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> Europe - In or Out, Straw Poll for Forumisters
On the edge
post Mar 4 2016, 08:48 AM
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Yes, I think the car firms reflect my feelings exactly. BMW won't want to loose it's easy UK market for their products. Honda and Toyota on the other hand see us when out, as another South Korea, a cheap place to manufacture with easy labour laws; so easily able to sell in Europe on price.



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Biker1
post Mar 4 2016, 09:02 AM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Mar 3 2016, 09:53 PM) *
The latest NWN NewburyToday data:

Remain 56%
Leave 36%
I haven't made my mind up yet 6%
I won't be voting 1%

This is what I think will play out in the election.

That's only 99%! unsure.gif
Similar to the amount of household germs we only ever seem to be able to kill!
That 1% could be the killer!! tongue.gif
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blackdog
post Mar 4 2016, 12:06 PM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ Mar 3 2016, 08:53 PM) *
The latest NWN NewburyToday data:

Remain 56%
Leave 36%
I haven't made my mind up yet 6%
I won't be voting 1%

This is what I think will play out in the election.


I suspect the not voting percentage will be considerably higher than 1%!
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Andy Capp
post Mar 4 2016, 12:15 PM
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QUOTE (blackdog @ Mar 4 2016, 12:06 PM) *
I suspect the not voting percentage will be considerably higher than 1%!

Yes, I posted that for completeness, but I believe the in or out will be that proportion.
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Andy Capp
post Mar 4 2016, 12:16 PM
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Funny how Rt Hon Cameron PM was prepared to take us out of the Union unless he got what he wanted, yet now decides leaving would be bad for the country.
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Biker1
post Apr 18 2016, 04:45 PM
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Just in case anyone was wondering what to do with Cameron's propaganda leaflet.

How to Return the Government's EU Referendum Propaganda Leaflet
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TallDarkAndHands...
post May 12 2016, 03:28 PM
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Just in case anyone's in any doubt on how to vote apparently if we vote leave the Sun is going to explode
and all life on Earth will be extinguished.


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je suis Charlie
post May 12 2016, 04:12 PM
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QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 12 2016, 04:28 PM) *
Just in case anyone's in any doubt on how to vote apparently if we vote leave the Sun is going to explode
and all life on Earth will be extinguished.

I heard, plagues of locusts O'er the Earth. With a outside chance of total cessation of spinning of said Earth.
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blackdog
post May 12 2016, 06:21 PM
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And if we vote to stay we will all have to speak German and drive on the other side of the road as of the following Thursday, sorry Donnerstag.
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je suis Charlie
post May 12 2016, 06:26 PM
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QUOTE (blackdog @ May 12 2016, 07:21 PM) *
And if we vote to stay we will all have to speak German and drive on the other side of the road as of the following Thursday, sorry Donnerstag.

Ja! Das ist gut!
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Biker1
post May 13 2016, 08:33 AM
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QUOTE (TallDarkAndHandsome @ May 12 2016, 04:28 PM) *
Just in case anyone's in any doubt on how to vote apparently if we vote leave the Sun is going to explode
and all life on Earth will be extinguished.

Now you've let the cat out of the bag.
Cameron was saving that one for closer to polling day!! laugh.gif
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Biker1
post May 13 2016, 08:58 AM
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How about a few predictions for fun then?
I reckon 59% - 41% to stay in.
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Turin Machine
post May 13 2016, 09:02 AM
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We'll stay by about 63% the public will always stay with what they know. Its cold and scary out there! Muppets.


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Berkshirelad
post May 13 2016, 10:55 AM
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QUOTE (Turin Machine @ May 13 2016, 10:02 AM) *
We'll stay by about 63% the public will always stay with what they know. Its cold and scary out there! Muppets.


The herd will always resist change.

I am old enough to remember life before we joined the EEC. I voted yes in the following referendum. We then turned our backs on trade with the Commonwealth.

Having lived through the morphing of a Common Market into a self-aggrandising Superstate, my strong inclination is to vote for out.

There are a couple of salient points that I feel need to be at least mentioned.

  1. European peace has not been guaranteed by the existence of the EU, but by NATO. The bitter recriminations between nations over the increasingly likely collapse of the Eurozone is more ike to cause war, as is the EU's foolhardiness over Ukraine etc.
  2. The scare-mongering about the 'Jungle' moving to Dover is just that. The agreement in place is an Anglo-French bi-lateral agreement and absolutely nothing to do with the EU; and to establish another jungle, they would first need to get through Border Control.
  3. It is a myth that you need a trade agreement in order to trade. We trade very well with the US despite having no formal agreement. The German motor
    manufacturers will not give up their UK market and have enough power to force the German government to veto a EU retaliatory action on trade
  4. The EU's control of VAT rates is an insult. The reason for the 'tampon feud' is that the UK government cannot remove the VAT on sanitary towels without the agreement of all EU member states
  5. Finally, and very personally, I live in a constitutional monarchy and resent being addressed as a citizen when I have no wish to be one. Just too 1984!
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Andy Capp
post May 13 2016, 01:05 PM
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60/40 to Remain, but will vote Brexit.
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Biker1
post May 13 2016, 09:42 PM
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QUOTE (Turin Machine @ May 13 2016, 10:02 AM) *
We'll stay by about 63% the public will always stay with what they know. Its cold and scary out there! Muppets.

You say "what they know" but whether we remain or leave the future is equally unknown.
Not sure Bremain will be as high as 63%. Surely not that many are gullible enough to fall for the scare tactics.
I think one of the worst scenarios would be a small majority either way.
For example, would Cameron leave on a 51% vote to do so? His political career, I think, depends on a vote to remain, otherwise enter Boris!
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Andy Capp
post May 13 2016, 10:28 PM
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If Brexit wins I expect another referendum with a new deal.
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TallDarkAndHands...
post May 14 2016, 06:12 AM
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QUOTE (Andy Capp @ May 13 2016, 11:28 PM) *
If Brexit wins I expect another referendum with a new deal.


And that is one reason why I shall be voting brexit.
Merkel will blink and we shall get reform.
Proper reform. Not Dave's dodgy deal.
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Simon Kirby
post May 14 2016, 07:16 AM
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55:45 in favour of Brexit, with a voter turn-out of less than 50%.

I remain undecided.

For the sake of peace and international cooperation I want Blighty to have a strong relationship with its international neighbours, but I wouldn't limit that to European countries and the UN already fills that role and the EU actually weakens the role of the UN by conflating international cooperation with trade. I also agree that Nato has preserved the peace in Europe and that the EU has no defence role and undermines Nato and national sovereignty by conflating trade with defence. So that then leaves the EU's role as a trade regulator, but that is little more than a protection racket run by a self-serving and unaccountable eurocracy. At the end of the day I believe a state should be free to impose what import and export duties it pleases, set its own standards for product quality and animal welfare and control its borders how it likes. I have some concerns that I'd personally agree with the choices that the UK state might otherwise make for itself if it wasn't compelled by its EU membership, and that is the essential paradox, but if I were to vote with my head I'd be voting Brexit.


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Simon Kirby
post May 14 2016, 07:29 AM
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Here is the UN declaration on human rights, and I would feel more comfortable voting to leave the EU if I could have any hope that the UK would remain a liberal democracy and that the right wouldn't immediately aggitate to suspend habeus corpus and reintroduce the ducking stool.


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