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Elected Mayor Petition |
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Jan 9 2011, 12:16 PM
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I just wanted to ask if any of those who support the mayor system would like to help with a petition? This is not a party political petition, as far as I know two other political parties have requested information about forcing a referendum. Hundreds of people have already signed up, and the target date for submission is early February. I am personally planning to do Hungerford this Saturday with some colleagues, and Newbury on Friday and Saturday evening. There will be people in Newbury on Saturday daytime too.
The purpose of this petition is not because it's neccessarily my view or anyone in the Labour Party locally. We have decided to carry out this petition after the current administration refused to carry out a proper consultation on the leadership models available to the council. In correspondance with the leader of the council, I requested that the leadership decision be delayed so that a proper consultation could be carried out. I was told to "include it in my manifesto if it is something I care about". This shouldn't be about what I think, or what Graham Jones believes. There is a lot of support for the mayor option and it's only right that the general public should be allowed to have their views heard.
I would like to think all parties will be supportive of staging this referendum, especially the Lib Dems who are supposedly all for proportional representation. An elected mayor system would mean that the leader of the council would be elected by a large percentage of the district rather than 800 votes in one ward. The directly elected leader would also be accountable for when things go wrong, unlike at present when nobody seems to be accountable. Do you think Graham Jones would have closed the Ormonde Centre and Hillcroft House if he was accountable to the whole district? No, I don't think so either.
If you are available to assist with the petition, my mobile number is 07593 278690 or you can email richard.garvie@googlemail.com
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Replies
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Jan 10 2011, 04:51 PM
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QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 04:47 PM) Adopting a mayor in West Berkshire might actually save money if you look at the facts. The only additional cost is the referendum, which would have been avoided if the council had conducted a proper consultation. It's not like these points were not made to Graham Jones before the strong leader model was adopted, he could have taken action then but refused. One thing I do know is that this current administration is not transparent or accountable to anyone. Might save money? I can't see how that can be. Accountability has a cost implication. Forget the cost of the referendum & attempting to score a few points with the repetitious mentioning of the consultation.
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Jan 10 2011, 04:56 PM
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QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 10 2011, 04:51 PM) Might save money?
I can't see how that can be. Accountability has a cost implication.
Forget the cost of the referendum & attempting to score a few points with the repetitious mentioning of the consultation. You brought up the cost of the referendum. The mayor position would be more than covered by abolishing the role of Chairman of the Council, the costs that go with that position and also using the expenses currently given to the leader of the council. From rough calculations, we would need to pay a mayor over £70,000 a year before it cost us money.
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Jan 10 2011, 05:02 PM
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QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 04:56 PM) You brought up the cost of the referendum. The mayor position would be more than covered by abolishing the role of Chairman of the Council, the costs that go with that position and also using the expenses currently given to the leader of the council. From rough calculations, we would need to pay a mayor over £70,000 a year before it cost us money. When I said cost I was refering to the cost of an accountable Mayor. You decided to assume I was on about the cost of the referendum. I'm not on about the cost of paying a mayor either. So what about the cost when your accountable Mayor has to be recalled? When the electorate wants answers & enquiries are set up? Sounds to me like more jobs for layer upon layer of consultants & bureaucrats.
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Jan 10 2011, 05:13 PM
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QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 10 2011, 05:02 PM) When I said cost I was refering to the cost of an accountable Mayor. You decided to assume I was on about the cost of the referendum. I'm not on about the cost of paying a mayor either.
So what about the cost when your accountable Mayor has to be recalled? When the electorate wants answers & enquiries are set up? Sounds to me like more jobs for layer upon layer of consultants & bureaucrats. But you did initially use cost as an argument against the mayor option: QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 9 2011, 05:27 PM) And you really think wasting money on a Mayorial election will put an end to lurching from one crisis to another? A Mayor would only be recalled for a reason, 10% of the electorate need to request it. So unless the mayor lied like the current administration, or fudged consultations like the current administration or even axed vital frontline services without consultation (see where I'm going with this?), the mayor would not need to be recalled. It's a mechanism used to recall a Mayor as a last resort, if there is no other option. At present, the majority of the council can recall a strong leader, but what chance is there of 32 Conservatives recalling Graham Jones? With only 16 opposition members at present, the Conservatives can do what they like, with no consequence.
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Jan 10 2011, 05:22 PM
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QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 05:13 PM) But you did initially use cost as an argument against the mayor option: Yes - the cost of having accountability. QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 05:13 PM) A Mayor would only be recalled for a reason, 10% of the electorate need to request it. So unless the mayor lied like the current administration, or fudged consultations like the current administration or even axed vital frontline services without consultation (see where I'm going with this?), the mayor would not need to be recalled. It's a mechanism used to recall a Mayor as a last resort, if there is no other option. At present, the majority of the council can recall a strong leader, but what chance is there of 32 Conservatives recalling Graham Jones? With only 16 opposition members at present, the Conservatives can do what they like, with no consequence. I'm glad you finally agree there would be a cost. You really think you can please all the people all the time? Accountability = cost = less cash for 'front line services' = more cuts. No thanks. If ther was a bottomless pit of cash for councils to spend, then I'm sure they'd not have 'lied' , or 'fudged' or 'axed' so even if your elected Mayor didn't put a foot wrong & never incured the wrath of 10% of the electorate there would still be a cost implication. Councils don't sit in their ivory towers like despots dreaming up new ways to **** the local population, They do the best job they can, with the cash they can.
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Jan 10 2011, 05:28 PM
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QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 10 2011, 05:22 PM) I'm glad you finally agree there would be a cost. You really think you can please all the people all the time? Accountability = cost = less cash for 'front line services' = more cuts. No thanks. The cost of a referendum is worth it if it gives the public a chance to have there say. Once again, if the consulation had been conducted properly, there would not be the extra cost. The running costs of having an elected mayor versus strong leader and chairman are less. So maybe over a few years, the money saved will pay for the referendum?
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Posts in this topic
Richard Garvie Elected Mayor Petition Jan 9 2011, 12:16 PM dannyboy What is the cost to the Taxpayer? Jan 9 2011, 12:27 PM Richard Garvie I shouldn't believe it would cost much more if... Jan 9 2011, 01:00 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 01:00... Jan 9 2011, 01:08 PM Richard Garvie Yes, because the consultation was fudged and the l... Jan 9 2011, 01:19 PM Cognosco QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 01:19... Jan 9 2011, 01:59 PM user23 No prizes for guessing who'll be the first to ... Jan 9 2011, 02:23 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (user23 @ Jan 9 2011, 02:23 PM) No ... Jan 9 2011, 02:36 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 02:36... Jan 9 2011, 03:07 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (user23 @ Jan 9 2011, 03:07 PM) Eve... Jan 9 2011, 03:11 PM Cognosco QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 02:36... Jan 9 2011, 04:57 PM user23 QUOTE (Cognosco @ Jan 9 2011, 04:57 PM) Q... Jan 9 2011, 04:58 PM Cognosco QUOTE (user23 @ Jan 9 2011, 04:58 PM) If ... Jan 9 2011, 05:37 PM dannyboy The problem is all that would happen in West Berks... Jan 9 2011, 02:42 PM Richard Garvie If there was a Conservative Mayor elected by West ... Jan 9 2011, 02:53 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 02:53... Jan 9 2011, 02:56 PM Richard Garvie Electing a mayor would ensure more transparency an... Jan 9 2011, 03:09 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 03:09... Jan 9 2011, 05:24 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 05:24... Jan 9 2011, 05:26 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (user23 @ Jan 9 2011, 05:26 PM) Doe... Jan 9 2011, 05:32 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 05:32... Jan 9 2011, 05:51 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (user23 @ Jan 9 2011, 05:51 PM) Wha... Jan 9 2011, 06:02 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 06:02... Jan 9 2011, 06:09 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 05:24... Jan 9 2011, 05:27 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 9 2011, 05:27 PM) N... Jan 9 2011, 05:33 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 05:33... Jan 9 2011, 05:39 PM JeffG QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 03:09... Jan 9 2011, 07:07 PM user23 It's fairly obvious what you're doing. You... Jan 9 2011, 03:14 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (user23 @ Jan 9 2011, 03:14 PM) It... Jan 9 2011, 03:30 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 03:30... Jan 9 2011, 03:32 PM Richard Garvie Talking of changing the subject, you never answere... Jan 9 2011, 03:52 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 03:52... Jan 9 2011, 05:15 PM Richard Garvie Am I the leader of the party? If I was the leader ... Jan 9 2011, 03:43 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 03:43... Jan 9 2011, 03:44 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 03:43... Jan 9 2011, 03:49 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 03:49... Jan 9 2011, 03:52 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (user23 @ Jan 9 2011, 03:52 PM) Rig... Jan 9 2011, 03:55 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 03:55... Jan 9 2011, 03:58 PM Richard Garvie Not at all. But as a candidate to the electorate, ... Jan 9 2011, 04:04 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 04:04... Jan 9 2011, 04:07 PM Richard Garvie Not at all. If the party aren't happy with wha... Jan 9 2011, 04:09 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 04:09... Jan 9 2011, 04:26 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (user23 @ Jan 9 2011, 04:26 PM) Wha... Jan 9 2011, 04:29 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 04:29... Jan 9 2011, 04:42 PM Richard Garvie Depends where you are sitting. The Labour Party wi... Jan 9 2011, 04:46 PM Richard Garvie First of all, you are just presuming that I would ... Jan 9 2011, 05:46 PM Richard Garvie As you can see by the text you have quoted, I don... Jan 9 2011, 06:21 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 06:21... Jan 9 2011, 06:56 PM Richard Garvie The elected mayor option allows the possibility of... Jan 9 2011, 07:25 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 07:25... Jan 9 2011, 07:49 PM Richard Garvie Based on the population, it could cost around £25,... Jan 9 2011, 08:12 PM dannyboy who can then appoint whoever he or she likes in th... Jan 9 2011, 08:14 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 9 2011, 08:14 PM) ... Jan 9 2011, 08:17 PM user23 QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 08:17... Jan 9 2011, 08:22 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 9 2011, 08:17... Jan 10 2011, 12:53 AM TallDarkAndHandsome Chance of a referendum on Europe / Human Rights Ac... Jan 10 2011, 10:06 AM Richard Garvie QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Jan 10 2011, 10... Jan 10 2011, 11:34 AM dannyboy So the public have their say & we end up with ... Jan 10 2011, 11:49 AM Squelchy QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ Jan 10 2011, 10... Jan 10 2011, 02:13 PM On the edge How did the saying go, was it '..and represent... Jan 10 2011, 03:05 PM kellsbells iS IT FAIR THAT SUPPOSEDLY APOLITICAL COUNCIL OFFI... Jan 9 2011, 08:14 PM NWNREADER A lot af waffle has been spouted by politicians in... Jan 9 2011, 09:07 PM Iommi QUOTE (NWNREADER @ Jan 9 2011, 09:07 PM) ... Jan 10 2011, 10:51 AM Richard Garvie Not at all, you are missing the fact that the lead... Jan 10 2011, 11:58 AM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 11:5... Jan 10 2011, 12:01 PM Richard Garvie The cost of the mayor would be absorbed by additio... Jan 10 2011, 12:33 PM dannyboy So not really accountable then. Unless you are thi... Jan 10 2011, 12:38 PM blackdog QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 10 2011, 12:38 PM) ... Jan 10 2011, 01:38 PM dannyboy QUOTE (blackdog @ Jan 10 2011, 01:38 PM) ... Jan 10 2011, 01:47 PM On the edge QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 10 2011, 01:47 PM) ... Jan 10 2011, 03:07 PM dannyboy QUOTE (On the edge @ Jan 10 2011, 03:07 P... Jan 10 2011, 03:09 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 10 2011, 03:09 PM) ... Jan 10 2011, 03:23 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 03:2... Jan 10 2011, 04:01 PM Iommi QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 10 2011, 04:01 PM) ... Jan 10 2011, 04:11 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Iommi @ Jan 10 2011, 04:11 PM) Is ... Jan 10 2011, 04:15 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 10 2011, 04:01 PM) ... Jan 10 2011, 04:29 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 04:2... Jan 10 2011, 04:34 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (Bartholomew @ Jan 9 2011, 03:54 PM... Jan 10 2011, 04:33 PM dannyboy QUOTE (On the edge @ Jan 10 2011, 03:07 P... Jan 10 2011, 03:09 PM Iommi Like you though, I don't necessarily trust the... Jan 10 2011, 04:20 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Iommi @ Jan 10 2011, 04:20 PM) Lik... Jan 10 2011, 04:31 PM Richard Garvie But it shouldn't be a job for the boys, and th... Jan 10 2011, 04:38 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 04:3... Jan 10 2011, 04:42 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 05:2... Jan 10 2011, 05:32 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 10 2011, 05:32 PM) ... Jan 10 2011, 05:36 PM Iommi I think the only way democracy in politics would i... Jan 10 2011, 04:49 PM Darren Why only 10% to "recall"?
Surely, it ha... Jan 10 2011, 05:27 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (Darren @ Jan 10 2011, 05:27 PM) Wh... Jan 10 2011, 05:32 PM dannyboy QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 05:3... Jan 10 2011, 05:33 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (dannyboy @ Jan 10 2011, 05:33 PM) ... Jan 10 2011, 05:35 PM Darren QUOTE (Richard Garvie @ Jan 10 2011, 05:3... Jan 10 2011, 05:40 PM Richard Garvie QUOTE (Darren @ Jan 10 2011, 05:40 PM) Bu... Jan 10 2011, 06:00 PM Iommi Yes, would 10% represent ~25% of the local council... Jan 10 2011, 06:03 PM
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