inferred that this wouldn't be the case next year because you thought there weren't any elections planned.

This of course isn't true, there are local elections next year.

But not here there isn't.

[user23]

But not here there isn't.

Not only did you say "Every council in the UK who raises council tax up to 2.5% will get a grant to cover it"

You were clearly talking about the situation nationally as you actually said "Has nothing to do with our local council in reality".

Looks like your point scoring has resulted in another gaffe.

[Richard Garvie]

Not only did you say "Every council in the UK who raises council tax up to 2.5% will get a grant to cover it"

You were clearly talking about the situation nationally as you actually said "Has nothing to do with our local council in reality".

Looks like your point scoring has resulted in another gaffe.

Alan Law is the one publishing letters taking the credit for the council tax freeze in West Berkshire. So yes, I was talking about the national situation with regards to the council tax freeze having nothing to do with Jones, Law and Co. So where is the gaffe? I think our council has tried to mislead the public yet again!!!

[NWNREADER]

Alan Law is the one publishing letters taking the credit for the council tax freeze in West Berkshire. So yes, I was talking about the national situation with regards to the council tax freeze having nothing to do with Jones, Law and Co. So where is the gaffe? I think our council has tried to mislead the public yet again!!!

Personal choice, but I really do not like the way you wriggle and twist, while decrying anyone else who does other than instantly admit error, misunderstanding or the like.

Every majority political figure takes the credit for good things - as they see them. Under the current environment many councils might well increase the level of Council Tax - even if that meant losing access to a grant - in order to maintain a service etc.

Every minority figure seeks to rubbish anything good-ish that happens. If a majority figure has to accept they are not always the true architect of the good, then the other side sometimes have to accept their point is not valid, or at least not to the extent they would like.

[Richard Garvie]

Personal choice, but I really do not like the way you wriggle and twist, while decrying anyone else who does other than instantly admit error, misunderstanding or the like.

Every majority political figure takes the credit for good things - as they see them. Under the current environment many councils might well increase the level of Council Tax - even if that meant losing access to a grant - in order to maintain a service etc.

Every minority figure seeks to rubbish anything good-ish that happens. If a majority figure has to accept they are not always the true architect of the good, then the other side sometimes have to accept their point is not valid, or at least not to the extent they would like.

What are you talking about? I've said from the outset that Alan Law was wrong to take credit for something the government have done. I suggested it was because it is an election year, which it is. Everyone pretty much has local elections this year, and it's also the devolved governments elections too (Scotland, Wales, N.I etc.). Last year was a general election. Two big years. Next year is hardly an election year, as very few people in comparison will be electing. More User23 spin, and the council sympathisers are swallowing it up.

Alan Law said the council should be praised for freezing council tax when actually it has nothing to do with the council, and we will all probably end up paying more than the 2.5% increase next year. Yet again, Alan Law and the Conservatives misleading the public in the media.

[NWNREADER]

What are you talking about? I've said from the outset that Alan Law was wrong to take credit for something the government have done. I suggested it was because it is an election year, which it is. Everyone pretty much has local elections this year, and it's also the devolved governments elections too (Scotland, Wales, N.I etc.). Last year was a general election. Two big years. Next year is hardly an election year, as very few people in comparison will be electing. More User23 spin, and the council sympathisers are swallowing it up.

Alan Law said the council should be praised for freezing council tax when actually it has nothing to do with the council, and we will all probably end up paying more than the 2.5% increase next year. Yet again, Alan Law and the Conservatives misleading the public in the media.

You doubtless have better information than I, but as I understand the Govt give up to a 2.5% grant as long as Councils keep their rise below 2.5% - thus a nil increase for the year. If a council exceeded 2.5% the whole cost would fall on the local tax payer. Thus a Council that keeps to 2.5% can claim a credit for doing so (although the 'grant' comes from citizens pockets also....). It seems to me, if WBC majority party wanted to play with elections, they could take a hit this year and ride the storm then feed back in a reduction next year to try and win votes.

Guesses as to next year are worthless, as are so-called promises as to what a minority group would do if they were the majority.

[Richard Garvie]

You doubtless have better information than I, but as I understand the Govt give up to a 2.5% grant as long as Councils keep their rise below 2.5% - thus a nil increase for the year. If a council exceeded 2.5% the whole cost would fall on the local tax payer. Thus a Council that keeps to 2.5% can claim a credit for doing so (although the 'grant' comes from citizens pockets also....). It seems to me, if WBC majority party wanted to play with elections, they could take a hit this year and ride the storm then feed back in a reduction next year to try and win votes.

Guesses as to next year are worthless, as are so-called promises as to what a minority group would do if they were the majority.

Yes, but with a further reduction of £10-12m next year (grant has already been allocated), we are facing higher council tax and further cuts in service. What I would like to see is each party publishing a four year plan of how they at least plan to deal with the expected £40 reduction in settlement over that period.

Why would anyone be trying to win votes in West Berkshire next year? Our local elections are on a four year cycle, so we should expect the council and mp to now be in place until 2015 after this may.

[dannyboy]

Yes, but with a further reduction of £10-12m next year (grant has already been allocated), we are facing higher council tax and further cuts in service. What I would like to see is each party publishing a four year plan of how they at least plan to deal with the expected £40 reduction in settlement over that period.

Why would anyone be trying to win votes in West Berkshire next year? Our local elections are on a four year cycle, so we should expect the council and mp to now be in place until 2015 after this may.

Maybe the Labour party could start the ball rolling?

[Richard Garvie]

Maybe the Labour party could start the ball rolling?

Around 24-48 hours after we recieve the budget book for the coming financial year. You have my word.

[NWNREADER]

Around 24-48 hours after we recieve the budget book for the coming financial year. You have my word.

As mentioned earlier (but ignored) there is no need to wait for the budget book to plan a strategy. The income formula is known, the standard costs of services and activities are known.

I think you also mentioned elsewhere you post on here as an individual......